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Official Game day thread: Week 12 2004 Broncos vs Raiders

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  • We need to be agressive on D if we arent how do we expect to force turnovers?


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    • Don't have a link but seeing that hit and now reminded of it, sure gives me a warm fuzzy! Wheatley got JACKED UP!
      :usa: *** God Bless Our Military Men And Women*** :usa:

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      • I wish but sadly I don't.

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        Sig made by me. Click top sig to view my Graphics Portfolio.

        There are three things you can expect in life:

        1. Death
        2. Taxes
        3. The Ball Being Picked Off by Champ Bailey

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        • Originally posted by #1 Griffin Fan
          Don't blame Elam. The snap was very high, and the FG blocking was bad. If the snap was good, then we would've won.
          You're right about that. It was a damn jailbreak up the middle. The push that they got was ridiculous.
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          "Today's the tomorrow that you should've feared yesterday."

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          • All we need is....

            2 things:

            A punter and a good kick retruner. We ALWAYS lose the field position battle. We don't have a return for a TD. Come to think of it, we haven't even brought one back more than 35 yards. Just those 2 things and we'll be a playoff team.





            Doesn't he look good?

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            • I think Luke has a lot of potential to be a stud Kick returner.

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              • Originally posted by Emancipator
                It wasn't so much as bad coaching. Mike Shannahan is one of the top 4 coaches in the NFL. Period. Most of the blame should fall on the players. The defensive secondary scheme is not working. Champ must work better on his technique for covering down field. He is getting caught peeking in the backfield too often. Champ is being exposed. But he can bounce back. Don't forget Mike did not fumble twice. Mike did not allow the Faiders to get the push up the middle to block the field goal. Mike did not miss the reception in the endzone with 30 seconds left in the game. Mike did not throw the interception at the goaline. Mike did become to conservative with 7 minutes on the clock.

                Broncos mus mix things up in the secondary. Allow champ to cover guys one on one. Then double the guy on certain downs. They go after Champ deep because there is no help for Champ deep. But they never go after Champ with the 1o and 15 yarders. Just a 3 yarder then the 50 yard bombs.
                Players do not make the call for a bomb to a rookie in the back of the end zone in the snow with a slippery ball!Not to mention the lack of passing,did Jake call that?
                I think not.When they key in on your running game pass the dam ball! It aint rocket science!When you run the same guy play after play after play after play the defense even the dumdars faiders get smart to your next move.
                A big lead was blown in Mile high!I cant stand it! To the faiders off all teams!
                I am gonna call Dr Phil!My anger is getting outta hand!
                If you ain't a Bronco you don't know FOOTBALL


                You can win one and think you are a winner and then you can be a Raider or a KC fan and still be a loser when you win!

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                • i dont think the stadium got as loud as when wilson hit wheatley IMO

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                  • About Coyer, let me explain some things....

                    Ive said our Defense was overrated all season long. Its not a bad defense, we have some good pieces, but we are weak at the most important area on defense and since we didnt address it in last years draft, its not likely to be fixed for 2-3 seasons as our rookies from this coming draft learn the game.

                    Even though DJ Williams looks really good, we shot ourselves in the foot by passing on Wilfork, Udeze, and Smith. We could have gotten by and still dominated with Ian Gold or probably even Terry Pierce. We are NOT getting by without a dominating D-lineman. Allow me to explain some things...

                    A dominating D-lineman requires two blockers on almost every play. This means the fullback, TE, or RB is required to help block the pass rushing threat. This opens up the possibility to blitz because our blitzer has the chance to get through unblocked. Particularly the LBs are freed up to blitz at will.

                    However, we have no D-lineman who requires a doubleteam. What this means is that the fullback, TE, or RB is sitting back waiting to pick up our blitzer and then we will be torched to the open spot on the field because the blitzer was picked up.

                    Its not Coyer's fault. You cant blitz if your blizter is simply going to be picked up and blocked. Understand that we dont have big, aggressive DT's that clog blockers, and we dont have DE's that need to be doubleteamed. Our D-line may be the worst in the NFL. Its been not as exposed because our secondary and LBs are so good. And waiting for an aging Pryce to come back and dominate is not likely going to happen. Anytime a 300 lb man has spine problems, that generally spells the end of their career.

                    So, here's the deal....

                    Denver's secondary is Super Bowl calibur, as are our LBs. However, a bad D-line negates both of those facts. A QB sitting back there with all day to pass will beat our secondary, and we cant blitz our LBs because they will just be blocked because our D-line doesnt compress the pocket or demand doubleteams.

                    The truth is we are going to be beaten by teams like Indianapolis and New England until we can sign playmakers on the D-line. Realistically, this is going to take several years. Plummer's contract will prevent us from signing any marquee FA's and the only way is to develop pass rushers through the draft. But since we passed on the very best D-linemen draft of the last decade last year and since this year is weak for D-linemen, we won't be winning anything for several years unless we strike gold on some no-name DE or DT.

                    So, please quit blaming Coyer, you don't know what youre talking about. You cant blitz if your blitzer will just be blocked. A team is only as good as its O-line and D-line. We have a great O-line and crappy D-line which means we are an average team that may miss the playoffs. Though, even if we get in, with this year's team, we cant beat Indy or NE.

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                    • Good points. You've been playing the same tune all year. At least you're consistent.

                      I think we were banking on the idea that Trevor would not be out the extended amount of time that he is, after all he's been pretty durable during his entire career with us. He's your dominating D lineman who commands a double team on almost every play. But he's out and the D line is struggling.

                      Shanny took a gamble by taking DJ, but considering the way he's playing, I can't complain about that. We needed depth at LB plus we weren't gonna sign Gold given the money that he wanted. Gold's departure and Mobley being injured left the LB corps dangerously thin. I have no problem with Shanny taking DJ and then trying to fill in the defensive line with some free agents.

                      The key, however, was Pryce staying healthy and commanding the attention of the opposing offense. But after he got injured, we lost that stud lineman that all D lines need. So now we have no pass rush and have to resort to blitzes mostly to get after the QB.

                      I have no problem with Shanny taking DJ because Trevor has always been a rock in our defense and there was nothing leading up to his injury to prove otherwise IMO.
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                      "Today's the tomorrow that you should've feared yesterday."

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                      • Man, You just never let it go, do you?

                        I partially agree with you, A D-line is important. But remember we have been playing without the dominant D-Lineman on our roster. Pryce is the guy you described that takes the double teams. Besides, And I may be wrong but it is not like I hear Smith, Udaze or Wilfork tearing it up. And here in Seattle they drafted Tubbs in the 1st round and he has done "jack nipple". So what affect would these guys be providing THIS year.

                        No, the mistake has been made with our 2nd pick in the 2nd round. I said before the draft we should take Keary Colbert with that pick, but Razor and a few others said he wouldn't be around. Well he was still there, and we missed him. I would say Colbert is head and shoulders above Watts. There was our draft mistake.

                        Defensively, my dissapointment is with the secondary. We have been beaten time and time again vertically down the field. Why? because we have no speed at safety. Lynch is a great guy, a leader all that ytou want in a football player. But both him and Kennedy are in the same mold and don't have the speed to help n the deep ball. I would also say Champ is a bit of a dissappointment. So called "shut down" corners should not be giving up TD's as often as he does. I still think we need another player in the secondary. They also can have a more immediate impact. Is there a Sean Taylor/Roy Williams type safety coming out?

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                        • Originally posted by SCI03
                          Man, You just never let it go, do you?

                          I partially agree with you, A D-line is important. But remember we have been playing without the dominant D-Lineman on our roster. Pryce is the guy you described that takes the double teams. Besides, And I may be wrong but it is not like I hear Smith, Udaze or Wilfork tearing it up. And here in Seattle they drafted Tubbs in the 1st round and he has done "jack nipple". So what affect would these guys be providing THIS year.

                          No, the mistake has been made with our 2nd pick in the 2nd round. I said before the draft we should take Keary Colbert with that pick, but Razor and a few others said he wouldn't be around. Well he was still there, and we missed him. I would say Colbert is head and shoulders above Watts. There was our draft mistake.

                          Defensively, my dissapointment is with the secondary. We have been beaten time and time again vertically down the field. Why? because we have no speed at safety. Lynch is a great guy, a leader all that ytou want in a football player. But both him and Kennedy are in the same mold and don't have the speed to help n the deep ball. I would also say Champ is a bit of a dissappointment. So called "shut down" corners should not be giving up TD's as often as he does. I still think we need another player in the secondary. They also can have a more immediate impact. Is there a Sean Taylor/Roy Williams type safety coming out?
                          I disagree because it doesnt matter how fast is your safety if the Qb have all the time in the world to pass. it is true that lynch is not very fast but I still believe that theyre using him the wrong way. Lynch is a Strong Safety. In tampa he played a lot covering the flat or covering the TE and supporting the run defense and only sometimes he covered the deep zone, I agree hes not very fast and plus I saw the entire secondary having problems running in the snow. but you cant blame them I think the problem is the Qb preassure, we need to blitz more so the secondary can intercept more. We need a decent DL because our secondary is one of the best already, but again playing man to man cover with Lynch helping in the deep zone and more concentrated in helping herndon because bailey is better and kennedy playing as a Linebacker and without Qb preassure is simply suicide and even so still our defense is one of the best
                          Lynch'em all of them

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                          • The Game, in my Eyes

                            What an awesome game to watch, for one thing (loss or not).

                            Some things I'd like to say:

                            Champ's main attribute was literally swept away because of the snow. Bailey's closing speed was slowed in the soup that was the snow and mud. Cleats eventually get clogged up between the spikes. Notice the lack of cutbacks by just about everybody. However... I can't really excuse him getting burned twice.

                            Rod Smith should've caught the pass that was intercepted in the endzone. Anybody should blame an INT like that on the receiver. It was thrown where it should've been, Rod didn't go after it. He did what you're not supposed to: wait for it to come to you; this rule is especially emphasized when you're being covered by a corner who loves to jump in front of receivers for INTs.

                            Watts dropped another catch that could've changed the game (or won it). The Falcons one is another game which he has dropped a clutch catch. We need to get him more involved so he doesn't make mistakes like these.

                            I knew the Raiders were gonna block it. I knew, 100% they would. The commentator mentioned it being blocked, and after a brief two-second memory scan I knew it. I knew the Raiders had large lineman that could do just that. I knew the snap would be shaky somehow, giving them time. And ultimately, like said before, I knew the block would come. And, really, its Broncos nature to lose a game like this, and in this fashion.

                            I was glad to see Herndon and Walls playing solid games, for the most part. I really think Walls should've been placed on Porter with safety support. Porter is a huge receiver and Walls heighth matches up well with him.

                            Hated seeing Knorr shank punts every time. That may have been the snow, I don't know, but his day was horrible besides handling the snaps (which most in the NFL would probably mis-handle leading to erratic and dangerous plays).

                            Ultimately, I feel sorry for Plummer.

                            Just throwing my opinions out here (haven't been on the boards in awhile). I know, it sucks to lose a game in that fashion (<remembers the Jaguars game>); but hopefully we can rebound and pull one out against the Chargers who are... dare I say... good? But really, you shut down Gates, you shut down their passing game, really. But without Walls, this leaves the question of who should do it.

                            Anyways, fun game to watch, but ghastly disappointing!


                            "When Kepler found his long-cherished belief did not agree with the most precise observation, he accepted the uncomfortable fact. He preferred the hard truth to his dearest illusions; that is the heart of science."
                            - Carl Sagan

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                            • What A Sorry Asz Team You Have......!!!!

                              HAPPY FISHING! YOU WON'T CATCH US NOW. BRING YOUR WEEPING TOWELS IF YOU'RE COMING TO THE Q NEXT SUNDAY.

                              WE WILL WHOOP YOUR ASZESZ AND B!.TCH-SLAP YOU SILLY!

                              BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!


                              "OPEN THE GATES AND LET IN THE BREES!!!!!

                              Last edited by kotong; 11-29-2004, 07:24 PM.

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                              • Dear Chargetts becareful what you ask for...You know Marty's record against the Broncos . Its like 1 for 100.. I like those odds..

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