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R. Mathis Vs Champ Bailey

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Archimedes Owl
    It seems to me that in 05, almost all of the times that he got burned was because of a missed assignment and not him getting beat.

    Basically, he'd release his guy to nobody where somebody was supposed to be there.

    Anyway, the Jags have a much better defensive line than we do. I'm hoping that we can turn that around a bit, but when taking our lackluster performance of our offensive line, it becomes even more impressive what Champ has been able to do.

    And, he's faced some terrific recievers and still been able to shut them down. Chad Johnson had a good game a couple of years back against him and so did Jerry Porter, but overall, he's been stellar. He's completely shut down many terrific wide recievers without a pass rush to speak of to help.

    Anyway, it will be interesting to see what he'll look like under Bates. I wasn't a gigantic Coyer fan, but I did think that Coyer playing champ off of the reciever often helped us. Champ has good closing speed and could react to short passes, so we didn't give those up, but he was also able to better read the QB and react to the ball when we played him off the reciever a bit. I think that Coyer's scheme did help him get more picks than he might have otherwise.

    He will be less read and react if we play him on the line, but the fact that he'll be able to disrupt the route will be nice. And Champ is so athletic, that I'm sure he'll still get his share of picks.

    Mathis isn't in Champ's league, but he's a good corner.


    thats exactly right...champ one on one has gotten beat a few times,,, TO when he had the hammy, chad when he fell...he does have some bad games like anyone...but the majority are just that a release of the wr but the safety reads run or completley missed it leaveing champ to have to recover and on tv it appears like he got beat...like the game the chiefs brag about where quitterson got two on champ...both missed assignments
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    • #17
      Originally posted by arapaho
      thats exactly right...champ one on one has gotten beat a few times,,, TO when he had the hammy, chad when he fell...he does have some bad games like anyone...but the majority are just that a release of the wr but the safety reads run or completley missed it leaveing champ to have to recover and on tv it appears like he got beat...like the game the chiefs brag about where quitterson got two on champ...both missed assignments
      Your exactly right. Champ recovery skills are so good that you would think he got beat simply because he got to the ball a second late. While the player who should be there is no where insight. Many times this was a result of our slow safeties. Our safeties lack deep speed and recovery speed.

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      • #18
        With the way Champ has played the last two years......I really only think Deion in his prime can be considered to have played at his level....but I still think Champ has the edge. Right now Champ is 14 picks behind Deion....including his two comeback stint. Champ is nearly 100 more tackles then Deion and Champ still has 4-5 more good years ahead of him. There is no comparing any cornerback playing today with champ bailey....ask any true fan of the game.
        New England Patriots GM

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Gbt31
          ask any true fan of the game.
          As ignorant as they are, a lot of Cowboy fans will tell you Terrence Newman is the best corner in the league.
          Originally posted by Soldier96B
          i also took a crap and it was orange

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          • #20
            Nice post man! got a lot of time for the jags! they have been underated the last two seasons, but i'm still not sure on leftwhich, he frustrates me!

            I think last season was a great season for champ, it was rare we would shout '***'...whereas his first season there was a few of the moments I can tel u that e.g. oakland!

            I agree with other posters, Mathis is streets ahead of D Hall, that boy has got some growing up to do, and T.O burnt him to a crisp!!!

            Good luck to jags but no superbowl i'm afraid!!!! lol!!!!

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            • #21
              first off, NO ONE is close to champ bailey. last year, he was about as perfect as a corner can be. opposing teams rarely threw to him, yet he still was tied for the league high of ten INTs (samuel). plus, his picks always seem to come at crucial times. when the other team is just about to score then...bam!..champ picks off the QB. i think his first like 5 or 6 picks were in or near the opposing endzone(im not 100% sure on that but its close). i will say that mathis had a stellar year, and as of right now as earned the honor of being considered one of the best corners in the league. but i did not yell at champ one time this year. in 04, it happened quite a few times i.e. porter and c-johnson. even last year i dont think i yelled. but remember that mathis is younger, and will improve. he'll just get better.

              oh, and btw Bigplayshay, Dre Bly is a good CB, but he had the misfortune to be playing in Detroit, where nobody looks good. that whole team was terrible, so of course he isnt mentioned as an elite CB. i cant wait for this year tho. most teams try to throw away from Champ, but now when they do, Dre Bly will be waiting on the other side. i expect bly to have an incredible year.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Gbt31
                With the way Champ has played the last two years......I really only think Deion in his prime can be considered to have played at his level....but I still think Champ has the edge. Right now Champ is 14 picks behind Deion....including his two comeback stint. Champ is nearly 100 more tackles then Deion and Champ still has 4-5 more good years ahead of him. There is no comparing any cornerback playing today with champ bailey....ask any true fan of the game.
                I wasn't comparing the two. There is no doubt Champ is the best right now and the best I have seen sice Prime Time himself. I was just looking for a perspective of if we are too hard on our guy.
                Thanks for the responses guys.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by BroncoSexyDaddy
                  To me Champ has picked his game up a lot since last season,truely separating himself from the other CBs.He used to get burned by Chad Johnson or Terrell Owens but last season he shut down all the #1 receivers.That was pretty impressive.He will do the same this season.
                  Well, the difference is that his hamstring has healed.

                  ------

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Jaxcats07
                    I wasn't comparing the two. There is no doubt Champ is the best right now and the best I have seen sice Prime Time himself. I was just looking for a perspective of if we are too hard on our guy.
                    Thanks for the responses guys.
                    I remember when the Broncos had Rich Jackson and Lyle Alzado on the same line.
                    Our cornerbacks . . . well, they might as well have bought tickets and watched the
                    game. That seemed what they were doing, anyway.

                    The point is, even with the fierce pass rush, the other teams passed us dizzy. You
                    not only have to have a good line, but your backfield also must be good. Despite
                    some of the harsh comments here, your guy is fine.

                    -----

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                    • #25
                      Mathis is an excellent corner. Damn, I'd give up a lot to import your D-line as well. Could you loan us Henderson and Stroud for the Indy game?

                      I think a more apt comparison here would be Darrent Williams. We yelled and screamed about how he needed to be benched because Peyton Manning and Reggie Wayne made him look bad once. Of course, never mind that the scheme we were playing didn't suit him, we had no pass rush, and he was in his second year. It only takes one play for a corner to screw up and look bad. Give Mathis some more time. He'll get better.

                      I think if Champ were thrown at more he'd get burnt. But as it is, he intercepted something like 20% of the passes thrown to him (and some that were not ), and deflected a good portion of the rest. He's almost perfect. We're spoiled.


                      RIP D-Will and Nash

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