Russell Wilson to Denver

[CanDB]

I'll be shocked if Seattle is even competitive. Their o-line doesn't seem capable of a substantive rushing game. Same thought with their rbs. I think their lost players on defense is going to severely damage the performance on that side, as well.I expect Seattle to end up around 5-12 and a distant last in a tough nfc-w.

I agree. I think the magic is gone, and losing Wilson was the last straw. Pete probably thinks he can do it all again, but without a good QB, and with those gaps on the roster, they're likely toast for several years to come.

[Locutus]

I'll be shocked if Seattle is even competitive. Their o-line doesn't seem capable of a substantive rushing game. Same thought with their rbs. I think their lost players on defense is going to severely damage the performance on that side, as well.I expect Seattle to end up around 5-12 and a distant last in a tough nfc-w.

Prepare to be shocked.

[Hadez]

I'll be shocked if Seattle is even competitive. Their o-line doesn't seem capable of a substantive rushing game. Same thought with their rbs. I think their lost players on defense is going to severely damage the performance on that side, as well.I expect Seattle to end up around 5-12 and a distant last in a tough nfc-w.

The Hawks are going to be to that tough Div in the NFC West what would have happened to the Broncos had we not gotten Wilson in the even tougher AFC West.

The hawks will play 6 games against the NFC West and 4 games against the AFC West. Besides the Any Given Sunday factor I have a hard time seeing them winning any of those 10 games.

[skeeter01]

I'll be watching the Hawks due to Drew Lock. { and Shelby along with Noah Fant } I'm super Happy we got Russ, but Drew was a home grown draft pick who shows some ability. Yes, like Melvin Gordon, Drew has had costly turn overs at crucial moments in the game, but both players do have talent. I hope Drew does well, { but not that well }

[Fantaztic7]

Amazes me how he always fails to mention Wilson missed 3 games and played badly hurt for 4-5 more.

Also now let's look a that

Bridgewater
3052 yards
66% complt
18 tds
7 ints
95 passer

Wilson
3113 yards
65% complt
25 tds
6 ints
103 passer

Given Wilson's numbers are way better than Teddy's one can conclude the difference was the defense and Seattle's were awful.

It amazes me he still does understand Football is a team sport

Let's go one better

Bridgewater 33-30 or 52% career record, since 2015 which seems to be Fantaztic7 issue he is 27-24 52% teddy has had 1 winning season

Wilson 104-53-1 or 66% career and since 2015 68-41-1 or 62% Game over Wilson has had 9 winning seasons ( treend)

Now as to Wilson lets go 1 step farther, passer rating is the gold standard for performance by a QB

In his 10 years career, Wilson has been top 10 in passer rating 9 times and is the only QB to meet that mark.

Now again 2015 till now seems to be his warped time frame. let's look at that.

Wilson's per season Avg


4518 yards
66% complt
31 tds
8 ints
7.8 ypa
102 passer
401 yard rushing
2 tds

Yeah 99% of all teams would take that as they are all top 1-10

Meanwhile Seattle's defense avg ranking since 2015
20th


Seattles oline pass blocking avg ranking
26th

Seattle rushing ranking per year minus QB
21st


Then let's add this nugget

"“I’ve been here a long time. And if we didn’t have Russell, I probably wouldn’t have been here a long time. Carroll said. "

Game over

I am gladdened by the fact that there is no longer any pretense about having a sane conversation about Russell Wilson.

[Broncos1963]

I agree. I think the magic is gone, and losing Wilson was the last straw. Pete probably thinks he can do it all again, but without a good QB, and with those gaps on the roster, they're likely toast for several years to come.

I think this might be Pete's last season in WA. The trend is going the wrong way and this season is going to finish the demise. In that division, Seattle needs a total re-set.

[lvbronx]

Most fans on this board claim Wilson is an elite quarterback and great leader. The Broncos should win the AFC West this season at a minimum, according to the hype.

I can't speak for "most" fans but to have a sane, RATIONAL conversation we need to first agree on what is an "elite" QB. IMO, Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers and Allen are the "most elite" QBs. Russ is in the next group of QBs. He can compete with and even outplay the elite QBs, but those other guys have an edge.

Which logically brings us to, which of the QBs better than Russ were available and if they were, at what price?

And your argument about expectations that an elite QB has to win the AFC West is non-sequitor. One flaw is that it doesn't take into account that there are other "elite" QBs in the AFC West. How is it even possible to expect Russ, Mahomes and Herbert all three to "win the AFC West this season at a minimum"? And where does Carr factor into your "reasoning"? He isn't elite, but he's pretty good.

For his entire career John Elway was the best QB in the AFCW and by most accounts an "elite" QB. Why didn't he win the AFCW every year of his career?

I am gladdened by the fact that there is no longer any pretense about having a sane conversation about Russell Wilson.

This comment is dripping with unintentional irony.

[CanDB]

I can't speak for "most" fans but to have a sane, RATIONAL conversation we need to first agree on what is an "elite" QB. IMO, Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers and Allen are the "most elite" QBs. Russ is in the next group of QBs. He can compete with and even outplay the elite QBs, but those other guys have an edge.

Which logically brings us to, which of the QBs better than Russ were available and if they were, at what price?

And your argument about expectations that an elite QB has to win the AFC West is non-sequitor. One flaw is that it doesn't take into account that there are other "elite" QBs in the AFC West. How is it even possible to expect Russ, Mahomes and Herbert all three to "win the AFC West this season at a minimum"? And where does Carr factor into your "reasoning"? He isn't elite, but he's pretty good.

For his entire career John Elway was the best QB in the AFCW and by most accounts an "elite" QB. Why didn't he win the AFCW every year of his career?




This comment is dripping with unintentional irony.

.......................

[Capt. Jack]

If the Seahawks handed the ball to beast mode, RW would have won Back to back Super Bowls, beating PFM first, then TB.
I think it is nit picking a little bit to wonder if RW is "elite" or not ?????
We will see, if he can throw for another 15 k pass yards and have a good TD/ INT ratio in the next 4 years, he will have a very respectable career.
I don't think there is any argument about the Broncos having a very capable QB on our team.

[CanDB]

Here's my take....

We needed a legit QB, and have for the last half dozen years at least, and now we have one. He is not a rookie, but he is not near done. He still has most of the skills he had when he was an MVP type, but more important, has great leadership and football IQ, from the most critical position on the field. And he is motivated to win another SB.

And even if he is not the best of the best right now, he instantly upgraded the team and the way the players feel about this group. They know they have Russ freakin Wilson to guide them. They come to the premise knowing that they leap frogged from a so so team to one with huge potential. That alone makes us better.

But don't ever think Russ is a question mark. He does not have to scramble around to be successful. He can, and he will, as required, but no doubt he will use his arm, his legs and his brain, to win games. Our receivers will have a little extra time if they need it. Maybe even a lot.

So we can talk about Russ Wilson as a Bronco all day, every day....but I am pretty sure that my gut feeling about his impact is pretty accurate. Because for any so called downside, there is much more upside. And I believe firmly that he will not only be good, but his game will rebound to some degree here. Just like Manning's first couple of years here were amazing, and even better than expected!

[Fantaztic7]

I can't speak for "most" fans but to have a sane, RATIONAL conversation we need to first agree on what is an "elite" QB. IMO, Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers and Allen are the "most elite" QBs. Russ is in the next group of QBs. He can compete with and even outplay the elite QBs, but those other guys have an edge.

Which logically brings us to, which of the QBs better than Russ were available and if they were, at what price?

And your argument about expectations that an elite QB has to win the AFC West is non-sequitor. One flaw is that it doesn't take into account that there are other "elite" QBs in the AFC West. How is it even possible to expect Russ, Mahomes and Herbert all three to "win the AFC West this season at a minimum"? And where does Carr factor into your "reasoning"? He isn't elite, but he's pretty good.

For his entire career John Elway was the best QB in the AFCW and by most accounts an "elite" QB. Why didn't he win the AFCW every year of his career?




This comment is dripping with unintentional irony.

Pretty sure Elway wasn’t the best QB in the AFC West in 1983 with twice as many interceptions than touchdowns and a 4-6 record.

[Deandc]

Here's my take....

We needed a legit QB, and have for the last half dozen years at least, and now we have one. He is not a rookie, but he is not near done. He still has most of the skills he had when he was an MVP type, but more important, has great leadership and football IQ, from the most critical position on the field. And he is motivated to win another SB.

And even if he is not the best of the best right now, he instantly upgraded the team and the way the players feel about this group. They know they have Russ freakin Wilson to guide them. They come to the premise knowing that they leap frogged from a so so team to one with huge potential. That alone makes us better.

But don't ever think Russ is a question mark. He does not have to scramble around to be successful. He can, and he will, as required, but no doubt he will use his arm, his legs, and his brain, to win games. Our receivers will have a little extra time if they need it. Maybe even a lot.

So we can talk about Russ Wilson as a Bronco all day, every day....but I am pretty sure that my gut feeling about his impact is pretty accurate. Because for any so-called downside, there is much more upside. And I believe firmly that he will not only be good, but his game will rebound to some degree here. Just like Manning's first couple of years here were amazing, and even better than expected!

Great post let's remember Wilson has played 10 years in the NFL with only 1 losing season, the season he got hurt.

Let's remember even in a hurt full season, in a new system he was top 5 in passer rating, top 10 in Tds, top 5 in td/int ratio, top 5 in YPA

Prior to getting hurt, he was top 5 in everything.

Just the year before he was top 5 in complt%, Tds, td/int, and top 6 in yards.

As I posted his "trend based on 10 years of data is
4200 yards, 493 attempts, 66% comply, 7.8 ypa, 32 tds, 9 ints, 4/1 td/int ratio, 102 passer rating, 32 rushing yards a game, 5.5 ypa, 2 tds

Now let's look where that puts him compared to this past year

Yards would be 9th
TDs Passing 8th
Tds total 6th
Comnplt% 15th
Attempts 16th
ypa 6th
pass rating 8th
Rushing by a QB 5th
Rushing tds by Qb 5th

So we are good with Wilson at Qb and then some.

Fyi
According to Havard Modern Statistics, a trend requires at least 10 data points. So sorry 5 years is not a trend.

[CanDB]

Pretty sure Elway wasn’t the best QB in the AFC West in 1983 with twice as many interceptions than touchdowns and a 4-6 record.

So are we now nit picking at who was considered a great QB in his era, by picking stats that suit you? You can't go back and chip away at the stats from back then without understanding the overall picture. Few QBs had stats like in the modern day, where QBs have been protected by the rules, and Dmen are penalized often, whether on the pass rush or in WR coverage.

At this point, if a QB is deemed great by those who were there to assess and compare, then that's the only relevant info we need. Nowadays there are many who want to critique past performance using today's standards. That is unwise, because you must involve relevancy. Comparing these days with those days, or in your case, hand picking one season, is very narrow in scope. John Elway is regarded as one of the best QBs of all time by most experts, and I will take their word on that. Not to mention, I watched him play his entire career, and I knew he was special!

[samparnell]

Otto Graham played ten years, was in the championship game each year and won seven. His career yards per pass attempt was nine, I believe. He did not call his own plays.

[Fantaztic7]

So are we now nit picking at who was considered a great QB in his era, by picking stats that suit you? You can't go back and chip away at the stats from back then without understanding the overall picture. Few QBs had stats like in the modern day, where QBs have been protected by the rules, and Dmen are penalized often, whether on the pass rush or in WR coverage.

At this point, if a QB is deemed great by those who were there to assess and compare, then that's the only relevant info we need. Nowadays there are many who want to critique past performance using today's standards. That is unwise, because you must involve relevancy. Comparing these days with those days, or in your case, hand picking one season, is very narrow in scope. John Elway is regarded as one of the best QBs of all time by most experts, and I will take their word on that. Not to mention, I watched him play his entire career, and I knew he was special!

“For his entire career John Elway was the best QB in the AFCW” (post #1297)

I’m going to go out on a limb and say Jim Plunkett was the best quarterback in the AFC West in 1983.

Maybe Russell Wilson can shakeup the AFC West.