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Teddy Bridgewater Named Starting QB

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  • Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post

    while the play calling is indeed atrocious, the QB cant convert on 3rd and 5+. I think that's why he abandons the run so fast. He knows the QB cant score or keep the offense on the field, so he's situationally panicking and forcing the issue.
    I don’t disagree and meant more of a “whatever” if the team limps into the playoffs. Part of it would depend on how Teddy plays the rest of the season. If he actually plays well and truly distinguishes himself, that might be different (emphasis on might). I don’t think that’s likely - he’s been in the league long enough to know how he plays.


    Comment


    • Originally posted by Humberg View Post

      I disagree. Lock was one of the worst QBs in the league last year. The year before Keenum was also in the lower tiers. Siemien same. And Lynch was…. well difficult to even describe.

      The first three games this year were against very poor quality teams. If you look at the last two games Teddy ranks in the lower quartile of quarterbacks for those weeks with a handful of rookies on the list below him.

      You are wrongly interpreting our desire for legit starting quarterback play as desire to get an elite quarterback. What we are asking for is not that rare. In fact, last year there were 31 teams who had a better situation at quarterback than us. In fact, we are the rarity. In fact it’s actually rare to be as bad at managing the quarterback position as the Broncos have been. If it was as common to be in our situation as you suggest, it wouldn’t be a passing league. We are the (nightmare) unicorn.

      And while you make a very eloquent and cogent argument regarding the coaching that I will applaud, it’s absolutely necessary to address the quarterback situation as well, the most important position in all of football, if we want to be a winning football team.
      The qb situation has been even worse than you described. Maybe it was intentional but you did not list Flacco before Keenum. No mention of the Return of Oz. Shoot go back before PM and we talking about Orton and Cutler.

      I do not see fans asking for a qb good enough I see them asking for the next Mahomes Allen and Jackson. I see them wanting Rodgers. This has been far more common in posts than any concept of let's just get better at Qb but we also need to build a team around the Qb including coaching.

      My point was we may need to figure out how to win without one of the 5 people on the planet who can display the elite skills all year long and including the playoffs..

      I do think Teddy is maybe good enough to get into the playoffs but it would take an exceptional team to carry him to the Championship. I would be ok with Teddy as a backup making backup money but we need to find a better Starter.
      Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Humberg View Post

        I disagree. Lock was one of the worst QBs in the league last year. The year before Keenum was also in the lower tiers. Siemien same. And Lynch was…. well difficult to even describe.

        The first three games this year were against very poor quality teams. If you look at the last two games Teddy ranks in the lower quartile of quarterbacks for those weeks with a handful of rookies on the list below him.

        You are wrongly interpreting our desire for legit starting quarterback play as desire to get an elite quarterback. What we are asking for is not that rare. In fact, last year there were 31 teams who had a better situation at quarterback than us. In fact, we are the rarity. In fact it’s actually rare to be as bad at managing the quarterback position as the Broncos have been. If it was as common to be in our situation as you suggest, it wouldn’t be a passing league. We are the (nightmare) unicorn.

        And while you make a very eloquent and cogent argument regarding the coaching that I will applaud, it’s absolutely necessary to address the quarterback situation as well, the most important position in all of football, if we want to be a winning football team.
        While QB is a long term issue, I don’t think we can get it fixed just by cycling through rookies and vets until we get it right. Coaching is extremely important and we’ll be hard pressed to get it right with a rookie and a bad play caller. Lock may very well be a bad QB but Scangerello got results out of him. Scangerello was atrocious with Flacco, most likely due to Flacco’s limited mobility shortening the playbook. So while Scangerello may have been bad, I though he improved a lot with Lock and we had a good situation where we could see an inexperienced QB/OC pair grow together. And with the offensive scheme from Scangerello’s coaching tree being QB friendly I think we would’ve got better results than what we’ve seen with Shurmur.

        Shurmur is very aggressive in the pass game and thus far he seems unwilling to fit his scheme to his players. His scheme requires a lot to be successful. The WRs have to be good to excellent route runners and you need at least one if not two guys to take the top off. On top of that you need an oline that can protect long enough for these long developing concepts. His staple seems to be the dig play with the slot guy running a deep crossing route and the outside WR running a deep in route. The deep in is almost always the primary target and it takes forever to come open with Sutton/Patrick. At QB you need a guy that can correctly identify defense pre and post snap very quickly as well as progress through his reads extremely quickly while having the ability to manipulate the pocket, and then to top it all of the QB has to have excellent chemistry with his targets because of how the progressions are set up. That’s a lot to ask for from a young QB and it’s a big reason why Lock struggled so much vs Scangerello who gave him a ton of half field reads off of level concepts where he’d have multiple guys in his field of vision and he really only had to read one defender and make the pass off that defenders decision.

        As long as Shurmur is calling the plays we won’t be developing any young QBs, we will just be ruining them. His offense is great in theory but it’s better suited for madden than the NFL. If we want to get the QB position right we have to get the OC spot right. Young QBs need a friendly offense, they need to be spoon fed, not thrown to the fire. Not every QB gets a cheat code in Tyreek Hill and the best TE in the league. This is still an incredibly young offense with no starter outside of Bolles having started more than 3 seasons with the team. This offense is designed for a group of guys that have been together awhile as well as all the other prerequisites I mentioned earlier. There’s maybe a handful of QBs that could come in and run this offense as it is and be successful. The concepts are repetitive with little to no counter action being called off of them, everything takes a long time to develop including the run plays which features more counters, stretches, and tosses than I’d like to see especially when our RBs aren’t super shifty or have incredible acceleration. They’re powerful and can break away if they get enough space but they aren’t super explosive.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post

          while the play calling is indeed atrocious, the QB cant convert on 3rd and 5+. I think that's why he abandons the run so fast. He knows the QB cant score or keep the offense on the field, so he's situationally panicking and forcing the issue.
          I herd someone say our average third down to go is one of the worst in the NFL distance wise.

          Any qb is going to struggle with that.

          We need a more efficient and effective offense no matter who the QB is. I do not have the stats at work but there have been many stats that show how often Shurmur has been leading a long distance low percentage of success offense since he has been in Denver. Last presser I watched his reply to how bad the offense was repeating how we missed on Long passes....yea Shurnur we are going to miss more long passes than we make.
          Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

          Comment


          • Originally posted by beastlyskronk View Post

            While QB is a long term issue, I don’t think we can get it fixed just by cycling through rookies and vets until we get it right. Coaching is extremely important and we’ll be hard pressed to get it right with a rookie and a bad play caller. Lock may very well be a bad QB but Scangerello got results out of him. Scangerello was atrocious with Flacco, most likely due to Flacco’s limited mobility shortening the playbook. So while Scangerello may have been bad, I though he improved a lot with Lock and we had a good situation where we could see an inexperienced QB/OC pair grow together. And with the offensive scheme from Scangerello’s coaching tree being QB friendly I think we would’ve got better results than what we’ve seen with Shurmur.

            Shurmur is very aggressive in the pass game and thus far he seems unwilling to fit his scheme to his players. His scheme requires a lot to be successful. The WRs have to be good to excellent route runners and you need at least one if not two guys to take the top off. On top of that you need an oline that can protect long enough for these long developing concepts. His staple seems to be the dig play with the slot guy running a deep crossing route and the outside WR running a deep in route. The deep in is almost always the primary target and it takes forever to come open with Sutton/Patrick. At QB you need a guy that can correctly identify defense pre and post snap very quickly as well as progress through his reads extremely quickly while having the ability to manipulate the pocket, and then to top it all of the QB has to have excellent chemistry with his targets because of how the progressions are set up. That’s a lot to ask for from a young QB and it’s a big reason why Lock struggled so much vs Scangerello who gave him a ton of half field reads off of level concepts where he’d have multiple guys in his field of vision and he really only had to read one defender and make the pass off that defenders decision.

            As long as Shurmur is calling the plays we won’t be developing any young QBs, we will just be ruining them. His offense is great in theory but it’s better suited for madden than the NFL. If we want to get the QB position right we have to get the OC spot right. Young QBs need a friendly offense, they need to be spoon fed, not thrown to the fire. Not every QB gets a cheat code in Tyreek Hill and the best TE in the league. This is still an incredibly young offense with no starter outside of Bolles having started more than 3 seasons with the team. This offense is designed for a group of guys that have been together awhile as well as all the other prerequisites I mentioned earlier. There’s maybe a handful of QBs that could come in and run this offense as it is and be successful. The concepts are repetitive with little to no counter action being called off of them, everything takes a long time to develop including the run plays which features more counters, stretches, and tosses than I’d like to see especially when our RBs aren’t super shifty or have incredible acceleration. They’re powerful and can break away if they get enough space but they aren’t super explosive.
            I agree. I think firing Scangarello was a mistake where Drew Lock is concerned.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Spice 1 View Post

              I agree. I think firing Scangarello was a mistake where Drew Lock is concerned.
              Agree. Lock showed tangible improvement and results under Scangarello. Drew started to show the potential in the final stretch of that season. Firing Scangarello was the scapegoat for Fangio’s incompetence which remains today.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                I herd someone say our average third down to go is one of the worst in the NFL distance wise.

                Any qb is going to struggle with that.

                We need a more efficient and effective offense no matter who the QB is. I do not have the stats at work but there have been many stats that show how often Shurmur has been leading a long distance low percentage of success offense since he has been in Denver. Last presser I watched his reply to how bad the offense was repeating how we missed on Long passes....yea Shurnur we are going to miss more long passes than we make.
                It's going to be interesting to see how Shurmur calls the plays this week. Vegas is top 5 in pass defense which begs us to run it down their throat. Will he do it, or will he see it as a challenge to his play calling skills and try to throw all over the yard?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Bronco51 View Post

                  It's going to be interesting to see how Shurmur calls the plays this week. Vegas is top 5 in pass defense which begs us to run it down their throat. Will he do it, or will he see it as a challenge to his play calling skills and try to throw all over the yard?
                  Shurm will be his usual 3-wide self Im sure.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Spice 1 View Post

                    I agree. I think firing Scangarello was a mistake where Drew Lock is concerned.
                    Possibly. But people’s belief in Scangarello is based on about as much evidence as those have that are claiming Drew Lock is a good quarterback. Which is to say, not much, more based on hope and prayer than actual evidence and historical performance. Scags didn’t do much before he got the OC in Denver, and he went crawling back to San Fran after that. That doesn’t sound like the one who slipped through our fingers.

                    Scags whiffed a lot as OC. Don’t you remember the TE blind sweeps he kept calling that would get blown up?

                    And for both of them, the success they had during that VERY SHORT stint was before teams had a lot of game film on Lock. Everyone says it gets harder to be a QB in this league once the defense can game plan for you (see Drew Lock 2020).

                    To permit irresponsible authority is to sell disaster. (Heinlein)...like Broncos season tickets!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Humberg View Post

                      Possibly. But people’s belief in Scangarello is based on about as much evidence as those have that are claiming Drew Lock is a good quarterback. Which is to say, not much, more based on hope and prayer than actual evidence and historical performance. Scags didn’t do much before he got the OC in Denver, and he went crawling back to San Fran after that. That doesn’t sound like the one who slipped through our fingers.

                      Scags whiffed a lot as OC. Don’t you remember the TE blind sweeps he kept calling that would get blown up?

                      And for both of them, the success they had during that VERY SHORT stint was before teams had a lot of game film on Lock. Everyone says it gets harder to be a QB in this league once the defense can game plan for you (see Drew Lock 2020).
                      beast is right though. Scangarello may have never become a good OC, but he was running a QB friendly offense that Lock had some early success in. If you're dedicated to the development of your young quarterback, you have to take that into strong consideration before firing a guy.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Spice 1 View Post

                        beast is right though. Scangarello may have never become a good OC, but he was running a QB friendly offense that Lock had some early success in. If you're dedicated to the development of your young quarterback, you have to take that into strong consideration before firing a guy.
                        Oh I’m not about to disagree that Shurmer may have been a considerable downgrade. I just think the management of the quarterback room has been a major driving force in the failing of this organization in addition to all of the coaching issues.
                        To permit irresponsible authority is to sell disaster. (Heinlein)...like Broncos season tickets!

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by BroncosIsLife View Post

                          Shurm will be his usual 3-wide self Im sure.
                          If so, hopefully it’s because John Brown was activated from the practice squad. He’ll at least provide the speed element we’ve been missing since KJ was injured.

                          Comment


                          • Teddy was terrible today. This was the first game where he was THE reason for our offensive woes, IMO. It was exacerbated by the lack of protection, but it’s clear that Teddy doesn’t have the arm talent nor playmaking ability to overcome it. Maybe there’s some improvement when we get an elite separator like Jeudy back, but most people and, finally, I know that Teddy isn’t the answer and likely never was.
                            https://i.imgur.com/7Q7tpCd.png

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Mel B. View Post
                              Glad my NFL Sunday Ticket is free this season or I would be cancelling after hearing this 'nothing to be excited about' news.

                              Average Teddy doing average things...whoop-dee-DO-DO!!!


                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by HDbroncos02 View Post
                                Teddy was terrible today. This was the first game where he was THE reason for our offensive woes, IMO. It was exacerbated by the lack of protection, but it’s clear that Teddy doesn’t have the arm talent nor playmaking ability to overcome it. Maybe there’s some improvement when we get an elite separator like Jeudy back, but most people and, finally, I know that Teddy isn’t the answer and likely never was.
                                He's not a bad guy. He is a serviceable back up on a badly coached team. The real antagonists in this storyline are the people that tried to oversell him
                                sigpic

                                Hooray, beer!

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