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Report: Broncos may not want Manning back

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  • Rancid
    replied
    Originally posted by JT24Champ View Post
    indy didnt force him to throw short. they forced him to throw the sidelines and deep. they dared him to do it. so both him and gase did it. 10x and didnt hit one.
    And that's the rub. He cannot throw a 30-yard pass with zip. He can float them out there as 'murderballs', but his radius of throwing balls with authority is the smallest in the NFL. Teams know this and play a shorter field against him-- making tighter coverage. The only threat he has is the route creativity and the deception. Teams are wising up and realizing the hype is over-stated. But, Montana was exactly the same through much of his career. He murdered teams with 5-yard passes and then would hit Rice or Clark for 20. Manning can do this.

    Leave a comment:


  • Den615
    replied
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    The last few times teams bottled up Manning and forced him to look short and quick, he got antsy and and tried to take a bunch of deep shots.

    That, and, I don't understand why people think Manning's game is so cerebral anymore. Sure, he can read the defense at the line with the best of them, but after the ball is snapped he's going to throw 1 of 4 passes.

    Quad injury or not, Manning was prone to fluttering, rainbow, murderballs already. The next time we see him he'll be a year older. I don't care if he's working out with a guru, this that and the other. Another year on a body that has been encased in concrete for a few years now. I'm honestly concerned he'll be able to hand the ball off outside of the tackle box without a gimmick, which will severely limit his role in the offense.

    He's the best chance we have at winning in 2015, but for how long? He'll come out on fire for 4 or 5 games and everyone will be screaming "TOLD YA SO" and then something will happen, Manning will fade, and the excuse parade will be trotted back out.

    I really, really hope I'm wrong.
    I hope you are wrong too, but I have all of the same concerns as you. Manning's play was declining well before he injured his quad. In my opinion he hasn't looked like himself since the New England game. Yeah he threw five TD's against Oakland, but it was painful to watch and the stats didn't tell the whole story.

    Manning also did something this year that he historically has never done. He struggled against 4-3 defenses. Seattle showed everyone the blueprint to embarrass our offense, and St. Louis, Cincinnati, and Indianapolis did the exact same thing to us and made it look easy.

    I'm a huge fan of Peyton, and like every year I will be optimistic if he comes back... but I'm ready for a new era of Denver football.

    Leave a comment:


  • JT24Champ
    replied
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    The last few times teams bottled up Manning and forced him to look short and quick, he got antsy and and tried to take a bunch of deep shots.

    That, and, I don't understand why people think Manning's game is so cerebral anymore. Sure, he can read the defense at the line with the best of them, but after the ball is snapped he's going to throw 1 of 4 passes.

    Quad injury or not, Manning was prone to fluttering, rainbow, murderballs already. The next time we see him he'll be a year older. I don't care if he's working out with a guru, this that and the other. Another year on a body that has been encased in concrete for a few years now. I'm honestly concerned he'll be able to hand the ball off outside of the tackle box without a gimmick, which will severely limit his role in the offense.

    He's the best chance we have at winning in 2015, but for how long? He'll come out on fire for 4 or 5 games and everyone will be screaming "TOLD YA SO" and then something will happen, Manning will fade, and the excuse parade will be trotted back out.

    I really, really hope I'm wrong.
    indy didnt force him to throw short. they forced him to throw the sidelines and deep. they dared him to do it. so both him and gase did it. 10x and didnt hit one.

    Leave a comment:


  • FL BRONCO
    replied
    [QUOTE=BANJOPICKER1;5154083]Whats with all these negative waves Moriartie? The bridge will be there, its a beautiful bridge! and it will be there!

    This is a Quote from Odd Ball in the movie Kellys Heros and I think it fits here..

    Have faith baby!:thumb:




    One of my favorite movies, lol cps

    GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO BRONCOS!!!!![/QUOTE]

    Leave a comment:


  • Rancid
    replied
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    The last few times teams bottled up Manning and forced him to look short and quick, he got antsy and and tried to take a bunch of deep shots.

    That, and, I don't understand why people think Manning's game is so cerebral anymore. Sure, he can read the defense at the line with the best of them, but after the ball is snapped he's going to throw 1 of 4 passes.

    Quad injury or not, Manning was prone to fluttering, rainbow, murderballs already. The next time we see him he'll be a year older. I don't care if he's working out with a guru, this that and the other. Another year on a body that has been encased in concrete for a few years now. I'm honestly concerned he'll be able to hand the ball off outside of the tackle box without a gimmick, which will severely limit his role in the offense.

    He's the best chance we have at winning in 2015, but for how long? He'll come out on fire for 4 or 5 games and everyone will be screaming "TOLD YA SO" and then something will happen, Manning will fade, and the excuse parade will be trotted back out.

    I really, really hope I'm wrong.
    I see it the same way you do. I might go on to say that Manning is the football equivalent of Stephen Hawking at QB. I think the offensive scheme can be adjusted to be more accommodating, but why should it be? The answer might be he is viewed by Elway et al. as our best chance considering we draft 28th or Elway feels compelled to honor the commitments he made to Manning when he brought him here. Whatever it is, it is not worth $19-M.

    I think back to those 49'ers offenses ran by Montana and remember thinking what a geezer looking offense it was-- yet he was successful at it. Thinking this way gives me hope and makes me feel better.

    Leave a comment:


  • CoryWinget81
    replied
    Originally posted by Rancid View Post
    The problem Manning has is that his arm strength is diminished and is arguably the weakest arm in the league. Coupled with his nil mobility, his threat is more cerebral than actual. Because of this defenses can cover less field. Less coverage means tighter coverage. Joe Montana made a career out of short passes; hopefully Manning can be successful at that also; but I am of the opinion it will be an uphill climb for him and not one I am sure he will be successful at. I also do not think it is a $19-M risk worth taking.
    The last few times teams bottled up Manning and forced him to look short and quick, he got antsy and and tried to take a bunch of deep shots.

    That, and, I don't understand why people think Manning's game is so cerebral anymore. Sure, he can read the defense at the line with the best of them, but after the ball is snapped he's going to throw 1 of 4 passes.

    Quad injury or not, Manning was prone to fluttering, rainbow, murderballs already. The next time we see him he'll be a year older. I don't care if he's working out with a guru, this that and the other. Another year on a body that has been encased in concrete for a few years now. I'm honestly concerned he'll be able to hand the ball off outside of the tackle box without a gimmick, which will severely limit his role in the offense.

    He's the best chance we have at winning in 2015, but for how long? He'll come out on fire for 4 or 5 games and everyone will be screaming "TOLD YA SO" and then something will happen, Manning will fade, and the excuse parade will be trotted back out.

    I really, really hope I'm wrong.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rancid
    replied
    The problem Manning has is that his arm strength is diminished and is arguably the weakest arm in the league. Coupled with his nil mobility, his threat is more cerebral than actual. Because of this defenses can cover less field. Less coverage means tighter coverage. Joe Montana made a career out of short passes; hopefully Manning can be successful at that also; but I am of the opinion it will be an uphill climb for him and not one I am sure he will be successful at. I also do not think it is a $19-M risk worth taking.
    Last edited by Rancid; 02-12-2015, 06:17 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Broncos2024
    replied
    Those attendance numbers have no effect on income.

    Originally posted by Larryh View Post
    True but believe me I was not referring to anyone in particular. It is just that over the past year or so I have read many posts that have said that the Broncos would not miss a thing (in the pocket book) if Peyton was to leave. This reference of course is always referring to his salary and his hit on the cap. If you think I was targeting you please accept my apologies.
    Those numbers you quoted for attendance numbers you linked are not actually linked to profit from ticket sales. That entire time before Peyton we sold out as well as during Peyton we sold out. The difference is that more people showed up. Regardless though about the same amount of tickets were sold. Ticket sales don't fluctuate when attendance does when your stadium is constantly sold out. It just means less peoples tickets went to waste. However I do think that Peyton does have some bearing on selling merchandise and concessions. Denver doesn't actually directly get the money from merchandise and the difference in concessions is probably negligible at best. Also though if this team keeps winning without Peyton I don't think you will see a massive decline in attendance. However if Peyton leaves and they start to do bad then the facts show very obviously that attendance drops.

    Leave a comment:


  • Larryh
    replied
    Originally posted by BroncosDivision View Post
    All good, no apologies necessary. You quoted my post earlier so I wasn't sure.
    Actually I quoted them because I thought they were very interesting and I just got curious about what the stats had been earlier. Perhaps I could have been clearer....best wishes

    Leave a comment:


  • BroncosDivision
    replied
    Originally posted by Larryh View Post
    True but believe me I was not referring to anyone in particular. It is just that over the past year or so I have read many posts that have said that the Broncos would not miss a thing (in the pocket book) if Peyton was to leave. This reference of course is always referring to his salary and his hit on the cap. If you think I was targeting you please accept my apologies.
    All good, no apologies necessary. You quoted my post earlier so I wasn't sure.

    Leave a comment:


  • Larryh
    replied
    Originally posted by BroncosDivision View Post
    I'm not sure if you're referring to me or not but just to be clear, I have said no such thing - on the contrary;



    As for the attendance figures, keep in mind that they are just that. Broncos still sold out throughout that period.
    True but believe me I was not referring to anyone in particular. It is just that over the past year or so I have read many posts that have said that the Broncos would not miss a thing (in the pocket book) if Peyton was to leave. This reference of course is always referring to his salary and his hit on the cap. If you think I was targeting you please accept my apologies.

    Leave a comment:


  • BroncosDivision
    replied
    Originally posted by Larryh View Post
    Just for curiosity sake, I decided to find out what I could on my own about attendance figures and what I found when I examined home attendance was quite interesting. Denver has consistently been number 5 in the league in home attendance but here are the attendance figures for the years 2006 to 2014

    2006 - 610,776

    2007 - 612,888

    2008 - 604,074

    2009 - 600,928

    2010 - 599,264 - Tim Tebow started 3 games as a rookie

    2011 - 602,618 - Tim Tebow became full time qb in the 6th game of the season.

    2012 - 613,062 - Peyton Manning arrives and Tim Tebow is traded.

    2013 - 614,977

    2014 - 615,517

    Average yearly increase in attendance after Peyton arrives: 11,920

    It is clear that when Peyton arrived so did more fans. Now outside of being interesting this is not by any means a reason to keep him. But those people who are suggesting that the Broncos attendance is the same no matter what are clearly not seeing the whole picture. To argue that cutting Manning will have no effect on the bottom line is not an effective argument in my opinion. JMHO
    I'm not sure if you're referring to me or not but just to be clear, I have said no such thing - on the contrary;

    Originally posted by BroncosDivision View Post
    As long as he's healthy (Manning), he's worth every buck and more. Fans might not care but the added revenue and brand exposure alone more than makes up for what we're paying him - by a large margin too.

    These are things that factor into Ellis' decision, like it or not.
    As for the attendance figures, keep in mind that they are just that. Broncos still sold out throughout that period.

    Leave a comment:


  • BANJOPICKER1
    replied
    Originally posted by Roddoliver View Post
    Thinking as a fan, I don't want Manning back. I'm ready to move on. I don't believe we can win a championship with him. Considering the new coaching staff and new system, I'd rather speed up our long-term plans which must include the evaluation of Osweiler. Without Manning, Kubiak won't have to bend his system and beliefs to fit a fading star that likely won't last beyond this season. I understand we may struggle to get back to the playoffs and each win will be a hard-fought battle again, but I'm ready for it because we will soon have to deal with this anyway.

    Thinking as Elway and Kubiak, I can see why they would want Manning back. Elway needs a good season in 2015 to prove we have a championship roster and Fox was just riding Manning's success. Kubiak needs a good season to prove Elway right, to prove we needed better coaching to get to the next level. There will be a lot of pressure and a bad feeling if we go from 12-4 to 8-8 without a playoff spot. Manning can win in the regular season. Elway and Kubiak would rather get to the playoffs and then see what happens. Once Manning is gone, we will start a quest (which can be quick or take a long time) to find the proper replacement.

    I really like our current coaching staff. I really like Kubiak's offense, I think it's the beautiful Broncos football the fans are used to. I just don't like the idea of bringing a new coaching staff and make them look like the previous coaches because Manning is still running the show. I want the head coach to run the show, with all players buying in.
    Whats with all these negative waves Moriartie? The bridge will be there, its a beautiful bridge! and it will be there!

    This is a Quote from Odd Ball in the movie Kellys Heros and I think it fits here..

    Have a little faith baby!:thumb:

    GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO BRONCOS!!!!!
    Last edited by BANJOPICKER1; 02-13-2015, 06:41 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Larryh
    replied
    Just for curiosity sake, I decided to find out what I could on my own about attendance figures and what I found when I examined home attendance was quite interesting. Denver has consistently been number 5 in the league in home attendance but here are the attendance figures for the years 2006 to 2014

    2006 - 610,776

    2007 - 612,888

    2008 - 604,074

    2009 - 600,928

    2010 - 599,264 - Tim Tebow started 3 games as a rookie

    2011 - 602,618 - Tim Tebow became full time qb in the 6th game of the season.

    2012 - 613,062 - Peyton Manning arrives and Tim Tebow is traded.

    2013 - 614,977

    2014 - 615,517

    Average yearly increase in attendance after Peyton arrives: 11,920

    It is clear that when Peyton arrived so did more fans. Now outside of being interesting this is not by any means a reason to keep him. But those people who are suggesting that the Broncos attendance is the same no matter what are clearly not seeing the whole picture. To argue that cutting Manning will have no effect on the bottom line is not an effective argument in my opinion. JMHO

    Leave a comment:


  • trc1962
    replied
    I think Elway is a straight shooter and professional. If he did not want Manning back he would have already told him in private and not gone out of his way to say he wants him back. I don't think Elway would leak info about something so important either. I think there aren't many stories to write after the super bowl and someone came up with this. Just because the author wrote Elways book, way back when, doesn't mean Elway confides in him. I think maybe he hopes for a restructure to free up some cash and that would be okay. Brady is making 9 million this year, but his restructure actually raised his salry by 3 mil over all.

    Leave a comment:

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