Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Thank goodness we gave up on Lock after 1.5 seasons

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by broncojuan View Post

    Sure, because we didn't win 16 games in 2008 because of Cutler. It didn't have anything to do with the 30th ranked defense or that, because of injuries, our leading rusher had under 350 yards. Cutler was in his 3rd year and he had the third most passing yards, and seventh most TDs in the league. Take that and add another year learning the system, the usual Shanny running game, and a slightly improved defense, and you're talking about a SB contender.
    Before we traded Cutler away, he was widely seen by virtually everyone in football as an up and coming superstar. This is why the media went nuts, and nearly the entirety of Broncos Country went absolutely ballistic when McDaniels came in and immediately alienated him which lead to the trade.

    Its easy to trash talk him now, but thats with the advantage of hindsight. At the time, he was a rising star, and pretty much the entire football world was on board with that.
    sigpic

    Comment


    • Originally posted by MrMax View Post


      He was pretty good QB, and he was paid well for it. So you think he deserves a lifetime booth queen job for life , I get it. I doubt Pat Bowlen would get it, IMO Elway and Ellis not only wrecked this team, they drove a wedge and probably did irreparble damage to the Bowlen family; but you adore Elway cause he was a well paid decent QB 20 years ago.
      And made sure the team will be sold, because they know the kids would give them the boot, if the court was not protecting them
      Hate on the man all you want. Without John, we dont even sniff 7 of the 8 Super Bowls we have gone to.

      Many of us are right there with you in criticizing some of his moves as GM. But some of us, will not disrespect his career as a whole. He has earned that.
      sigpic

      Comment


      • I know, I did'nt always feel this way. I used to think he would respect the team and his reputation and admit any body else would have been fired but since no one will, he would resign and always hope for the best for the team. Shanahan maned up, he said "I was fired because we did not win" Of course , Pat was here to fire him.
        I lost that respect because of his A personality and need for this power and position. There may be players and coaches that feel this way too.

        Hence I said, I wonder what he think while watching his team from the booth. It's not like he has not had enough time to build it.

        Comment


        • Yeah.....Elway gets the parking spot by the door, the big office, and the perks (or whatever the best receive)


          cuz he earned it!!

          Comment


          • Originally posted by MrMax View Post
            Oh come on, Maybe I don't know as much about football as alot of guys here including you, maybe. However, how many other QB, even ones much much better than Elway ever was have had a lifetime job after they quit playing?

            Not only that, other than being here when PM decided to join the Broncos, what has he done? Not much. Finally after 5 disasterous years , they decide to hire Paton, to put some one else to blame and take some of it off Elway who is here for just to stay away from the blame but still be wasted overhead for Bowlens kids inheritance. And to make sure Paton has him for a boss and make all big final decisions.

            Elway , Ellis and the other 2 sleazy lawyers are just taking advantage and draining as much as possible from the Bowlen team.

            Do you really think Pat wanted to destroy his team and his family? If he was in good health, do you think he'd put up with this no accountability team?
            Get real.
            How many other QBs are still milking the team 20 -30 years after they quit? By your standard Tom Brady should own the Patriots and maybe eventually the Bucs, and lots of better QBs than Elway was.
            You have to know this.
            OK, well, let’s just get this part out of the way. Elway is a top 5 QB of all time. There are only three QBs who could “legitimately” be ranked ahead of him; Brady (who I would love to see playing on the three teams Elway took to the Super Bowl in the 80s) Montana (who would have struggled in Denver, but at least he would have kept his “Cool”), and Manning (who would have clashed with Reeves more than Elway). And quite frankly, I wouldn’t take any of them on those 80’s broncos teams. It would be hilarious to watch those statues being protected by the Widell brothers, handing off to Sammy Winder, and throwing to the Three Amigos. He spent the majority of career playing with also rans, and being coached by a guy who never left the 1970s

            2nd Peyton came here BECAUSE of Elway. All reports had him going to the Texans until Elway took him to dinner. It was Elway who brought in Talib, Ware (after taking heat for passing on a washed up Dwight Freeney), Sanders, CJ Anderson, TJ Ward, Shaq Barrett, and Harris Jr.,. Drafted Von, Derek Wolf, Malik Jackson, and Danny Trevathan.

            I never said he shouldn’t go, it was clearly time, but his QB and coaching struggles notwithstanding, HE built 2 SB teams, and helped take this team to heights they had not seen since he retired as a player. Not to mention he built the core of a very talented team that is probably a QB away from being a contender.

            Finally, the Bowlen situation. The Family has been splintered for a very long time (I’m guessing you don’t live in Denver or you would have known that). There is a reason there was a trust put in place, and Elway and Ellis were put on it because they were incredibly close to Pat. Both he and Ellis (even though I’m no fan of his) should be commended. They allowed themselves to be put in an unwinnable situation because of their feelings for Pat. Not only that, but Elway did so knowing it would exclude him from being a potential team owner, per NFL rules. All to be turned into some ridiculous comic book villain.
            broncojuan
            Gunslinger
            Last edited by broncojuan; 11-25-2021, 09:34 PM.
            Bring Back ORANGE Sunday!!!

            Tim Tebow combines the intensity of Ray Lewis with the throwing ability of... Ray Lewis.

            "It is a damn poor mind indeed which can't think of at least two ways to spell any word."-Andrew Jackson

            sigpic

            Comment


            • Originally posted by broncojuan View Post

              Kubiak doesn't belong anywhere near the Bronco's ring of fame. He completely ruined the league's 2nd ranked offense by neutralizing Manning's strength (his knowledge of the offense and ability to make his reads pre-snap) by changing his offense and forcing him to become a read and react during the play QB. Something he probably never had the arm to do, but definitely didn't when he was here. That team won that year because of Wade Phillips, and despite Kubes. I'll give him credit for figuring out that the only way Plummer was a threat was on a bootleg, then the rest of the league caught up. If Kubes belongs in the ROF it's as the greatest second banana in team history. He could be given subset bullet points under Elway, Shanny, and Phillips.
              I'd second this observation by noting that Kubiak was also a big reason for our Oline and QB drafting troubles, with the partial conversion to linemen that can run his system followed by a reversal when he left, and the emphasis on drafting athletic mobile QBs optimized to run his system, which led to the likes of Paxton Lynch and Drew Lock, and free agent hires like Joe Flacco. I suspect this also led to Pat Shurmur's hiring, because his system is sort of a hybrid of the WCO and other things, and so the hope may have been that his system could have made some use of the shipwrecked leftovers of Kubiak's aborted personnel makeover.
              CasualFan
              Starter
              Last edited by CasualFan; 11-25-2021, 09:43 PM.

              Comment


              • A few of us deserve to be Chargers fans for a day or two.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by CasualFan View Post

                  I'd second this observation by noting that Kubiak was also a big reason for our Oline and QB drafting troubles, with the partial conversion to linemen that can run his system followed by a reversal when he left, and the emphasis on drafting athletic mobile QBs optimized to run his system, which led to the likes of Paxton Lynch and Drew Lock, and free agent hires like Joe Flacco. I suspect this also led to Pat Shurmur's hiring, because his system is sort of a hybrid of the WCO and other things, and so the hope may have been that his system could have made some use of the shipwrecked leftovers of Kubiak's aborted personnel makeover.
                  Pat Shurmur offense is crap. Does not deserve to be put in the same sentence as the WCO.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by broncojuan View Post

                    OK, well, let’s just get this part out of the way. Elway is a top 5 QB of all time. There are only three QBs who could “legitimately” be ranked ahead of him; Brady (who I would love to see playing on the three teams Elway took to the Super Bowl in the 80s) Montana (who would have struggled in Denver, but at least he would have kept his “Cool”), and Manning (who would have clashed with Reeves more than Elway). And quite frankly, I wouldn’t take any of them on those 80’s broncos teams. It would be hilarious to watch those statues being protected by the Widell brothers, handing off to Sammy Winder, and throwing to the Three Amigos. He spent the majority of career playing with also rans, and being coached by a guy who never left the 1970s

                    2nd Peyton came here BECAUSE of Elway. All reports had him going to the Texans until Elway took him to dinner. It was Elway who brought in Talib, Ware (after taking heat for passing on a washed up Dwight Freeney), Sanders, CJ Anderson, TJ Ward, Shaq Barrett, and Harris Jr.,. Drafted Von, Derek Wolf, Malik Jackson, and Danny Trevathan.

                    I never said he shouldn’t go, it was clearly time, but his QB and coaching struggles notwithstanding, HE built 2 SB teams, and helped take this team to heights they had not seen since he retired as a player. Not to mention he built the core of a very talented team that is probably a QB away from being a contender.

                    Finally, the Bowlen situation. The Family has been splintered for a very long time (I’m guessing you don’t live in Denver or you would have known that). There is a reason there was a trust put in place, and Elway and Ellis were put on it because they were incredibly close to Pat. Both he and Ellis (even though I’m no fan of his) should be commended. They allowed themselves to be put in an unwinnable situation because of their feelings for Pat. Not only that, but Elway did so knowing it would exclude him from being a potential team owner, per NFL rules. All to be turned into some ridiculous comic book villain.
                    You are terribly........















                    bright!

                    Comment


                    • Something big has to be coming this offseason for Paton to convince those 2 WR to sign extensions with us. Rodgers, Watson, Wilson , etc. I hope I am not wishful thinking 😮

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Carffather View Post
                        Something big has to be coming this offseason for Paton to convince those 2 WR to sign extensions with us. Rodgers, Watson, Wilson , etc. I hope I am not wishful thinking 😮
                        I kinda hope so too. Then again, it may just be a case of smart management. Locking up your young studs.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by CanDB View Post
                          Yeah.....Elway gets the parking spot by the door, the big office, and the perks (or whatever the best receive)


                          cuz he earned it!!
                          Yep, he needs that to feed his oversize ego.
                          I wish Beth Bowlen could call him in to her office and ask just what he has done for her Dad's team for the last 5 years.
                          Last edited by MrMax; 11-27-2021, 08:27 PM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by MrMax View Post

                            Yep, he needs that to feed his oversize ego.
                            I wish Beth Bowlen could call him in to her office and ask just what he has done for her Dad's team for the last 5 years.
                            Good lord, did Elway steal your girl or something? I wish Elway could call Beth into his office and ask what Pat ever did in the football world that wasn't leached off of Elway?

                            Anyway, back on topic. It's probably too late to salvage this season anyway. They should have started the year with the player that has the better upside, and if he hadn't shown improvement by game 5-6, bench him and put in Teddy. We would have been 3-3 at worst (any QB would have won those first 3 games, although I think we have a better shot against Pitt with Drew), have an actual answer to the Drew question, and then let the veteran attempt to salvage the season. As it is now, we probably max out at 7 wins, and our situation has never been more uncertain.
                            Bring Back ORANGE Sunday!!!

                            Tim Tebow combines the intensity of Ray Lewis with the throwing ability of... Ray Lewis.

                            "It is a damn poor mind indeed which can't think of at least two ways to spell any word."-Andrew Jackson

                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Carffather View Post
                              Something big has to be coming this offseason for Paton to convince those 2 WR to sign extensions with us. Rodgers, Watson, Wilson , etc. I hope I am not wishful thinking 😮
                              Both got really good deals considering their path. Patrick is a guy who has been around the NFL and struggled to make teams. Sutton had great promise two years ago but missed all of 2020 and has not really tore it up this year yet he is getting paid like he is WR 1.

                              Patrick got 11.5 million guaranteed at signing. Contract Notes:
                              • $11.5M guaranteed at signing (signing bonus + 2022 salary + 2022 roster bonus)
                              Sutton got 18 mil guaranteed at signing. Contract Notes:
                              • $18M guaranteed at signing (signing bonus + 2022 salary + 2022 roster bonus)

                              The Broncos can cut ties with either contract after the 2022 season and save a lot of cap space if need. If we keep them Patrick will have a cap hit in 2023 of 9.25 mil and 10.75 mil in 2024. From 2023 to 2025 Sutton will have cap hits of 15.7 mil, 14.2 mil and 15.2 mil. If we keep them they get paid good money considering their path so far.

                              Personally I think there is a chance both players could have gotten better on the free agent market. There is also some trains of thought that so many good WRs come out of the draft year in and year out why pay a WR big money in free agency. Personally I think the elite QBs and good offensive minds would have looked at both of these WRs and wanted them.

                              Paton did good on these deals. Not only to get these guys on team friendly deals but also to try and keep some consistency on offense so maybe we can improve.
                              Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                                Both got really good deals considering their path. Patrick is a guy who has been around the NFL and struggled to make teams. Sutton had great promise two years ago but missed all of 2020 and has not really tore it up this year yet he is getting paid like he is WR 1.

                                Patrick got 11.5 million guaranteed at signing. Contract Notes:
                                • $11.5M guaranteed at signing (signing bonus + 2022 salary + 2022 roster bonus)
                                Sutton got 18 mil guaranteed at signing. Contract Notes:
                                • $18M guaranteed at signing (signing bonus + 2022 salary + 2022 roster bonus)

                                The Broncos can cut ties with either contract after the 2022 season and save a lot of cap space if need. If we keep them Patrick will have a cap hit in 2023 of 9.25 mil and 10.75 mil in 2024. From 2023 to 2025 Sutton will have cap hits of 15.7 mil, 14.2 mil and 15.2 mil. If we keep them they get paid good money considering their path so far.

                                Personally I think there is a chance both players could have gotten better on the free agent market. There is also some trains of thought that so many good WRs come out of the draft year in and year out why pay a WR big money in free agency. Personally I think the elite QBs and good offensive minds would have looked at both of these WRs and wanted them.

                                Paton did good on these deals. Not only to get these guys on team friendly deals but also to try and keep some consistency on offense so maybe we can improve.
                                Sutton tore his acl,so you can’t hold that against him, you also can’t hold Teddy 2 scared against him either. Tim Patrick went undrafted signed with ravens,49ers until he finally signed with Denver all in 2017. Patrick has been a Bronco since his rookie year.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X