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OT in Round 1, here's why...

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Mat'hir Uth Gan
    and I think Plummer's height hurts him with finding open targets that close to the goal line. I think with Bell at RB, or even Griffin, the red zone offense will be much more efficient. But Jake's got to be able to work to his TEs more to keep the defense from stacking the run so often.
    I will only disagree with you on Jakes height.
    Jake is listed as 6'02

    Brees-6'0
    Delhomme-6'2
    Favre-6'2
    Flute-5'10
    Garcia-6'1
    Kitna-6'2
    Stewart-6'1

    I picked these guys out as being his height or less, and having had at least some success (stewart) or better.
    Add another inch and the list grows to a bit more.

    Not to mention, the fact that denver's O linemen aren't exactly TREES, as are some of the others on the teams listed above, meaning they should have more difficulty spotting open receivers moreso than Jake.

    I believe its scheming (passing lane), but again, having an Oline that can beat the Dline back instead of getting pushed back into Jake, is a BIG reason for his inefficiencies.....
    rcsodak
    Step UP, or Step OFF!
    Last edited by rcsodak; 03-08-2005, 10:13 PM.
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    • #17
      Excellent thread and very thought provoking discussion.

      Living in KC I saw alot of Oklahoma games and Brown impressed me with his fundamentals. He is definitely a very technically sound RT and he could be a great one in the NFL. My concern is how will he react against better competition. Will he back down or will he show a competitive fire and step his game up. He has been vastly superior to his opponents in college and I wonder if he has the drive to compete every down in the NFL.

      I too like Evan Mathis and I think he would be a great RG to RT candidate. I think P.J. Alexander has the ability to be a solid RG and he should open some eyes in camps, but if we draft a prospect like Brown or Mathis I think Alexander could wait another year to take over the position.

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      • #18
        Great Thread.
        Thanks for sharing!

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        • #19
          I love it when you post like that, you actually make me believe you. I also think that we will get either a linemen (og or can play it) or a TE this year first. I don't see us gettin a DL first, or a wr or cb or rb.....(rb first? WTF!?) an we wont go qb.
          OL and TE make the most sense to me, they arent as talent rich as the others for one (minus qb......taht is severely top heavy imo)
          Bronco fan from Packer Land.
          Lefty Writer on The Sports Show with Woody Paige and Les Shapiro
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          • #20
            Originally posted by rcsodak
            I will only disagree with you on Jakes height.
            Jake is listed as 6'02

            Brees-6'0
            Delhomme-6'2
            Favre-6'2
            Flute-5'10
            Garcia-6'1
            Kitna-6'2
            Stewart-6'1

            I picked these guys out as being his height or less, and having had at least some success (stewart) or better.
            Add another inch and the list grows to a bit more.

            Not to mention, the fact that denver's O linemen aren't exactly TREES, as are some of the others on the teams listed above, meaning they should have more difficulty spotting open receivers moreso than Jake.

            I believe its scheming (passing lane), but again, having an Oline that can beat the Dline back instead of getting pushed back into Jake, is a BIG reason for his inefficiencies.....
            I agree Jake's height isn't the problem with him being in the pocket. It's is to some degree a matter of comfort. He's much more comfortable rolling out than he is staying in the pocket.
            John 11: 25-27

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            • #21
              I am one of the people who think we need OL too. I would prefer to get a DL in the first round, but a good o-tackle would be better if avail. We could get a DE in the second, a good draft for OL depth. I would spend 2 of the three picks on OL if I were shanny. That is were we are losing major battles. I would even like to have an all lineman draft. Not flashy and fancy. We are pretty solid everywhere else and could afford to take lineman this draft. All but one pick, leave the 7th for Clarett. He would be a basement bargain player to see if he can play and if his attitude is better. I would try to get something out of Q on draft day and dont be surprised it the Broncs do. I would also like to see us get a first day pick for TP, maybe inconnection with Droughns. I like Droughns but would like for him to have a shot at a starters position if he wanted it. I also believe we have enough RB and FB to have a decent core without Q.
              Broncos forever!! :clap:
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              • #22
                I had to go dig this thread back up, but recent news bears watching on this topic. Alex Barron's pro day was off the charts for a lineman his size. His 40 times in the 4.8s as well as his 6'7 315 lbs. frame and 39 inch vert. makes him the most imposing and athletic linemen in the class. Talk about the surface he ran on if you must, but even without that he still would run in the 4.9 range, still fast for a tackle of his size (although I believe Walter Jones ran a 4.6). Barron is projected all over the board, but likely will settle into the 5-10 range. The only reason I bring this up is, that one, Barron has the athleticism to play in our system, two, elite players should not be discounted just because we prefer "smaller" guys, and three, and this is a serious stretch, should Pryce enable us to mve into the top 15-ish range, and Barron DOES slide, well we'll have the opportunity to pick up potentially the best lineman Denver has had in the Shanahan era.

                Most importantly, it should speak that with the increase in athleticism in taller, bigger players, it should not keep these players from being considered in our zone blocking system. Foster has shown how it can work, but guys like Barron can take it over the top.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by OhNoKoolAid
                  I had to go dig this thread back up, but recent news bears watching on this topic. Alex Barron's pro day was off the charts for a lineman his size. His 40 times in the 4.8s as well as his 6'7 315 lbs. frame and 39 inch vert. makes him the most imposing and athletic linemen in the class. Talk about the surface he ran on if you must, but even without that he still would run in the 4.9 range, still fast for a tackle of his size (although I believe Walter Jones ran a 4.6). Barron is projected all over the board, but likely will settle into the 5-10 range. The only reason I bring this up is, that one, Barron has the athleticism to play in our system, two, elite players should not be discounted just because we prefer "smaller" guys, and three, and this is a serious stretch, should Pryce enable us to mve into the top 15-ish range, and Barron DOES slide, well we'll have the opportunity to pick up potentially the best lineman Denver has had in the Shanahan era.

                  Most importantly, it should speak that with the increase in athleticism in taller, bigger players, it should not keep these players from being considered in our zone blocking system. Foster has shown how it can work, but guys like Barron can take it over the top.

                  I had no idea he would run that fast. The projections were in the 5.2 range. So much for a big lumbering type. His workout was insane good, he could very well be drafted by the Browns at pick 3 now and it wouldn't be surprising. Nobody expected him to do that well. But now that he did, it almost guarantees Brown and Barnes are going to be gone in the top 15-20 picks. Detroit will probably snag Barron if he falls to 10. The Texans will take Brown and the Chargers will take Barnes. Dallas is in the running as well for Brown.

                  Also, there is another dark horse to add to the mix, Alabama's Wes Britt for late first round sleeper.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Mat'hir Uth Gan
                    I had no idea he would run that fast. The projections were in the 5.2 range. So much for a big lumbering type. His workout was insane good, he could very well be drafted by the Browns at pick 3 now and it wouldn't be surprising. Nobody expected him to do that well. But now that he did, it almost guarantees Brown and Barnes are going to be gone in the top 15-20 picks. Detroit will probably snag Barron if he falls to 10. The Texans will take Brown and the Chargers will take Barnes. Dallas is in the running as well for Brown.

                    Also, there is another dark horse to add to the mix, Alabama's Wes Britt for late first round sleeper.
                    I'm so glad you mentioned Britt, because I've been singing the praises of these Bama guys, based one their system transitioning into our zone blocking. I think Britt falls into late second, early third, just because he can't keep his leg healthy. Sporting News compares him to Jon Jansen, but more athletic. We could use a Jansen-type mauler on the right side after Foster departs.

                    Another second round guy to watch is Adam Terry, another athletic 6'7+ guy. The draft has more depth at tackle than you might think. Oh, and through Kaczur into the mix to. He's shorter at 6'4, but has the athleticism Denver likes.

                    For all the insane publicity Robert Gallery recieved, while producing average results, I'm shocked that Barron is not being trumpeted about too, being that he is more athletic than Gallery. This just proves how overrated the "game" attitude is. Guys like Walter Jones, Levi Jones, Orlando Pace and Chris Samuels aren't seen as these overactive "blue collar" players, but they are some of the best in the league. I'm not saying work ethic isn't important, but if you use it to determine who to draft, as people on this board do for Roth, then you will miss several great players who aren't as "showy" in their intensity. "Blue Collar" is overrated, but lazy is not.

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                    • #25
                      I wouldn't be at all surprised if Shanahan is thinking the same thing as you Matt.

                      Remember in 2002 when he had targeted Bryant McKinnie OT who was expected to be available when Denver drafted at 19, but who was taken (in a move that surprised experts everywhere) by Minn. at #7? Shanahan admitted to Adam Schefter that they would have taken him if he were available.

                      But, it sounds like neither Barnes nor Brown would be available even at #17. I can't imagine the Broncos getting any higher than #17 by packaging Pryce & trading up. So, this whole thing may be moot, but I would imagine Shanahan would go for the best available athlete DL or OL.
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