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  • #16
    Originally posted by lancane
    Well as I stated it will be not the question of what position, but more or less who can they get to! Denver has some key needs: HB, DT, OT, OG, DE, S and FB right now are the needs.

    No first round fullbacks, offensive tackles or sure fire defensive tackles will be there at 21 - halfbacks and offensive tackles in that round would all take movement on Denver's part and to be realistic the only real true player we could reach from either group would be Marshawn Lynch. Defensive Ends and Safeties are more possible. So to me it is simply where will Shanahan go: If he trades down a few slots then the game is wide open with Joe Staley (OT) Central Michigan, Kenny Irons (HB) Auburn, Charles Johnson (DE) Georgia, Victor Abiamiri (DE) Notre Dame all likely to be available he could take almost any and feel it was not a huge reach. If Shanahan moves up between the 12th to the 15th spot then it is very likely he is aiming for Lynch...and yet if we stay I would almost say he is taking a safety or reaching for an end that could fall, however my money would be on safety at that point.

    I would love to get Marshawn Lynch if we move up, if we stay where we are at then I am all for Michael Griffin and if he trades down I would be all for either Joe Staley or Victor Abiamiri, but that is just how I see it.
    Other than me stating Nelson would be our choice at 21, you and I are seeing eye to eye on this

    Great post lancane, nothing new there
    I owe CP's to: no one

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    • #17
      I can not wait till all the safty fans get here. I think there are some good safties but just do not like to take a safty in the 1st round unless just flat the BPA.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by TR3Y
        Other than me stating Nelson would be our choice at 21, you and I are seeing eye to eye on this

        Great post lancane, nothing new there
        Well I like Nelson, however I think he is not a versatile as Griffith who has shot up to second on my safety boards, he is a physical specimen that loves to hit and has good hands and while Nelson is no sissy, I have seen him bumble on long strides in major collisions and that is not our prototypical safety, either would be a good pick...I just happen to think Griffin is a better Bronco prospect then Nelson who I think may go to New York right before we pick, maybe. If Nelson is there I could see them taking him though.

        If we trade down far enough 28th to 32nd I would be real happy if Denver reached and took Staley or Abiamiri. And I am no opposed to trading out of the first for more, I know many are saying get picks the next year. We will likely have a load of comp picks the following year and we still have Washington's 4th Round pick, I think we will be overstocked next year as is. So I would rather Denver if they did do so, traded before the draft and got a mid to high 2nd, 3rd and 4th Round pick and maybe another the following, while I know the quality drops a little it still would give us more to fill needs.

        But as of right now my pick if we remain where our picks are is Michael Griffin.

        Comment


        • #19
          I like how, by the end of the past 2 seasons, everyone has been complaining and talking crap about how we never fix our d-line. We don't ever have the money to go in FA, since good d-lineman are some of the most costly FA's. There are always about 10 articles talking about how we haven't used top picks and have only brought in castoffs for the past few years. Then by the time the draft rolls around, 2/3 of the people here don't want a d-lineman with the first pick.

          D-line is obviously our biggest need. Why does everyone stray from that and talk about how we should pick up these other positions? This draft has so many good d-lineman in it. If we picked up 2-3 in the first 4 rounds, we could have a very good d-line for the next 10 years.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by lancane
            Well I like Nelson, however I think he is not a versatile as Griffith who has shot up to second on my safety boards, he is a physical specimen that loves to hit and has good hands and while Nelson is no sissy, I have seen him bumble on long strides in major collisions and that is not our prototypical safety, either would be a good pick...I just happen to think Griffin is a better Bronco prospect then Nelson who I think may go to New York right before we pick, maybe. If Nelson is there I could see them taking him though.

            If we trade down far enough 28th to 32nd I would be real happy if Denver reached and took Staley or Abiamiri. And I am no opposed to trading out of the first for more, I know many are saying get picks the next year. We will likely have a load of comp picks the following year and we still have Washington's 4th Round pick, I think we will be overstocked next year as is. So I would rather Denver if they did do so, traded before the draft and got a mid to high 2nd, 3rd and 4th Round pick and maybe another the following, while I know the quality drops a little it still would give us more to fill needs.

            But as of right now my pick if we remain where our picks are is Michael Griffin.
            Sounds great to me!! You have convinced me on Griffin

            Look at Marques Colston, you never know what a team might find in one of the later rounds....

            Stockpiling picks is not a bad thing
            I owe CP's to: no one

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by jhns
              I like how, by the end of the past 2 seasons, everyone has been complaining and talking crap about how we never fix our d-line. We don't ever have the money to go in FA, since good d-lineman are some of the most costly FA's. There are always about 10 articles talking about how we haven't used top picks and have only brought in castoffs for the past few years. Then by the time the draft rolls around, 2/3 of the people here don't want a d-lineman with the first pick.

              D-line is obviously our biggest need. Why does everyone stray from that and talk about how we should pick up these other positions? This draft has so many good d-lineman in it. If we picked up 2-3 in the first 4 rounds, we could have a very good d-line for the next 10 years.
              That would be wunnerful

              I just think that Shanny wants a RB to team with his franchise QB....
              I owe CP's to: no one

              Comment


              • #22
                Our greatest need is actually Dline but Denver should take Reggie Nelson in the 1st round. The pool of talent is deep enough that Denver should get Dlinemen in the 2nd -4th rounds. Reggie Nelson makes plays and it would be great to have someone like that.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by jhns
                  I like how, by the end of the past 2 seasons, everyone has been complaining and talking crap about how we never fix our d-line. We don't ever have the money to go in FA, since good d-lineman are some of the most costly FA's. There are always about 10 articles talking about how we haven't used top picks and have only brought in castoffs for the past few years. Then by the time the draft rolls around, 2/3 of the people here don't want a d-lineman with the first pick.

                  D-line is obviously our biggest need. Why does everyone stray from that and talk about how we should pick up these other positions? This draft has so many good d-lineman in it. If we picked up 2-3 in the first 4 rounds, we could have a very good d-line for the next 10 years.
                  Jhns it is not that we do not want a top notch defensive lineman, but fact is at the 21st position those lineman available could well slide into the second round. Sure fire first rounders: Gaines Adams, Allen Branch, Amobi Okoye, Jamaal Anderson, Adam Carriker and Jarvis Moss. And if you look at those picks there is no telling if one will be there at our pick, I highly doubt it...maybe Moss and I think we will see Denver going for an every down end like Abiamiri, Anderson, Carriker, Crowder, Moore or Atkins over the lighter ends like so many believe. I wish there was a premier defensive tackle available when we pick, but likely there will not be. So the question becomes what talent and where, Marshawn Lynch is a halfback which is a need and within reach or we move down and get a need and safety is a need as well and at our current spot is a sure fire caliber pickup...that is all it is, we are tired of signing reaches that do not make the team after their third year.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by lancane
                    Jhns it is not that we do not want a top notch defensive lineman, but fact is at the 21st position those lineman available could well slide into the second round. Sure fire first rounders: Gaines Adams, Allen Branch, Amobi Okoye, Jamaal Anderson, Adam Carriker and Jarvis Moss. And if you look at those picks there is no telling if one will be there at our pick, I highly doubt it...maybe Moss and I think we will see Denver going for an every down end like Abiamiri, Anderson, Carriker, Crowder, Moore or Atkins over the lighter ends like so many believe. I wish there was a premier defensive tackle available when we pick, but likely there will not be. So the question becomes what talent and where, Marshawn Lynch is a halfback which is a need and within reach or we move down and get a need and safety is a need as well and at our current spot is a sure fire caliber pickup...that is all it is, we are tired of signing reaches that do not make the team after their third year.

                    Exactly!!!! Like my 1st post stated, the possibilty of a guy the Broncos are targeting at both D-Line and RB sliding to the 21st pick is not too realistic as most of these guys are prolly top 15 picks....

                    I understand that D-Line is a MAJOR need, however, when you consistantly win around 10+ games, drafting in the 20's doesn't allow a team much leverage as far as getting a top notch D-Lineman, considering, just about every team feels that the position is a need and thus all of the sure fire D-Lineman are gone by the 20's....

                    The Broncos wanted Tommie Harris badly a couple years back, but they were a pick or two short of landing him....it's not like the Broncos don't try to get these guys, they are just always to far down the draft board to make it happen....

                    Last year they shocked most and traded up and got their franchise QB, maybe this year could be the same
                    Last edited by TR3Y; 02-27-2007, 09:35 AM.
                    I owe CP's to: no one

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by lancane
                      Well I like Nelson, however I think he is not a versatile as Griffith who has shot up to second on my safety boards, he is a physical specimen that loves to hit and has good hands and while Nelson is no sissy, I have seen him bumble on long strides in major collisions and that is not our prototypical safety, either would be a good pick...I just happen to think Griffin is a better Bronco prospect then Nelson who I think may go to New York right before we pick, maybe. If Nelson is there I could see them taking him though.

                      If we trade down far enough 28th to 32nd I would be real happy if Denver reached and took Staley or Abiamiri. And I am no opposed to trading out of the first for more, I know many are saying get picks the next year. We will likely have a load of comp picks the following year and we still have Washington's 4th Round pick, I think we will be overstocked next year as is. So I would rather Denver if they did do so, traded before the draft and got a mid to high 2nd, 3rd and 4th Round pick and maybe another the following, while I know the quality drops a little it still would give us more to fill needs.

                      But as of right now my pick if we remain where our picks are is Michael Griffin.

                      I agree with trading down and think that it is a high possibility. If there is not a BPA. in a need area it is the best plan.I still think we will get a draft pick in a plummer trade also. where, we will not go there here, i will keep it on topic.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by redsandcowboy
                        I agree with trading down and think that it is a high possibility. If there is not a BPA. in a need area it is the best plan.I still think we will get a draft pick in a plummer trade also. where, we will not go there here, i will keep it on topic.
                        Ya think

                        I doubt he will get traded and he will eventually be released....

                        I owe CP's to: no one

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by lancane
                          Jhns it is not that we do not want a top notch defensive lineman, but fact is at the 21st position those lineman available could well slide into the second round. Sure fire first rounders: Gaines Adams, Allen Branch, Amobi Okoye, Jamaal Anderson, Adam Carriker and Jarvis Moss. And if you look at those picks there is no telling if one will be there at our pick, I highly doubt it...maybe Moss and I think we will see Denver going for an every down end like Abiamiri, Anderson, Carriker, Crowder, Moore or Atkins over the lighter ends like so many believe. I wish there was a premier defensive tackle available when we pick, but likely there will not be. So the question becomes what talent and where, Marshawn Lynch is a halfback which is a need and within reach or we move down and get a need and safety is a need as well and at our current spot is a sure fire caliber pickup...that is all it is, we are tired of signing reaches that do not make the team after their third year.

                          There will be at least 3 d-lineman that we can take at 21 and get good value. With as many good d-lineman as their are in the first few rounds, it makes that excuss really seem like it isn't thought out.

                          I hear that a lot, but you are still dodging our biggest need. We won't get good d-lineman in FA so we have to do it in the draft, and early.

                          You will be the same person complaining next season when our d-line sucks again because we picked a safety or something in this draft. It just doesn't make any sense to me at all why this cycle is continuing over multiple seasons. You don't have to make excusses when you want to see us take another position, it just is irritating when at least 100% of the fans where crying about the d-line and now half of them don't want to fix it....

                          Also, we have 1 safety that has been a consistent pro bowler on our team. The other side we have a guy that played great. In fact, when he went down we went from giving up the 10 points a game to giving up 25. The results obviously show that we where getting good play from safety.

                          There is no way that safety is even close to being as big of a need as d-line. The only need we have at safety, is getting younger players that can develope and start when our older players retire soon. They don't need to play this year or probably the next. Why exactly should we use our best pick and best chance of making a need better on something that isnt much of a need.
                          Last edited by jhns; 02-27-2007, 12:44 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by lancane
                            Jhns it is not that we do not want a top notch defensive lineman, but fact is at the 21st position those lineman available could well slide into the second round. Sure fire first rounders: Gaines Adams, Allen Branch, Amobi Okoye, Jamaal Anderson, Adam Carriker and Jarvis Moss. And if you look at those picks there is no telling if one will be there at our pick, I highly doubt it...maybe Moss and I think we will see Denver going for an every down end like Abiamiri, Anderson, Carriker, Crowder, Moore or Atkins over the lighter ends like so many believe. I wish there was a premier defensive tackle available when we pick, but likely there will not be. So the question becomes what talent and where, Marshawn Lynch is a halfback which is a need and within reach or we move down and get a need and safety is a need as well and at our current spot is a sure fire caliber pickup...that is all it is, we are tired of signing reaches that do not make the team after their third year.

                            After the Combine, Pick 21 looks to have great value and options.

                            1) DE - Jarvis Moss, Charles Johnson, Anthony Spencer, and perhaps Tim Crowder. Johnson and Crowder being Power Ends, our biggest need atm. Could probably trade down a few slots and grab Crowder, maybe.

                            2) DT - Marcus Thomas, Alan Branch, and Justin Harrell. Alan Branch would probably fit Bates' system the best. I'd prefer Marcus Thomas. Its probably too early for Harrell.

                            3) S - Reggie Nelson and Michael Griffin. Both would fit.

                            4) CB - Darrelle Revis and Aaron Ross. Both would fit and both are good return men, especially Ross.


                            If you trade down from 21 5+ slots, you likely will lose out on the chance to draft Revis, Ross, Nelson, Branch, Griffin, Moss, and possibly Thomas (who knows where he will be drafted, he is the most talented DT in the draft though).

                            In my opinion, if we want a Rush End, I think staying put and hoping for Jarvis Moss or possibly Anthony Spencer makes sense. After they go, there is very little left besides gambling on Quentin Moses at some point. If we want a Power End, we could trade back 10-20 slots and still get a solid player. Perhaps the player won't be as good as Charles Johnson, but you could get a guy like Victor Abimari and possibly Tim Crowder still, perhaps even take a flier on Baraka Atkins.

                            Trading down for a CB would be bad as you would lose out on impact players.

                            Trading down for a safety could work. Meriweather might still be around, and if not, there are some solid safeties that would be available in late Round 2 like Weddle, Rouse, Gattis, and Wendling. You would lose out on an all around impact safety though.

                            If we want an OT, thats a good spot to draft Joe Staley, trading down would mean Tony Ugoh or James Martin.

                            If we want a RB, 21 is a terrible slot. Lynch won't be around, and there is nobody else worth that pick. Trading down and netting Antonio Pittman or Tony Hunt would be smart.

                            If we want a WR, 21 is a great spot to grab one of the slipping elites like a Dwayne Jarret, Ted Ginn, Dwayne Bowe, or Robert Meachem. Trading back could net you a decent WR like Anthony Gonzalez, Craig Davis, Jason Hill, or perhaps even a slipping Sidney Rice.


                            SUMMARY:

                            If we want a Pass Rushing DE, Instant Impact Safety, Elite Ceiling WR, Elite CB/KR, or the chance at a slipping player like Branch or a slight reach like Staley, we stay put.

                            If we want a RB, a Power End, a DT, an OT, or just want to stock pile picks, then we should trade down.

                            If we want Adam Carriker, Marshawn Lynch, possibly Ted Ginn, possibly Alan Branch, possibly Jamaal Anderson or Jarvis Moss, and any of Leon Hall, Chris Houston or LaRon Landry. We would need to trade up.

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                            • #29
                              Chris Houston the corner from Arkansas is a freak! He did 27 reps on the bench and ran a 4.32 with a '37 inch vertical jump! Mayock was showing how he shut down Jarrett in the USC vs. Arkansas matchup. He also bottled up Dwayne Bowe and Calvin Johnson when the faced off. I think he will be the first corner taken now.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Mat'hir Uth Gan
                                After the Combine, Pick 21 looks to have great value and options.

                                1) DE - Jarvis Moss, Charles Johnson, Anthony Spencer, and perhaps Tim Crowder. Johnson and Crowder being Power Ends, our biggest need atm. Could probably trade down a few slots and grab Crowder, maybe.

                                2) DT - Marcus Thomas, Alan Branch, and Justin Harrell. Alan Branch would probably fit Bates' system the best. I'd prefer Marcus Thomas. Its probably too early for Harrell.

                                3) S - Reggie Nelson and Michael Griffin. Both would fit.

                                4) CB - Darrelle Revis and Aaron Ross. Both would fit and both are good return men, especially Ross.


                                If you trade down from 21 5+ slots, you likely will lose out on the chance to draft Revis, Ross, Nelson, Branch, Griffin, Moss, and possibly Thomas (who knows where he will be drafted, he is the most talented DT in the draft though).

                                In my opinion, if we want a Rush End, I think staying put and hoping for Jarvis Moss or possibly Anthony Spencer makes sense. After they go, there is very little left besides gambling on Quentin Moses at some point. If we want a Power End, we could trade back 10-20 slots and still get a solid player. Perhaps the player won't be as good as Charles Johnson, but you could get a guy like Victor Abimari and possibly Tim Crowder still, perhaps even take a flier on Baraka Atkins.

                                Trading down for a CB would be bad as you would lose out on impact players.

                                Trading down for a safety could work. Meriweather might still be around, and if not, there are some solid safeties that would be available in late Round 2 like Weddle, Rouse, Gattis, and Wendling. You would lose out on an all around impact safety though.

                                If we want an OT, thats a good spot to draft Joe Staley, trading down would mean Tony Ugoh or James Martin.

                                If we want a RB, 21 is a terrible slot. Lynch won't be around, and there is nobody else worth that pick. Trading down and netting Antonio Pittman or Tony Hunt would be smart.

                                If we want a WR, 21 is a great spot to grab one of the slipping elites like a Dwayne Jarret, Ted Ginn, Dwayne Bowe, or Robert Meachem. Trading back could net you a decent WR like Anthony Gonzalez, Craig Davis, Jason Hill, or perhaps even a slipping Sidney Rice.


                                SUMMARY:

                                If we want a Pass Rushing DE, Instant Impact Safety, Elite Ceiling WR, Elite CB/KR, or the chance at a slipping player like Branch or a slight reach like Staley, we stay put.

                                If we want a RB, a Power End, a DT, an OT, or just want to stock pile picks, then we should trade down.

                                If we want Adam Carriker, Marshawn Lynch, possibly Ted Ginn, possibly Alan Branch, possibly Jamaal Anderson or Jarvis Moss, and any of Leon Hall, Chris Houston or LaRon Landry. We would need to trade up.
                                Very nice

                                Sounds like you along with lancane are the board draft guru's!!!! (No disrespect to anyone else with a vast draft knowledge )

                                I enjoyed reading your post and look forward to seeing more of your insight
                                I owe CP's to: no one

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