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Umenyiora and Tuck, not highly rated in their draft

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  • Umenyiora and Tuck, not highly rated in their draft

    Umenyiora (2 out of 5 stars rating, drafted late 2nd round)
    http://profootballexperts.scout.com/...pid=23&yr=2003

    Tuck (3 out of 5 stars rating, drafted early 3rd round)
    http://profootballexperts.scout.com/...pid=23&yr=2005

    These guys are STUD DEs, just goes to show you that there is good talent in other rounds other than the 1st.


    Brandon Jacobs came from a great RB class!
    http://profootballexperts.scout.com/...24&rc=4&pid=11
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    My new favorite Bronco - KJ Hamler Guy plays inspiring football!.

  • #2
    I understand what you're saying, but how often is there "hall of fame" talent in later rounds than in the first comparatively. The winners have hall of fame talent.
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    • #3
      Originally posted by Bowie Man View Post
      I understand what you're saying, but how often is there "hall of fame" talent in later rounds than in the first comparatively. The winners have hall of fame talent.
      Hall of Fame talent is rarely even found in the first round. The idea is you can find quality players in rounds other than the first, which makes it useless for people to say we "absolutely have to" take so-and-so position in the first round. Use the first round to take BPA then fill positions of need in the latter rounds.
      sigpicthanks Freyaka

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Broncos724 View Post
        Hall of Fame talent is rarely even found in the first round. The idea is you can find quality players in rounds other than the first, which makes it useless for people to say we "absolutely have to" take so-and-so position in the first round. Use the first round to take BPA then fill positions of need in the latter rounds.
        What I am saying is that even if there might be a guy in later rounds it is safer to take a need earlier rather than later.
        PS I used the term "Hall of fame" talent to prove my point that was all.
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        • #5
          Phil Simms is on WFAN in NY... He said this about TUCK:

          Giants STOLE him. He left ND early... HAD he stayed... he would have EASILY been a top five pick the next year.

          SO... to bad DEN didn't do their homework. DEN was too concerned about getting a corner... drafting 3 of them in 2-3 rounds.

          ANYWAY... there were some scouts who felt he was a great bargain... a top ten pick going in the 3rd round!

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          • #6
            Talent can be found all over the talent pool

            it's all a crapshoot and you spend less money later on in the draft. It's all about finding guys with heart and being lucky that they don't get hurt. There are as many hits and misses in the 2nd and 3rd round as there are in the 1st. The first rounders just cost more and are higher profile players so they are more publicly known as "busts." Ted Sundquist said this, "Did you know that there are currently more college free agents active in the NFL than the combined total of all 5th, 6th and 7th round selections of the NFL draft and that those players on average have a higher playtime percentage than their counterparts in those three rounds?"
            Which just further proves that guys with heart make all the difference no matter where they are acquired. Sundquist also said, "Success here can be as good as a draft choice; Rod Smith, Matt Lepsis, Cecil Sapp, Mike Bell, Selvin Young, Erik Pears." and I agree 100% though they do look smarter when they actually draft the guy. All 31 teams passed on Tom Brady including the Pats several times and we found T. Davis in the 6th too so you do get lucky sometimes.
            Last edited by RyversEtrain; 02-04-2008, 09:12 PM.

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            • #7
              Wasn't Tuck supposed to be part of the Al Wilson trade before it went south. If so, Denver really did their homework for that draft .

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              • #8
                One guy at DE who can also play inside at times I think is going to have a nice career in the NFL is Jason Jones from Easter Michigan I wouldn't mind us drafting him with one of our 4th rounders.

                I think I read somewhere Denver was seen talking to him at the senior bowl

                also a DT Andre Fluellen from Florida St. could be a guy we could use at DT.
                Last edited by The Dyna$ty; 02-05-2008, 03:21 AM.

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                • #9
                  VAST MAJORITY of D linemen in the HOF were FIRST ROUNDERS

                  Originally posted by Broncos724 View Post
                  Hall of Fame talent is rarely even found in the first round.


                  Sorry, but the numbers in the HOF prove otherwise. The VAST MAJORITY of D linemen in the HOF were FIRST ROUNDERS.

                  Originally posted by jrfernan
                  When you look at the list below you can CLEARLY see that FIRST ROUNDERS rule the defensive line category of the HOF. At least for the players from the 70s and 80s era this applies. I didn't look at the other ten players from the 50s and 60s.

                  Members of the HOF(including Bruce Smith):

                  Reggie White DT/DE Round: 1/ Pick: 4
                  Merlin Olsen DT Round: 1 / Pick: 3
                  Mean Joe Green DT Round: 1 / Pick: 4
                  Alan Page DT Round: 1 / Pick: 15
                  Bob Lilly DT Round 1 / Pick: 13
                  Randy White DT Round: 1 / Pick: 2
                  Dan Hampton DT Round: 1 / Pick: 4
                  Bruce Smith DE Round: 1 / Pick: 1
                  Buch Buchanan DE Round 1 / Pick: 1, AFL
                  Karl Eller DE Round: 1 / Pick: 6
                  Jack Youngblood DE Round: 1 / Pick: 20
                  Lee Roy Selmon DE Round: 1 / Pick: 1
                  Howie Long DE Round: 2 / Pick: 48
                  Elvin Bethea DE Round: 3 / Pick: X
                  Deacon Jones DE Round: 14 / Pick: 186

                  The number of FIRST ROUND PICKS who are in the Hall is staggering!
                  What should that tell us? Very simple: That success in the college ranks is a clear indicator of PROBABLE success at the NFL level. Not just some success, but HOF level success.

                  BTW, why don't we review some of the most well-known members of the Broncos Ring of fame and see where they were drafted:

                  John Elway Round: 1 / Pick: 1
                  Floyd Little Round 1 / 6th Pick
                  Frank Tripucka Round 1 / Pick 9
                  Randy Gradishar Round: 1 / Pick: 14
                  Steve Atwater Round: 1 / Pick: 20
                  Dennis Smith Round: 1 / Pick: 15
                  Louie Wright Round: 1 / Pick: 17
                  Craig Morton Round: 1 / Pick: 5
                  Haven Moses Round: 1 / AFL Draft
                  Gary Zimmerman Round: 1/ Pick: 3 USFL draft
                  Billy Thompson Round: 3 / Pick 61
                  Tom Jackson Round: 4 / Pick: 88
                  Terrell Davis Round: 6 / Pick: 196
                  Karl Mecklenburg Round: 12 / Pick: 310
                  Champ Bailey(one day will be enshrined and he too was a Round 1 pick)
                  FOUR DEs were taken ahead of Michael Strahan in 1993, a draft that was SUPPOSED to be deep at DE. Strahan was taken atop the second round(not shabby). Of the five, only Strahan has been a perennial Pro Bowler and a potential HOFamer.

                  That being said, Strahan SHOULD have been a First rounder. That was BAD SCOUTING on everyone's part. The guy was considered one of THE BEST defensive players coming out of college that year and the ONLY reason he didn't come out in the first round is that he played for Texas Southern University, a 1AA school. Some scouts felt that he played lesser competion, hence inflating his great stats(he set school records for sacks and garnished a handful of awards as a top defensive player).

                  (Strahan's story reminds me of how Elvis was overlooked for the SILLY reason that he was too short. It's only a matter of time before Dumervil gets 16 to 18 sacks. BTW, you can QUOTE me on that!)

                  So, yeah, there are those like Strahan(and Howie Long), but browse the walls of the HOF and you will see that first rounders rule.
                  Last edited by jrfernan; 02-05-2008, 07:26 AM.



                  Official driver of the Steve Atwater for the HOF Bandwagon

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                  • #10
                    BTW, before we go too far with praising the Giants D line, let's see how they do AFTER Strahan retires(either this coming year, or the one after).

                    Based on what I've seen throughout the years, this Giants SB victory is a one year story(a close parallel to what the Bucs did to the favored Raiders in that SB). Strahan himself said it via a tongue-in-cheek comment: "This is the start of a NEW Dynasty!".....LOL! Michael has a great sense of humor and it showed in spades with that comment.

                    The firm reality is that their LEADER is soon leaving the team, and to find a replacement for an emotional and physical leader is.....well, just look at what happened to the Giants when Lawrence Taylor retired, or look at the Bucs when Warren Sapp left, the Eagles when Reggie White took off for the Great White North...heck, let's not go too far from the farm...how about our very own Al Wilson! Would you say our D dipped a bit after his departure?

                    Before we crown Tuck and Osi, et al, with the tag of "best steals outside of the first round", let's see how they do WITHOUT Strahan.
                    Last edited by jrfernan; 02-05-2008, 08:12 AM.



                    Official driver of the Steve Atwater for the HOF Bandwagon

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                    • #11
                      Yet you have no problem crowning Sedrick Ellis, who's never played a down in the NFL, much less make the best QB in the game piss down his leg for 4 quarters, in the biggest game in football......

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by stnzed View Post
                        Yet you have no problem crowning Sedrick Ellis, who's never played a down in the NFL, much less make the best QB in the game piss down his leg for 4 quarters, in the biggest game in football......
                        Remember these words? .....

                        01-12-2008
                        Originally posted by jrfernan
                        Forget Dorsey, Long, Laurinaitis, Connor, Phillips et al. Sedrick Elllis is THE BEST defensive player available in this year's draft.......
                        Now, read these words...

                        Michael Francis Mayock (born August 14, 1958 in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania) is a former American football safety in the NFL. Mayock is currently a college football analyst and a draft analyst for the NFL Network.

                        Feature
                        The 2008 Senior Bowl
                        Review
                        by Sam Monson
                        01-30-2008

                        http://www.footballdiner.com/seniorbowl4.html


                        quote: "Mike Mayock finally moved Ellis ABOVE Dorsey in his DT list, something you get the feeling he's been wanting to do all week."




                        Official driver of the Steve Atwater for the HOF Bandwagon

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                        • #13
                          Yet Mike Mayock is best known for his lisp......

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by stnzed View Post
                            Yet Mike Mayock is best known for his lisp......
                            Discredit anyone at any cost without any thought, ha!? What a guy!

                            http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/02/sp...erland&emc=rss

                            Kiper Jr. Slips on Draft Board. The No. 1 Pick Is Mayock.

                            quote:

                            "Remember this name: Mike Mayock. On Saturday, faced with better-known and certainly higher-paid analysts at ESPN during the National Football League draft, Mayock, the NFL Network's draft guru, lapped them all."

                            "Mayock demonstrated his knowledge of the sport — matched at ESPN by only the terribly underused Ron Jaworski..."

                            "Mayock was consistently more interesting than ESPN's draft maven, Mel Kiper Jr. Kiper is well informed, but Mayock interprets and explains better, perhaps because he was a player and has been in the broadcast booth."

                            "Mayock also gave the best explanation of the dynamics of the Titans' hierarchy that led to choosing Young; the ESPN analysts were too focused on why Norm Chow, who was an offensive coordinator for Leinart at Southern California and has the same job at Tennessee, will be tutoring Young."

                            "Mayock then gave a fascinating assessment of Young's assets and flaws that went considerably beyond Kiper's. With video of two angles of a single play, he demonstrated how Young misread Southern California's pass coverage and threw right while his feet and hips were aligned to the left."


                            Of course, the following MONUMENTALLY important point should be enough for you to COMPLETELY DISCREDIT Mayock, along with his "lisp":

                            "As sharp as Mayock was, he could not fix his network's tepid draft graphics, which the NFL Network knows must be improved. ESPN's were complete, omnipresent and sometimes dizzying. Graphically, ESPN was superior, although it need not herald each pick by scrawling "CURRENT SELECTION ALERT" on the screen as if it were an upgraded terrorism alert."

                            LOL!!!!!!!!!!
                            Last edited by jrfernan; 02-05-2008, 09:09 AM.



                            Official driver of the Steve Atwater for the HOF Bandwagon

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Bowie Man View Post
                              I understand what you're saying, but how often is there "hall of fame" talent in later rounds than in the first comparatively. The winners have hall of fame talent.
                              Tom Brady

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