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Brock Osweiler to spell Peyton Manning more in 2015

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  • #61
    In a comparison between Brock vs. Peyton right now.

    Arm strength?
    Accuracy?
    Mobility?
    Mental?
    Intangibles?

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    • #62
      Originally posted by Den615 View Post
      Anyone catch Total Access with former Bronco, and current Colt, Mike Adams yesterday? He said that Indianapolis "absolutely" figured our Peyton Manning. Vontae Davis said the same after the playoff game and players from the Seahawks, Rams, Patriots, and Bengals offered a similar sentiment after those respective embarrassments.

      Now what I am thinking (and hoping) is that they figured out Gase more than Manning, but if that doesn't turn out to be the case we may be seeing more of Brock than most people expect.
      I think it was more Gase than Manning. Gase and Fox talked about having a more balanced offense later in the year but that equated to either running 5 plays in a row or passing 5 in a row. We would run CJ when he was obviously gassed and he kept getting knicked up and injured, to me thats not balance. On the stat sheet run to pass ratio may have looked balanced but IMO thats not balance. A true balanced attack should keep the D guessing with a mix of run and pass using looks and plays to set up other plays later. Ive watched plenty of Kubiak led offenses and I believe him to be very good at mixing things up, he called a brilliant game in the playoffs for the Ravens vs the Pats and I cant wait to see him back on the Broncos sideline.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by Den615 View Post
        Anyone catch Total Access with former Bronco, and current Colt, Mike Adams yesterday? He said that Indianapolis "absolutely" figured our Peyton Manning. Vontae Davis said the same after the playoff game and players from the Seahawks, Rams, Patriots, and Bengals offered a similar sentiment after those respective embarrassments.

        Now what I am thinking (and hoping) is that they figured out Gase more than Manning, but if that doesn't turn out to be the case we may be seeing more of Brock than most people expect.
        So your saying that if they figured out the greatest QB football mind in the game that they can't figure out OZ?

        The reason they were able to dominate us was the lousy at best LOS play we had both playoff games.

        When your OL only allows what it did time wise it did in those games, it limits what you can do. When there is zero run capability then you are forced to throw.

        When you receivers are intimidated at the LOS then Timing is off.

        I doubt that Arron Rodgers could have won those games with the crappy uninspired play of others on the team.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by Garfield View Post
          So your saying that if they figured out the greatest QB football mind in the game that they can't figure out OZ?

          The reason they were able to dominate us was the lousy at best LOS play we had both playoff games.

          When your OL only allows what it did time wise it did in those games, it limits what you can do. When there is zero run capability then you are forced to throw.

          When you receivers are intimidated at the LOS then Timing is off.

          I doubt that Arron Rodgers could have won those games with the crappy uninspired play of others on the team.
          Curious if there is even a fraction of doubt that Manning's physical limitations have a factor?

          The possibility that his arm strength and mobility inhibit playcalling? Or that the defense can gameplan and scheme situations to take advantage of those limitations? Not excusing his teammates lackluster performances or outright failures but do you even consider any portion of responsibility to Manning? Or is it always the other guy in your opinion?

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          • #65
            Chuck Pagano's brother, John, prepares for Peyton Manning twice a year. I'm sure his entire scouting report is available. If there is any special knowledge to be gained inside the greater Denver Metropolitan area, I'm sure friends and relatives are a good source.

            For a long time, Peyton Manning's advantage has been to use his vantage point and the 40 second play clock to count box defenders and study the coverage before finalizing his decision which he communicates via audibles and hand signals. It has been effective, but the volume of offense that can be called this way is limited.

            Recently, defenses have waited until Manning seems ready to put the ball in play, and switched to a new front and/or coverage according to the call. It's pretty simple stuff like stemming the line and sugaring the Backers. Coverage tricks like Inverts, Robber and Zone Blitz have fooled him a number of times.

            I think Manning will benefit from working with Kubiak and Dennison who have twenty years of experience with their style of offense. Clear communication is absolutely essential. Sometimes it might be better to huddle up and get everybody on the same play.
            "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

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            • #66
              Originally posted by FR Tim View Post
              Curious if there is even a fraction of doubt that Manning's physical limitations have a factor?

              The possibility that his arm strength and mobility inhibit playcalling? Or that the defense can gameplan and scheme situations to take advantage of those limitations? Not excusing his teammates lackluster performances or outright failures but do you even consider any portion of responsibility to Manning? Or is it always the other guy in your opinion?
              sure Manning has some fault, but IMO and I'm sure many others that are not blind, saw the lackluster performances of the OL last year, not to mention the need to have an additional OT in to run the ball on many plays, or the drops by receivers when the plainly had their hands on the ball.

              OR the inability of a 230 pound WR to be able to get off the LOS when their CB played tight man.

              all of those things contributed to the lack of offense in some of the games.

              were those things Mannings fault also?

              Was Manning playing hurt and that has contributed to the issue but for those that seem to have blamed Manning for our play off game failures is absurd IMO.

              It is a 22 man starter squad and when of those fails the odds are the play will be blown up.

              If he had a strong arm would the WR's be able to get off the LOS?

              How about with that strong arm would he have had the time to make the longer routes work?

              If his arm was stronger would those drops been less?

              Now all that said I was never big fan of John spending the money to bring him into Denver, I'd rather have had them try another direction. But since he is here and has elevated the play of most of the players by demanding perfection I'm going to defend in some cases baseless attacks that is ONLY Mannings faults in playoff losses.

              Did Fox have a perfect game plan for either of the last two?

              Did he have his players prepared for them?

              Was Gase, JDR and Fox totally ready for those games or in the case of the last one ready to move on? I think we all know the answer to that last one.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by samparnell View Post
                Chuck Pagano's brother, John, prepares for Peyton Manning twice a year. I'm sure his entire scouting report is available. If there is any special knowledge to be gained inside the greater Denver Metropolitan area, I'm sure friends and relatives are a good source.

                For a long time, Peyton Manning's advantage has been to use his vantage point and the 40 second play clock to count box defenders and study the coverage before finalizing his decision which he communicates via audibles and hand signals. It has been effective, but the volume of offense that can be called this way is limited.

                Recently, defenses have waited until Manning seems ready to put the ball in play, and switched to a new front and/or coverage according to the call. It's pretty simple stuff like stemming the line and sugaring the Backers. Coverage tricks like Inverts, Robber and Zone Blitz have fooled him a number of times.

                I think Manning will benefit from working with Kubiak and Dennison who have twenty years of experience with their style of offense. Clear communication is absolutely essential. Sometimes it might be better to huddle up and get everybody on the same play.
                good points But I do not see how huddling up will stop defenses from making last second adjustments to what he sees.

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by Garfield View Post
                  good points But I do not see how huddling up will stop defenses from making last second adjustments to what he sees.
                  Huddling up precludes using the play clock for a no huddle call. If Kubiak uses a script, a huddle could be useful (especially in a noisy stadium) to make sure everyone is clear. WCO plays are very verbose. It is always possible to break the huddle, line up quickly and snap the ball on set.
                  "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by samparnell View Post
                    Huddling up precludes using the play clock for a no huddle call. If Kubiak uses a script, a huddle could be useful (especially in a noisy stadium) to make sure everyone is clear. WCO plays are very verbose. It is always possible to break the huddle, line up quickly and snap the ball on set.
                    maybe it is just me but I do not see them huddling up nearly as much as you seem to think Kubes is going to force the issue.

                    will they have scripted plays I'm sure but asking Manning to go to the LOS and and not audible out of a play he knows is not going to hunt, is not going to happen.

                    I believe Kubes when he say he is going to modify his O to suit Mannings style and abilities..

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by Garfield View Post
                      maybe it is just me but I do not see them huddling up nearly as much as you seem to think Kubes is going to force the issue.

                      will they have scripted plays I'm sure but asking Manning to go to the LOS and and not audible out of a play he knows is not going to hunt, is not going to happen.

                      I believe Kubes when he say he is going to modify his O to suit Mannings style and abilities..
                      I was responding to issues raised in post #60. Perhaps revisiting that post might clarify things.
                      "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

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                      • #71
                        Originally posted by samparnell View Post
                        I was responding to issues raised in post #60. Perhaps revisiting that post might clarify things.
                        Sorry in mobile so numbers do not appear.

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