Eating Our Young.....

[Alaskajoe]

Thats what the GD forum looks like and and what the D.T.F. forum is is becoming. Hold it together.

Lets be realistic. Look back at sept. and remember all of our predictions that we made in regards to our record. Not the ones we boasted about on the boards and to our friends. But the ones that we told ourselves, the realistic ones. I personnaly was guessing 6-8 wins.

We have learned our lessons.

Now it is time for us to move on.

1) We all knew McD was a rookie headcoach. After 6 strait wins we thought we was the second coming of Lomardi. Wrong then and now. We is rookie, and while flashing signs of the potential that Bowlen see's in him he still pulled rookie mistakes. Oddly His 1st year actually followed the same path as Mark Sanchez this year.

2) Mike Nolan is one hell of a D coordinator, just give him the playmakers he needs and let him figure it out.

3) Special teams were up and down. Outside of the punting situation I would say its an improvment.

There is a specific model that we are following. We all know what it is. Give this staff this offseason to really make the changes that they want and lets see what they can do. If 10 wins have not been achieved by this time next yr, we reevaluate.

[Snarfalicious]

I'm avoiding the GD section like the plague. Nothing but negativity. That being said, I couldn't be more excited for this offseason. It poses some problems with all the RFA's, but we have our share, too. We will trade some but keep most, and hopefully we can turn around some of those picks we are given as compensation and put them into a worthy RFA (Logan Mankins).

McDaniels has had a full year to evaluate the players we have here. He had only about a month to do this before his offseason of acquisition began last year. He will know who he wants here, and who he can do without, I'm excited to see the turnover, and to see the new talent brought in. Good riddance to Scheff and Marshall if the reports are true. Scheff is wasted in this offense, and Marshall is one run-in with the law from a substantial suspension.

We will have plenty of opportunities in this upcoming draft to introduce a bunch of young talent into the roster.

We are about as good as I could have hoped for coming out of a tumultuous offseason. I still believe in McD, and I believe in the core players who I believe will be here next year. It's just a matter of finding a adept OL, and possibly a couple other playmakers on both sides of the ball. I still maintain a lot of hope for this Denver Broncos team in the next few years.

[fraguela09]

While I do agree that Mcdaniels will be a good coach, I just wonder if it'll be in DEN.

Look, other than our kicker.... Name one position you feel good about (compared to last year) as we head into anothr offseason?

Mcdaniels took Tom Brandtater over Brian Hoyer. Right there tells me he picked the wrong guy. We're stuck with Orton-Brandstater for the next 3-4 years. All our eggs are in their basket.

We traded up for Smith and Quinn... that doesn't look wise right now.

Most of the improvements this year were patchwork soultions- we brought in aging vets. Sure it worked, and we'll continue to do that.... Just can't admit the core of our offense & defense is going in the right direction.

We had one of the worst DLs in history last year, yet we draft NADA DL prospects, and then come OAK-KC we allow almost 600 yards rushing in two games at home?

I look at the 30 guys Mcdaniels brought in, and I just don't get how DEN is set come the 2012 season?

Let's remember.... we could of drafted 2 players but we settled for Smith. The "throw-away" pick when we traded up for Quinn was Wallace (who looks good in PIT). The "throw-away" pick we dealt to CHI looked good to (Knox).

SO, we gave away 3 picks last year.... Smith doesn't look any better than Carter right now. I think he'll improve..... BUT, we all have to admit that we are not guaranteed to make wise decisions come April.

[Alaskajoe]

While I do agree that Mcdaniels will be a good coach, I just wonder if it'll be in DEN.

Look, other than our kicker.... Name one position you feel good about (compared to last year) as we head into anothr offseason?

Mcdaniels took Tom Brandtater over Brian Hoyer. Right there tells me he picked the wrong guy. We're stuck with Orton-Brandstater for the next 3-4 years. All our eggs are in their basket.

We traded up for Smith and Quinn... that doesn't look wise right now.

Most of the improvements this year were patchwork soultions- we brought in aging vets. Sure it worked, and we'll continue to do that.... Just can't admit the core of our offense & defense is going in the right direction.

We had one of the worst DLs in history last year, yet we draft NADA DL prospects, and then come OAK-KC we allow almost 600 yards rushing in two games at home?

I look at the 30 guys Mcdaniels brought in, and I just don't get how DEN is set come the 2012 season?

Let's remember.... we could of drafted 2 players but we settled for Smith. The "throw-away" pick when we traded up for Quinn was Wallace (who looks good in PIT). The "throw-away" pick we dealt to CHI looked good to (Knox).

SO, we gave away 3 picks last year.... Smith doesn't look any better than Carter right now. I think he'll improve..... BUT, we all have to admit that we are not guaranteed to make wise decisions come April.

Lets take a look at this defense that you feel we made no progress on:



Linebackers- D.J., Doom, Davis (for this year), Ayers (who really started to let the game this last quarter of the season)
Safety- includes our starters but I REALLY liked what I saw with our two rookies.
Corners- Though old still highly productive. Goodman is as good as a number 2 there is. Champ is solid 1. Smith I am worried about. This is the position on the defense that has to be looked at this offseason
DL- They are what we thought they were. Servicable journeymen. They wore down as the season went. Targeting one of the RFA DEs out there is looking like a must


Now compare this to the Defense that we had last year


Show me across all four areas where we did not improve?? The numbers also support this.

On offense it was less a lack of talent factor and more of a scheme/player incompatibility issue.

One offseason is not enough to implement the sweeping changes that McD wanted to do.

We all said this would take at least 2-3 years.

Why then are we suprised that its going to take 2-3 years?????

[Den615]

Lets take a look at this defense that you feel we made no progress on:



Linebackers- D.J., Doom, Davis (for this year), Ayers (who really started to let the game this last quarter of the season)
Safety- includes our starters but I REALLY liked what I saw with our two rookies.
Corners- Though old still highly productive. Goodman is as good as a number 2 there is. Champ is solid 1. Smith I am worried about. This is the position on the defense that has to be looked at this offseason
DL- They are what we thought they were. Servicable journeymen. They wore down as the season went. Targeting one of the RFA DEs out there is looking like a must


Now compare this to the Defense that we had last year


Show me across all four areas where we did not improve?? The numbers also support this.

On offense it was less a lack of talent factor and more of a scheme/player incompatibility issue.

One offseason is not enough to implement the sweeping changes that McD wanted to do.

We all said this would take at least 2-3 years.

Why then are we suprised that its going to take 2-3 years?????

Couldn't have said it better myself:salute!: I think our defense will be pretty much the same next year. Except I think Ayers and McBath might start, they will certainly see much more playing time. It would also be great if Alphonso Smith could take a firm hold of the nickel spot.

The only player I think could be upgraded is Kenny Peterson. He is a solid rotational lineman, but I think we need a disruptive force on the line where he plays.

[fraguela09]

I do think Ayers-Bruton-Mcbath-Smith (and even Baker I hope) will be something to build around. Still, we don't know about Baker... SO, right now we have no DL.

I mean this more moving FWD next year. Goodman was solid.... Hill was decent. But Dawkins & Champ wont be any better. Have to hope they maintain.

[Den615]

I do think Ayers-Bruton-Mcbath-Smith (and even Baker I hope) will be something to build around. Still, we don't know about Baker... SO, right now we have no DL.

I mean this more moving FWD next year. Goodman was solid.... Hill was decent. But Dawkins & Champ wont be any better. Have to hope they maintain.

I don't know about "no DL". We can improve sure, but Fields and McBean were decent, and at the very least proved they deserve playing time. Peterson I think is the weak link on our line. Like I said he is a decent rotational guy, but likely wouldn't be starting on any other 3-4 team.

I like our youth and depth at safety, so I am more worried about our age at CB. Champ is still a very good corner, but his age began to show this year. Wouldn't mind drafting a guy like Jared Odrick if we acquire another 1st round pick. If we had a guy that could consistently draw double teams on our front three Dumervil would be free to wreak even more havoc in opponents back fields.

[Lukic]

Linebacker does not need to be addressed, maybe a mid-late round pick like Micah Johnson or Jermaine Cunningham would be nice but aside from that it's not an issue.

Cornerback at the moment is fine as well, however we'll need to dig into the draft next year for one.

Safety is fine, McBath and Bruton are more than capable to becoming great players.

The D-Line isn't great, we can easily improve upon each position. In the draft we should look to do so.

[Alaskajoe]

I do think Ayers-Bruton-Mcbath-Smith (and even Baker I hope) will be something to build around. Still, we don't know about Baker... SO, right now we have no DL.

I mean this more moving FWD next year. Goodman was solid.... Hill was decent. But Dawkins & Champ wont be any better. Have to hope they maintain.

I agree, we cant expect Champ and Dawkins to continue to play at this level.

That is why I would not mind moving Champ to FS. This would extend his career ala Woodson. DOnt restructure him as an olive branch

Goodman showed that he has at least a year or two left.

McBath actually excites me with his picking up of the speed of the game.
He actually was my rookie MVP until he got hurt.

As for the line we have to go after Jolly or Seymour. If not Oghassbee(sp)
or along those lines has to be selected in the draft and be ready to play day one.

[Missing Plummer]

I agree, we cant expect Champ and Dawkins to continue to play at this level.

That is why I would not mind moving Champ to FS. This would extend his career ala Woodson. DOnt restructure him as an olive branch

I'm not sure about that move. I think that one of Champ's biggest factors is that many teams still fear him and I think that factor is best used matched up against a WR, not roaming the field.

But Denver certainly do need to think about getting some more youth in its secondary.

[Alaskajoe]

I'm not sure about that move. I think that one of Champ's biggest factors is that many teams still fear him and I think that factor is best used matched up against a WR, not roaming the field.

But Denver certainly do need to think about getting some more youth in its secondary.

But they dont fear him. Not like they did were he literally shut down one side of the field.

They throw to him more often. Slants and Double moves are his Kryptonite.

He still has the ability to be around the play all the time. But this is a factor better suited for a center fielder.

Lets move him.

[spcdlee02]

Excellent post. I hope it stays good here. Some good discussions have been started but no bashing. That's a good sign.

I have been looking at all the mock drafts I can find. Most seem to have us concentrating on the D Line or some have us taking Rolando McLain at ILB. It's hard to say where this process of rebuilding needs to continue. So many arguements can be made to go in different directions. We do need upgrades at more than one position.

That being said, I wouldn't mind seeing the Marsh trade go through. At the very least it will give us more picks and get some much needed youth at some spots. The D-Line needs an anchor. We don't have that. I'd also like to see a legit DE brought in. I wouldn't mind seeing us throw our hat in for Seymour. He won't be staying in Oakland. The guy wants to win. McD might be our ace in the hole there. That would free up Doom. Should we pick up a good space eater in the middle through the draft, and pick up a legit pass rushing end to compliment Doom through FA, or vice versa, our D Line should be solid next year.
As to the O line, we need to look at the interior. I'd love to see Logan Mankins come here. He's legit. Also what appears to be a good draft pick in possibly the 2nd round might be Jon Asamoah. What I can find about this kid is that he's quick, strong, smart, and big. Most scout say he is a force in short yardage and does well there. He is also capable of going to LG or RG. If we picked up Mankins, and drafted this kid and he did as well as most think he can, we can look to the late rounds or UDFA as a possiblitly at Center. This combined with the return of Harris and a return to form by Clady would be a potent line.
I think everything else can play off of the rebuild in those areas.

[bahn]

Excellent post. I hope it stays good here. Some good discussions have been started but no bashing. That's a good sign.

This is the DTFA section. There's no bashing here. The posters here are the ones that really care for the team. This is the best section in this forum.

:go:

[Vhailor]

I think I'll be staying in this forum over GD. Too much negativity in that place, and I'm very excited about reading all of your ideas for the off-season.

You guys are doing an outstanding job in posting your ideas, and I wish I could CP you all!

[Missing Plummer]

I wouldn't mind seeing us throw our hat in for Seymour. He won't be staying in Oakland.

I don't think Oakland is going to let Seymour make it to free agency after trading a 1st round pick for him (not even Al Davis is that dumb). If he does not sign with them (which I'm guessing he will not), expect them to put the franchise tag on him and then look to trade him when he threatens to sit out the season. And I don't see Oakland trading him to Denver.