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Your comparison to Duke/Gates isn't neccessarily correlative to the Freeney/Dumervil comparion.
Duke was either going to be a complete hit or miss. Players like him are always going to be. Ones that have great athletic ability, but haven't played since HS. Duke hadn't ever really proved himself.
Obviously, or so it seems to Shanny, Duke was a miss.
Dumervil is compared to Freeney because he played against a similar level of competition, got roughly the same stats, and is roughly the same size.
And I'm really tired of people saying,''All of Dumervil's stats came against weak teams.'' 20 sacks is 20 sacks, people. I didn't know half of Louisville's schedule was against Div. II schools. No one seemed to say anything when Suggs was manhandled all day by 18-year old Ritchie Incognito, when he racked up 20+ sacks.
He isnt Freeny, his sacks probably were against bad teams. IDK but i do know that when teams starting trying to block him they shut him down, look at the last half of the season..
And how isnt Dumbervile a hit or miss. With his size your always a hit or miss at DE. The biggest differences in the NFl from college is the size and speed of the players. Dumbervile isnt getting much bigger but his oppenents are going to be bigger than he is used too.
Especially against the good O-lines in the AFCW, this is assuming OK's newer additions will make thier line a lil better
There is a lot of players out there that came out of college and scouts said they were too short. Here some examples of what i'm talking about: Zach Thomas, Dwight Freeney, Darrent Williams, and here's the best one Sam Mills. And thats just on defence off the top of my head. Just because a player is labled 'too short' doesn't mean he can't play. One thing about all those players is they have great instincts. What i mean they have the ability to see plays before they happen and get to the ball and be one step ahead of everyone else. that goes toward filling any size or talent gap. I don't know how many of you read some of the draft guides but i do and in one of the magazines it talks about players with good defenive instincts and they said a good pick would be DE Elvis Dumervil. Last year we draft Darrent Williams and everyone said he was to short play, it was wasted pick, he's nothin more than a kick returner. Now look at him. He brought a aggressive play making ability to the Broncos that the Broncos hadn't had in a while. To me Dumervil will be fixture on the Dline for years to come.
To me, he will be in Denver for years to come, because your Dline will never be addressed so he will be needed for the pass rush. But especially not a fixture or a starter.
Your comparison to Duke/Gates isn't neccessarily correlative to the Freeney/Dumervil comparion.
Duke was either going to be a complete hit or miss. Players like him are always going to be. Ones that have great athletic ability, but haven't played since HS. Duke hadn't ever really proved himself.
Obviously, or so it seems to Shanny, Duke was a miss.
Dumervil is compared to Freeney because he played against a similar level of competition, got roughly the same stats, and is roughly the same size.
And I'm really tired of people saying,''All of Dumervil's stats came against weak teams.'' 20 sacks is 20 sacks, people. I didn't know half of Louisville's schedule was against Div. II schools. No one seemed to say anything when Suggs was manhandled all day by 18-year old Ritchie Incognito, when he racked up 20+ sacks.
If 20 sacks is 20 sacks then I guess Chris Gocong was a better college DE because he won the Buch Buchanan award as the best Division I-AA defensive player with 23 sacks, more than Dumervil had.
"And we all know that stats don't mean anything if you don't have the wins to back them up"-ChampWJ
It's a good thing Jay Cutler was a proven winner in college. Oh wait, nevermind.
No comparison between gocong's 23 and Dumervil"s 20 sacks.
Originally posted by kmartin575
If 20 sacks is 20 sacks then I guess Chris Gocong was a better college DE because he won the Buch Buchanan award as the best Division I-AA defensive player with 23 sacks, more than Dumervil had.
Come on, we will wait and see if Gocong ends up being a better NFL prospect then Dumervil. Gocong played for Cal Poly with the attendence of his biggest home game being just over 8,000. He was a reach and the Eagles will be sorry they passed over Elvis in the 3rd round. I have no idea why we are not hearing the same undersized comments being made about this kid who played I-AA. He is 6'0 and weighs 264. Elvis is 5'11 - 258. I bet Gocong never played nose or tackle even though he outwieghs Dumervil. Possibly lack of talent. I am sticking to my guns, DUMERVIL will be a beast!
If 20 sacks is 20 sacks then I guess Chris Gocong was a better college DE because he won the Buch Buchanan award as the best Division I-AA defensive player with 23 sacks, more than Dumervil had.
LOL NICE point Kmart....
BTW if anyone really knows who this guys is i will give you a CP.
Thats how unknown he is.....
Come on, we will wait and see if Gocong ends up being a better NFL prospect then Dumervil. Gocong played for Cal Poly with the attendence of his biggest home game being just over 8,000. He was a reach and the Eagles will be sorry they passed over Elvis in the 3rd round. I have no idea why we are not hearing the same undersized comments being made about this kid who played I-AA. He is 6'0 and weighs 264. Elvis is 5'11 - 258. I bet Gocong never played nose or tackle even though he outwieghs Dumervil. Possibly lack of talent. I am sticking to my guns, DUMERVIL will be a beast!
See can you say homer, everyone says 20 sacks is 20sacks. NO matter the opponents, no matter on what level but when it comes to someone being better than Dumbervile it all of sudden matters
[QUOTE=D.J.55]There is a lot of players out there that came out of college and scouts said they were too short. Here some examples of what i'm talking about: Zach Thomas, Dwight Freeney, Darrent Williams, and here's the best one Sam Mills.
You forgot about one Al Wilson. Big Al was considered a reach (no pun intended) when we took him with the last pick in the first round due to his lack of ideal height. I think he's more than answered his critics. One thing they can't measure at the combine and pro days is the size of a players heart. I would take 11 Al Wilson's on my starting defense any day of the week.
I'll hold judgement until I see what Dumervil brings on Sunday. Hopefully you nay sayers will be dining on crow.
If 20 sacks is 20 sacks then I guess Chris Gocong was a better college DE because he won the Buch Buchanan award as the best Division I-AA defensive player with 23 sacks, more than Dumervil had.
Wow, if you had a pair of eyes, you would've read...
Originally posted by Nick7
20 sacks is 20 sacks, people. I didn't know half of Louisville's schedule was against Div. II schools.
BTW, Dumervil won the Bronko Nagurski award, which is given to the nation's best defensive player...
Wow, if you had a pair of eyes, you would've read...
BTW, Dumervil won the Bronko Nagurski award, which is given to the nation's best defensive player...
...nice try.
And Eric Crouch out of Nebraska and Jason White out of Oklahoma both won a Heisman. Tell me, how have there NFL careers turned out? Oh, that's right. They are not in the NFL. College football awards mean nothing.
"And we all know that stats don't mean anything if you don't have the wins to back them up"-ChampWJ
It's a good thing Jay Cutler was a proven winner in college. Oh wait, nevermind.
He isnt Freeny, his sacks probably were against bad teams. IDK but i do know that when teams starting trying to block him they shut him down, look at the last half of the season..
And how isnt Dumbervile a hit or miss. With his size your always a hit or miss at DE. The biggest differences in the NFl from college is the size and speed of the players. Dumbervile isnt getting much bigger but his oppenents are going to be bigger than he is used too.
Especially against the good O-lines in the AFCW, this is assuming OK's newer additions will make thier line a lil better
The last half of the season? Do mean when he was constantly getting double teamed because teams recognized his ability.
He's not much of a hit or miss player because he has already proven himself, unlike Duke. I also liked how brought up speed. While Tamba has the size, I'm not sure his 5.0+ 40 is going to cut it, being that the NFL is based solely on size and speed...
The last half of the season? Do mean when he was constantly getting double teamed because teams recognized his ability.
He's not much of a hit or miss player because he has already proven himself, unlike Duke. I also liked how brought up speed. While Tamba has the size, I'm not sure his 5.0+ 40 is going to cut it, being that the NFL is based solely on size and speed...
At least get your facts straight. 5.0+ 40 time? Sorry, but he ran a 4.86 at his pro day and his real time is actually a little faster than that (he has been timed at around 4.7-4.75).
"And we all know that stats don't mean anything if you don't have the wins to back them up"-ChampWJ
It's a good thing Jay Cutler was a proven winner in college. Oh wait, nevermind.
Which is why you brought up that Gocong won the Buchanan award?
I also like how you strayed away from my main point....
The Buchanan award had nothing to do with that argument, I shouldn't have even mentioned it. My point was that he had 23 sacks. You guys said sacks are sacks so his 23 sacks are better than Dumervil's 20 sacks, regardless of the competition level.
"And we all know that stats don't mean anything if you don't have the wins to back them up"-ChampWJ
It's a good thing Jay Cutler was a proven winner in college. Oh wait, nevermind.
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