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Thank goodness we gave up on Lock after 1.5 seasons

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  • #46
    Originally posted by Gsam View Post

    Absolutely. If he's great then its a win for us. If he's garbage we are that much closer to a top draft pick. Can't lose at this point!
    With the way Teddy was limping by the end of the game, I can’t imagine they’d put him back out there, behind that o-line, on short week. Though, with this coaching staff clown-show, anything is possible.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Broncos-R-Great View Post
      Sad days, our only hope for salvation is Drew freakin’ Lock, haha!

      But, whatever, might as well toss him out there. He can’t be worse, right?
      Maybe not salvation but at least something to watch. This team is on the midnight train to Nowheresville. I'd rather watch a young drafted player see if he can work it out over trying to make chicken soup from chicken poo with Bridgewater.

      Bridgewater, who was so unwanted in Carolina they rolled the dice on Darnold, WHO WAS AWFUL on the Jets. They paid the Broncos to take him. Then our idiotic coaching staff took it and ran because they suck SO BAD at coaching and planning, they needed to make sure they had a player that could mitigate their bad coaching as much as possible.

      I'd rather watch YOU start at QB than see anymore of Bridgewater.
      sigpic

      Hooray, beer!

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      • #48
        And also, it's nothing personal. Teddy is by all accounts a good guy. That's great 👍

        I don't care. Him being a cool dude doesn't make him play well.
        sigpic

        Hooray, beer!

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        • #49
          Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post

          Maybe not salvation but at least something to watch. This team is on the midnight train to Nowheresville. I'd rather watch a young drafted player see if he can work it out over trying to make chicken soup from chicken poo with Bridgewater.

          Bridgewater, who was so unwanted in Carolina they rolled the dice on Darnold, WHO WAS AWFUL on the Jets. They paid the Broncos to take him. Then our idiotic coaching staff took it and ran because they suck SO BAD at coaching and planning, they needed to make sure they had a player that could mitigate their bad coaching as much as possible.

          I'd rather watch YOU start at QB than see anymore of Bridgewater.
          Well said. Like I said in my other post. Its such an arrogant move taking a QB that sucked on the previous 4 teams and think you can make him a starter here and have it be effective. Whats wrong with the thought process here?

          I mean lock got 1.25 season of play and no off season in the one full season he did start without his WR1. Yet bridgewater spent half a decade being mediocre at best and we gonna start him over a QB with superior physical attributes and makes some poor choice? You can coach choices and teach ball discipline. You can't teach arm talent.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Gsam View Post

            Well said. Like I said in my other post. Its such an arrogant move taking a QB that sucked on the previous 4 teams and think you can make him a starter here and have it be effective. Whats wrong with the thought process here?

            I mean lock got 1.25 season of play and no off season in the one full season he did start without his WR1. Yet bridgewater spent half a decade being mediocre at best and we gonna start him over a QB with superior physical attributes and makes some poor choice? You can coach choices and teach ball discipline. You can't teach arm talent.
            Can we actually research instead of parroting the low hanging fruit other people keep saying. What previous four teams did he suck on....he was straight with the Vikings until his knee collapsed in on itself...he was straight with the Saints, he wasn't so much with the Panthers and the lack of weapons and other players underperforming. Kind of like it is here.

            Teddy ain't lighting it up but he is not as bad as all the Lock Apologists want to make it seem to prop up their boy.

            I'm a Teddy guy, but I am all for him getting benched for Lock when we blow the Browns game. I think Lock is the better path to a higher draft pick.

            Teddy got hit 17 times by the Raiders on top of the 5 sacks. But Lock apologists want to believe he would be doing sooooooooooo much better. We have seen what he does with crap OL play. He sucks.

            Originally posted by Gsam View Post
            You can't teach arm talent.
            Yeah because arm talent alone has won countless super bowls. It's the NFL everyone has 'arm talent' of some degree or they wouldn't be in the League.

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            • #51
              Saw people posting on Twitter the reason Teddy won the competition was because he was safe. Would not turn the ball over as much as lock. But in TC lock has less ints and more TDs. It get like fangio was looking for an excuse to name Teddy QB. Shurmur raved on how improved lock was.

              I never liked Teddy. I watch him post middle of the road stats based off garbage time last season. I never saw him as a good fit for this offense with limited arm strength. I always hoped he would prove me wrong but the fact he just had 4 TO in a game and mass amount of garbage stats just solidified in me he was never the QB for this team.

              I have wanted to see what Lock could do with a true off season to see if he could step up and move past last season and build off his rookie season success. I am hoping that after this loss to raiders they move on from Teddy for good to properly evaluate lock going into next season. If they are going to move on they need to know where he sits and get a trade value on him. Then sell the farm to move up and get the correct guy and don’t want for a QB to fall.

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by BroncosIsLife View Post

                Can we actually research instead of parroting the low hanging fruit other people keep saying. What previous four teams did he suck on....he was straight with the Vikings until his knee collapsed in on itself...he was straight with the Saints, he wasn't so much with the Panthers and the lack of weapons and other players underperforming. Kind of like it is here.

                Teddy ain't lighting it up but he is not as bad as all the Lock Apologists want to make it seem to prop up their boy.

                I'm a Teddy guy, but I am all for him getting benched for Lock when we blow the Browns game. I think Lock is the better path to a higher draft pick.

                Teddy got hit 17 times by the Raiders on top of the 5 sacks. But Lock apologists want to believe he would be doing sooooooooooo much better. We have seen what he does with crap OL play. He sucks.



                Yeah because arm talent alone has won countless super bowls. It's the NFL everyone has 'arm talent' of some degree or they wouldn't be in the League.
                First off, the panthers are not lacking weapons. DJ Moore is one of the best young WR's in the game and Robby Anderson is a solid #2. Yeah CMC got hurt last year, but lets not pretend like he doesn't have anything to work with there.

                You wanna dig deep into Teddy B Stats? Lets do it. I am gonna start this off and say Teddy is an awesome dude, but a sub par QB. Lets review:

                2020:
                24th in TDs produced
                17th in yards producted
                9th in INT's thrown.

                Very mediocre. top 1/3 of ints thrown, bottom 1/3rd of TD's produced.

                2019
                Only started 9 games so bad year for comparison. During that time, he had a whopping 9 TD passes in 9 games. 2 INT (which is good) He was averaging 153 passing yards a game.... On track to throw for 2460 yards which would have been 30th in total yardage. Right next to Stafford who threw that much in 8 games before getting hurt.

                2018
                Not even worth looking at. Threw 23 passes all year

                2017
                Nothing to report Didn't play.

                2016
                did not play

                2015
                26th in TD's produced (bottom 1/3)
                22nd in INT's thrown (good)
                22nd in yards produced. (bottom 1/3)

                2014

                23rd in TD's produced. (bottom 1/3)
                13th in INT's (just outside top 1/3 of the worst)
                23rd in yards produced (bottom 1/3)

                so I ask YOU, where is he "straight"

                If I told you that you could have a QB who is a lifetime bottom 1/3 TD producer, and lifetime 1/3 in yards produced, and middle of the road on INT's with a low ADOT would you say thats good? We signed up for the epitome of a game manager. 0 upside, He has never even averaged 1 TD a game through his ENTIRE career.

                I also never said arm talent wins game, I said "YOU CANT TEACH ARM TALENT" but you can work on decision making.

                So again, don't bring it on stats when you are not informed.














                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by BroncosIsLife View Post

                  Can we actually research instead of parroting the low hanging fruit other people keep saying. What previous four teams did he suck on....he was straight with the Vikings until his knee collapsed in on itself...he was straight with the Saints, he wasn't so much with the Panthers and the lack of weapons and other players underperforming. Kind of like it is here.

                  Teddy ain't lighting it up but he is not as bad as all the Lock Apologists want to make it seem to prop up their boy.

                  I'm a Teddy guy, but I am all for him getting benched for Lock when we blow the Browns game. I think Lock is the better path to a higher draft pick.

                  Teddy got hit 17 times by the Raiders on top of the 5 sacks. But Lock apologists want to believe he would be doing sooooooooooo much better. We have seen what he does with crap OL play. He sucks.



                  Yeah because arm talent alone has won countless super bowls. It's the NFL everyone has 'arm talent' of some degree or they wouldn't be in the League.
                  Where did anyone say he would be doing better? Why are you taking this so personally?

                  Why are you taking people calling bs on yet another stop gap journeyman QB so personally?

                  As for the rest....what?

                  He's holding on to the ball for 14 years, that's why he's getting hit. He can't process the information and he's holding the ball. Then when he is getting it out of his hands it's always -just- off.

                  if the play isn't perfect Teddy ain't doin squat. That dude sucks and he always has. Stinks on ice. Keeps getting chance after chance because he's a likeable dude.
                  sigpic

                  Hooray, beer!

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post

                    Where did anyone say he would be doing better? Why are you taking this so personally?

                    Why are you taking people calling bs on yet another stop gap journeyman QB so personally?

                    As for the rest....what?

                    He's holding on to the ball for 14 years, that's why he's getting hit. He can't process the information and he's holding the ball. Then when he is getting it out of his hands it's always -just- off.

                    if the play isn't perfect Teddy ain't doin squat. That dude sucks and he always has. Stinks on ice. Keeps getting chance after chance because he's a likeable dude.
                    Teddy is a game manager that likes quick throws and to play off running the ball. He would have been great with CMC but he was injured. Take away the quick short passes and Teddy is a liability.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Gsam View Post

                      Well said. Like I said in my other post. Its such an arrogant move taking a QB that sucked on the previous 4 teams and think you can make him a starter here and have it be effective. Whats wrong with the thought process here?

                      I mean lock got 1.25 season of play and no off season in the one full season he did start without his WR1. Yet bridgewater spent half a decade being mediocre at best and we gonna start him over a QB with superior physical attributes and makes some poor choice? You can coach choices and teach ball discipline. You can't teach arm talent.
                      Not saying Teddy has been lighting it up, but this is just not true he's never "sucked". We know what Dew Lock is and what he's going to be. He's not going to get better. He is by all accounts exactly what the pundits said he would be. Elway was just so enamored with the arm talent, that he blinded himself from all the other red flags. You can attempt to coach choices and discipline, but when things break down in a given play, the player always slips back to who they are. And if you can't coach around those tendencies (the offensive staff in LA is a great example of coaching up and around the QB's tendencies so you maximize production), the QB will fail, and the team will struggle behind them. Arm talent is useless without the proper mindset and framework for it to thrive in. Teddy will at least give us a fighting chance as his negative tendencies are minor, because he has always taken care of the football.

                      This was supposed to be combined with a much improved defense and OL, so we would win the trenches. This team was never built to get in a track-meet with Teddy throwing 50 times. That's not who he is. And that's definitely something we don't want Lock doing. But with Donatell/Fangio's defense giving up so many chunk plays and quick scores has put pressure on the offense that Shurmer can't (or won't) adjust for. And we have Teddy playing outside of his element. which is a huge self inflected wound.

                      We fix the poor coaching, game prep, and game management issues, it changes everything with this team. It was embarrassing to watch a team with the internal issues that the Raiders are going through look far more composed and prepared for that game than us.....playing at home! It's one thing when players are arguing with each other. Multiple players arguing with coaches










                      #swapping

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by flosstein View Post

                        Not saying Teddy has been lighting it up, but this is just not true he's never "sucked". We know what Dew Lock is and what he's going to be. He's not going to get better. He is by all accounts exactly what the pundits said he would be. Elway was just so enamored with the arm talent, that he blinded himself from all the other red flags. You can attempt to coach choices and discipline, but when things break down in a given play, the player always slips back to who they are. And if you can't coach around those tendencies (the offensive staff in LA is a great example of coaching up and around the QB's tendencies so you maximize production), the QB will fail, and the team will struggle behind them. Arm talent is useless without the proper mindset and framework for it to thrive in. Teddy will at least give us a fighting chance as his negative tendencies are minor, because he has always taken care of the football.

                        This was supposed to be combined with a much improved defense and OL, so we would win the trenches. This team was never built to get in a track-meet with Teddy throwing 50 times. That's not who he is. And that's definitely something we don't want Lock doing. But with Donatell/Fangio's defense giving up so many chunk plays and quick scores has put pressure on the offense that Shurmer can't (or won't) adjust for. And we have Teddy playing outside of his element. which is a huge self inflected wound.

                        We fix the poor coaching, game prep, and game management issues, it changes everything with this team. It was embarrassing to watch a team with the internal issues that the Raiders are going through look far more composed and prepared for that game than us.....playing at home! It's one thing when players are arguing with each other. Multiple players arguing with coaches
                        "I know for a solid undeniable fact Drew Lock cannot play in the NFL after 18 games"

                        And then

                        "Id we throw all of these variables together I FEEL like we could do some damage"


                        sigpic

                        Hooray, beer!

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by flosstein View Post

                          Not saying Teddy has been lighting it up, but this is just not true he's never "sucked". We know what Dew Lock is and what he's going to be. He's not going to get better. He is by all accounts exactly what the pundits said he would be. Elway was just so enamored with the arm talent, that he blinded himself from all the other red flags. You can attempt to coach choices and discipline, but when things break down in a given play, the player always slips back to who they are. And if you can't coach around those tendencies (the offensive staff in LA is a great example of coaching up and around the QB's tendencies so you maximize production), the QB will fail, and the team will struggle behind them. Arm talent is useless without the proper mindset and framework for it to thrive in. Teddy will at least give us a fighting chance as his negative tendencies are minor, because he has always taken care of the football.

                          This was supposed to be combined with a much improved defense and OL, so we would win the trenches. This team was never built to get in a track-meet with Teddy throwing 50 times. That's not who he is. And that's definitely something we don't want Lock doing. But with Donatell/Fangio's defense giving up so many chunk plays and quick scores has put pressure on the offense that Shurmer can't (or won't) adjust for. And we have Teddy playing outside of his element. which is a huge self inflected wound.

                          We fix the poor coaching, game prep, and game management issues, it changes everything with this team. It was embarrassing to watch a team with the internal issues that the Raiders are going through look far more composed and prepared for that game than us.....playing at home! It's one thing when players are arguing with each other. Multiple players arguing with coaches









                          I think we have a difference of opinion on what "sucks" means. To me, a QB who finishes in the bottom 1/3 of pretty much every category as a QB tells me that your starting QB sucks. Would "serviceable" have been a better term? I think Teddy is an elite backup, but a "sucky" starter. This league is generally won or lost at the QB position and what we have right now just cannot contend with the QBs in our division, let alone the rest of the NFL.

                          I also disagree with you on lock. I don't think we have any idea what he is at this point. He still has yet to have an off season (in person) where he is the starting QB. He was in a contest all offseason and by all measures he has improved. Yet we still went with the guy who can't score historically because hes safer. Shameful the way the broncos did lock.
                          Last edited by Gsam; 10-18-2021, 12:44 PM.

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                          • #58
                            Nah keep teddy in there let him get destroyed so we can give Shurmur and Vic the boot. I don't want Lock or any other QB to be under this coaching staff. Shurmur wanted teddy cause he had success with him. They already chose the QB. Lock has more upside. He is young and can make all the throws.

                            If anything he is a product of the organizations shortcomings in coaching. He goes to a coach like Reid, Belichick, or McDermott, he would have been a solid QB if not a pro bowl qb.

                            That goes for pretty much any QB maybe besides Brady or Manning.



                            Manning to Thomas ev'ry day, all day.

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                            • #59
                              I don’t even care about Lock vs Bridgewater anymore. They’re both pretty much going to produce the same results.

                              My main issue is the organization and the repetitious approach to coaching and QB. Old fashioned coach with a vet FA QB.

                              It’s a tired and worn out approach. It doesn’t work. Time for some fresh and modern ideas.

                              I’d really love to see this organization go with a modern thinking coach and a young QB.
                              sigpic

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by famicommander View Post
                                Drew Lock isn't a good player. Sorry, but he's just not.

                                Teddy isn't very good either, but he's not why they're losing.
                                Year 2: Baker Mayfield
                                • Completion percentage: 59.4%
                                • 22 TD / 21 INT
                                • Record: 6-10
                                Year 3: Baker Mayfield
                                • Completion percentage: 62.8%
                                • 26 TD / 8 INT
                                • Record: 11-5

                                Year 2: Drew Lock
                                • Completion percentage: 57.4%
                                • 16 TD / 15 INT
                                • Record: 4-9
                                Year 3: Drew Lock
                                • We give up. No one knows.

                                Some people use the Josh Allen comparison. Yes, he only completed 52% and 58%, respectively, of his passes in year 1 and 2. I like Baker better because he and Lock had some of the same problems. Just know that if year 3 Baker Mayfield or Josh Allen played for the Broncos, they'd be sitting on the bench right now in favor of Teddy Bridgewater. That's just how Denver rolls.

                                I am trying not to make this a dump on Teddy. I don't think he has the arm strength to ever truly be more than "eh." That said, no one would have done that well getting hit 17 times and getting sacked 5 times like Bridgewater did against the Raiders. I give the Raiders some credit, and Maxx Crosby loves him some Teddy.
                                Last edited by CheyennePress; 10-18-2021, 05:12 PM.

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