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The 2021 QB Crow thread

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  • Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

    Well they are not really that comparable as Flacco came to Denver looking to resurrect a career where he had fallen off to a level where he lost his starting job. Russell is a player that commands one of the highest transfers ever.

    Flacco had a lot of strengths, but he has never been considered elite in the way that RW is. In 2021 RW was considered the 12th best player in NFL amongst his peers - https://www.nfl.com/videos/top-100-p...l-wilson-no-12, and he was considered the Forum in 2020. It is so far above where Flacco was ever placed!
    You’ve changed your story about Flacco in hindsight. This is what you said about Flacco after the trade:

    “Flacco is clearly in a field where you can win a SB with him but where he will move up and down on this list depending on situation. Five of the last six games are outdoors and could be cold, and in cold weather Flacco moves up that list.”

    Are you not putting Wilson in the category of being able to win a Super Bowl? Because that’s the category you put Flacco in.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

      Well they are not really that comparable as Flacco came to Denver looking to resurrect a career where he had fallen off to a level where he lost his starting job. Russell is a player that commands one of the highest transfers ever.

      Flacco had a lot of strengths, but he has never been considered elite in the way that RW is. In 2021 RW was considered the 12th best player in NFL amongst his peers - https://www.nfl.com/videos/top-100-p...l-wilson-no-12, and he was considered the Forum in 2020. It is so far above where Flacco was ever placed!
      He was considered elite:

      “There's little doubt that these past three playoff wins have Flacco's signature all over them, and with the Ravens now going where their quarterback goes—and having that take them all the way to the Super Bowl—it's finally the appropriate time to truly consider Flacco among the best quarterbacks in the league.”

      https://syndication.bleacherreport.c...elite.amp.html

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Fantaztic7 View Post

        You’ve changed your story about Flacco in hindsight. This is what you said about Flacco after the trade:

        “Flacco is clearly in a field where you can win a SB with him but where he will move up and down on this list depending on situation. Five of the last six games are outdoors and could be cold, and in cold weather Flacco moves up that list.”

        Are you not putting Wilson in the category of being able to win a Super Bowl? Because that’s the category you put Flacco in.
        This forum has this nice feature of quoting where you can click the quote and see the context. I have 3500 posts on this forum going back 18 years. That you find a sentence that is likely taken out of context and build straw men arguments from that, is something you do a lot, and it just dumbs down conversation but I assume that is the purpose.

        Flacco - like Eli Manning - was good to great in streaks over many years. Wilson is not a streaky QB in the same sense

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Fantaztic7 View Post

          He was considered elite:

          “There's little doubt that these past three playoff wins have Flacco's signature all over them, and with the Ravens now going where their quarterback goes—and having that take them all the way to the Super Bowl—it's finally the appropriate time to truly consider Flacco among the best quarterbacks in the league.”

          https://syndication.bleacherreport.c...elite.amp.html
          So your argument is that 6 years before he came to Denver - off beating Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in the playoffs someone on bleacher report argued a case for evaluating Flacco based on results, and that is worth what in the conversation?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

            This forum has this nice feature of quoting where you can click the quote and see the context. I have 3500 posts on this forum going back 18 years. That you find a sentence that is likely taken out of context and build straw men arguments from that, is something you do a lot, and it just dumbs down conversation but I assume that is the purpose.

            Flacco - like Eli Manning - was good to great in streaks over many years. Wilson is not a streaky QB in the same sense
            There is no getting around the fact that you said “Flacco is clearly in a field you can win a SB with. You can read your post here:

            https://forums.denverbroncos.com/for...09#post8085425

            “Clearly in a field” is a definitive statement about Flacco’s ability at the time Denver made the trade. Trying to revise history now doesn’t work. Nice try though.




            Comment


            • Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

              Well they are not really that comparable as Flacco came to Denver looking to resurrect a career where he had fallen off to a level where he lost his starting job. Russell is a player that commands one of the highest transfers ever.

              Flacco had a lot of strengths, but he has never been considered elite in the way that RW is. In 2021 RW was considered the 12th best player in NFL amongst his peers - https://www.nfl.com/videos/top-100-p...l-wilson-no-12, and he was considered the Forum in 2020. It is so far above where Flacco was ever placed!
              Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

              So your argument is that 6 years before he came to Denver - off beating Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in the playoffs someone on bleacher report argued a case for evaluating Flacco based on results, and that is worth what in the conversation?
              You said Flacco had never been considered elite. The fact is that he was considered elite. ProFootballTalk:

              https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...arterback/amp/

              Again, you can’t revise history - saying he was never considered elite is false.



              Comment


              • This is simply what does Wilson bring

                Well over 60% win rate
                Over 80% make the playoffs
                57% playoff win rate (top 5 amongst active Qbs with at least 10 appearances)
                98% availability rate
                3706 yards per season
                30 tds per season
                8 ints per season
                3.75/1 td/int ratio
                101.8 Passer rating
                65% complt
                7.8 YPA
                24 4th qtr comebacks,
                32 game winning drives
                Most wins in first 10 years
                470 rushing yards per season
                5.5 ypa rushing
                2 tds

                FYI a lot of those are top 2-5
                • Super Bowl XLVIII Champion
                • 2x NFC Champion (2013, 2014)
                • 9× Pro Bowl (2012–2015, 2017–2021)
                • Second-team All-Pro (2019)
                • NFC Offensive Player of the Month (September 2020)
                • NFL Offensive Rookie of the Month (December 2012)
                • 11× NFC Offensive Player of the Week
                • Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week (Week 10, 2012)
                • PFWA Good Guy Award (2014)
                • FedEx Air Player of the Week
                • 3x Steve Largent Award (2012, 2018, 2019)
                • NFL Top 100: 51st (2013), 20th (2014), 22nd (2015), 17th (2016), 24th (2017), 11th (2018), 25th (2019), 2nd (2020), 12th (2021)
                • Walter Payton Man Of The Year (2020)
                • Bart Starr Award (2022)
                • Most passing yards in a playoff game by a rookie: 385
                • Most fourth quarter touchdown passes in a season: 16 (2017)
                • Only player in NFL history to account for over 98% of a team's offensive tds and over 80% of the yards in a season
                • 2nd highest all time TD %
                • Highest all time 4th QTr passer rating 110
                • 2010s NFL all-decade Team (remember he was drafted 2012
                I can go on but you get the point






                Last edited by Deandc; 06-30-2022, 01:59 PM.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

                  This forum has this nice feature of quoting where you can click the quote and see the context. I have 3500 posts on this forum going back 18 years. That you find a sentence that is likely taken out of context and build straw men arguments from that, is something you do a lot, and it just dumbs down conversation but I assume that is the purpose.

                  Flacco - like Eli Manning - was good to great in streaks over many years. Wilson is not a streaky QB in the same sense
                  I mean, you put Flacco in the company of Tom Brady and Peyton Manning defending him when he arrived in Denver:

                  Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

                  In the time Flacco has been in the NFL only four QBs have represented AFC in the SB. Those are:

                  Tom Brady
                  Peyton Manning
                  Ben Rothlisberger
                  Joe Flacco

                  The super stars like Patrick Mahomes, Philip Rivers, Andrew Luck.... have not been able to get to the big games.
                  In the greater picture Elway had mediocre results for half a decade before he got to wash away the SB chocker image.

                  Comment


                  • Oh and he owns almost every Seahawks passing record there is,
                    top 5 all-time TDs amongst active QBs

                    Game over

                    https://www.pff.com/news/pro-russell...op-five-nfl-qb

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Fantaztic7 View Post

                      There is no getting around the fact that you said “Flacco is clearly in a field you can win a SB with. You can read your post here:

                      https://forums.denverbroncos.com/for...09#post8085425

                      “Clearly in a field” is a definitive statement about Flacco’s ability at the time Denver made the trade. Trying to revise history now doesn’t work. Nice try though.



                      Context matters - a poster has Flacco at #11 as QB and I write that he can move up and down that list based on situation - WOW - you got me.
                      Matthew Stafford is around the top 10 QB and has just won a SB.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

                        Context matters - a poster has Flacco at #11 as QB and I write that he can move up and down that list based on situation - WOW - you got me.
                        Matthew Stafford is around the top 10 QB and has just won a SB.
                        Okay first comparing Joe Flacco at the time of his trade to Denver and Wilson is BS.

                        Flacco stats year before the trade

                        9 games
                        61% complt
                        42 pass attempts per game
                        2465 yards
                        6.5 ypa
                        12 tds
                        6 ints
                        2/1 td/int
                        84 passer
                        45 rushing yards
                        o tds

                        Wilson year before the trade
                        14 games
                        28 pass attempts per game
                        65% compl
                        3113 yards
                        7.8 complt
                        25 tds
                        6 ints
                        4/1 td/int
                        103 passer
                        183 yards
                        2 tds

                        as you can huge difference one is in his prime the other not. But lets go one step further, lets look at the last 2 games each played before the trade

                        Flacco avg last 2 games
                        33 pass attempts
                        193 yards
                        62% complt
                        5.8 ypa
                        0 tds
                        0 ints
                        78 passer

                        Wilson's last 2 games avg
                        27 pass attemtps
                        237 yards
                        8.7 ypa
                        7 tds
                        1 int
                        7/1 td/int
                        122 passer

                        again one is in his prime the other not


                        Just to put it in even more clarity. Last year Wilson has only 3 games below a 90 passer. 85 is considered avg and he had only 4 below 98.

                        Mahomes had 7 below 90 and 9 below 98

                        Comment


                        • Comment


                          • Wilson is also the only QB with a 100+ passer rating each of the last 4 years
                            Last edited by Deandc; 06-30-2022, 06:33 PM.

                            Comment


                            • I thought Flacco would have been better than he was. I was told by big Ravens fans that he was still good, until he got rushed up the middle, then he was no good. They said as long as he has protection he will be alright, if not, forget about it.


                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Capt. Jack View Post
                                I thought Flacco would have been better than he was. I was told by big Ravens fans that he was still good, until he got rushed up the middle, then he was no good. They said as long as he has protection he will be alright, if not, forget about it.

                                Well, Flacco wasn’t protected very well so we’ll never know if those Ravens fans were right.
                                My Opinion isn’t determined by what the Popular Opinion is. Sometimes I agree with the Majority, Sometimes I Don’t. If My Opinion is Different than Yours, I have to Ask One Question:
                                You Mad Bro?
                                Don’t Be A Mean Girl

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