Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

What we DON'T need

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Joshecalpoly
    replied
    Agreed, on all counts,

    With CB though some insurance with perhaps Brandon Boylin an underrated diverse pick can help

    With WR we may not have Eddie so T.Y in the 4th provides us with a good stable. Especially if St can't stay healthy

    With 3rd down offering better protection with an elite FB is a must

    We still need a C it seems and that will improve G play as well as improve all other positions

    I worry about UT still but I am waiting to see how WR plays out because as a need it may not be a top priority. This will improve Line and lb issues.

    Leave a comment:


  • THEdraftnik
    replied
    Originally posted by ironfootball39 View Post
    I know every college and nfl scheme is different but I've never seen gap numbers on defense. I have only seen technique or linemen responsibility called by numbers. Any proof otherwise or a different coaches vocabulary showing it and ill agree.

    Good defensive ends demands double team. So by dwills definition he's a Nt. Ridiculous.

    A Nt has everything by the position and front and more important technique. Any dt is suppose to demand double teams and command the los.
    The gaps are lettered. A, B, C. But teams will usually put their players in these gaps. In a 4-3;
    a team will have a nose in one of the A gaps
    a team will have an under tackle in one of the B gaps
    a team will have a defensive end in each C gap

    I don't even know what the rest of your post is trying to say... You lost me at dwills definition.

    Originally posted by ironfootball39 View Post
    And numbers define responsibilities thedraftNik not gaps. That's why no gap is numbered its shoulder responsibilitie for the defensive line. You never stunt fire the 1. It would be the A.
    The responsibilities are in the gaps...

    A gap is in between the guard and center. B gap is in between the guard and tackle. C gap is outside the tackle. The 1 technique refers to where the lineman lines up. I think I wrote this less clear in my post. I know you don't blitz the 1. You blitz the A. My mistake for not elaborating enough on A, B, and C in my post.

    Leave a comment:


  • ironfootball39
    replied
    And numbers define responsibilities thedraftNik not gaps. That's why no gap is numbered its shoulder responsibilitie for the defensive line. You never stunt fire the 1. It would be the A.

    Leave a comment:


  • ironfootball39
    replied
    Originally posted by THEdraftnik View Post
    Actually 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9 are all offensive and defensive gaps. It goes like this;

    C....B..A....A...B...C
    ...X...X...[X]...X...X
    5.4.3.2.1.0.1.2.3.4.5

    The numbers don't just refer to the gaps, but each gap and space where a lineman is lined up. A 4 is directly in front of the tackle. A 2 is in front of the guard. A 0 is in front of the center. In a 3-4, what you will usually see is an odd front where not every gap is accounted for. You will have a 0 zero technique nose tackle, two 5 technique technique defensive ends, and two rush backers lining up outside of them in a 9 technique usually which would be outside of a tight end. In a 4-3 what you will have is a;

    C...B...A....A...B...C
    ...X...X..[X]..X...X
    ..5...3.......1.......5

    The 1 technique in a 4-3 is commonly referred to as a nose tackle. The 3 technique in a 4-3 is commonly reffered to as an under tackle.

    Now how this refers to Bunkley; Bunkley lines up in the A gap, 1 technique. He is a 4-3 nosetackle. Now not every 4-3 has the same principals and roles. For example the Eagles run a scheme based on heavy pressure and penetration. The Falcons run a 4-3 that has two 9 tech defensive ends, and two 2 technique defensive tackles.

    In our 4-3 his job in our 4-3 is to take up space and command double teams. Our scheme is based on the outside pressure from the defensive ends who seal the edge, and for our two tackles to not lose any ground. We basically run a 4-3 with 3-4 concepts. All of our players line up in a normal 4-3, but their jobs are the basic principals of a 3-4 defense. Bunkley plays the role of a 3-4 nose tackle. He is a 2 gap plugger. An immovable force.

    I'm 17. I play highschool football. My team plays a 3-4 gap controll defense, and on occasion a 2-5-4 gap control defense. The 2-5 looks very much like a 4-3. Our ends are in 2 point stances however. If you play a line position, rushbacker, or linebacker then we are required to know all the gaps. We run an even front, gap controll defense. This means we are constantly making shifts on the line to adjust for different formations. I'm a cerebral player. I know our defense, a 4-3, 3-3-5 stack, and the 5-2 defense in and out. I used to play a lot of scout team sophomore year. I honestly know everything there is to know about how a defense lines up, what each guys individual job in that front, and how that defense needs to be successful.

    For our defense to be successful against the run this needs to happen. Bunkley must command a double team. Marcus Thomas must beat his guard, and not lose ground. Elvis Dumervil and Robert Ayers must seal the edge and force runs inside. Joe Mays, DJ Williams, and Von Miller must be able to make a tackle. DJ and Von must be able to chase down a run if Elvis and Rob can't seal the edge and a runner bounces a run outside. Goodie and Champ must be able to make a tackle if run at them. Dawkins needs to blow somebody up since he is blitzing half the time. Rahim Moore/Quinton Carter who play a 25 yard center field position must be able to make a tackle as the last line of defense. The most important part of this is Bunkley, our run defense lives and dies by him. If he is controlled by one blocker then somebody can block Mays and get to the second level where only Carter/Moore is in position to make this tackle. The significance of his position/job is very similar to that of a 3-4 nose tackle in this way. 3-4 defense can not succeed with out a good nose. We can't succeed without our 1 technique nose tackle.
    I know every college and nfl scheme is different but I've never seen gap numbers on defense. I have only seen technique or linemen responsibility called by numbers. Any proof otherwise or a different coaches vocabulary showing it and ill agree.

    Good defensive ends demands double team. So by dwills definition he's a Nt. Ridiculous.

    A Nt has everything by the position and front and more important technique. Any dt is suppose to demand double teams and command the los.

    Leave a comment:


  • THEdraftnik
    replied
    Originally posted by ironfootball39 View Post
    I don't know what football terms you are using but 0 is head up center, 1 is shoulder. I think you have offensive and Defense gaps confused. 13579 and 2468 are offensive gaps. A is the first gap between Center and guard.

    First off there is NO Nt in the 4-3. Bunk plays the head up or inside shoulder guard 90% of plays. A Nt plays head up (0 tech) or shoulder 1 tech of the center. The only time bunkley plays close to this is where he is in goaline and one time in tape he had a crossing stunt with mccbean where he lines up head up A Gap which is STILL not a NT position. So no he does not play a Nt. If you can find film showing other wise id consider him a 'potential' Nt. But its a stinkin four man front.
    Actually 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9 are all offensive and defensive gaps. It goes like this;

    C....B..A....A...B...C
    ...X...X...[X]...X...X
    5.4.3.2.1.0.1.2.3.4.5

    The numbers don't just refer to the gaps, but each gap and space where a lineman is lined up. A 4 is directly in front of the tackle. A 2 is in front of the guard. A 0 is in front of the center. In a 3-4, what you will usually see is an odd front where not every gap is accounted for. You will have a 0 zero technique nose tackle, two 5 technique technique defensive ends, and two rush backers lining up outside of them in a 9 technique usually which would be outside of a tight end. In a 4-3 what you will have is a;

    C...B...A....A...B...C
    ...X...X..[X]..X...X
    ..5...3.......1.......5

    The 1 technique in a 4-3 is commonly referred to as a nose tackle. The 3 technique in a 4-3 is commonly reffered to as an under tackle.

    Now how this refers to Bunkley; Bunkley lines up in the A gap, 1 technique. He is a 4-3 nosetackle. Now not every 4-3 has the same principals and roles. For example the Eagles run a scheme based on heavy pressure and penetration. The Falcons run a 4-3 that has two 9 tech defensive ends, and two 2 technique defensive tackles.

    In our 4-3 his job in our 4-3 is to take up space and command double teams. Our scheme is based on the outside pressure from the defensive ends who seal the edge, and for our two tackles to not lose any ground. We basically run a 4-3 with 3-4 concepts. All of our players line up in a normal 4-3, but their jobs are the basic principals of a 3-4 defense. Bunkley plays the role of a 3-4 nose tackle. He is a 2 gap plugger. An immovable force.

    I'm 17. I play highschool football. My team plays a 3-4 gap controll defense, and on occasion a 2-5-4 gap control defense. The 2-5 looks very much like a 4-3. Our ends are in 2 point stances however. If you play a line position, rushbacker, or linebacker then we are required to know all the gaps. We run an even front, gap controll defense. This means we are constantly making shifts on the line to adjust for different formations. I'm a cerebral player. I know our defense, a 4-3, 3-3-5 stack, and the 5-2 defense in and out. I used to play a lot of scout team sophomore year. I honestly know everything there is to know about how a defense lines up, what each guys individual job in that front, and how that defense needs to be successful.

    For our defense to be successful against the run this needs to happen. Bunkley must command a double team. Marcus Thomas must beat his guard, and not lose ground. Elvis Dumervil and Robert Ayers must seal the edge and force runs inside. Joe Mays, DJ Williams, and Von Miller must be able to make a tackle. DJ and Von must be able to chase down a run if Elvis and Rob can't seal the edge and a runner bounces a run outside. Goodie and Champ must be able to make a tackle if run at them. Dawkins needs to blow somebody up since he is blitzing half the time. Rahim Moore/Quinton Carter who play a 25 yard center field position must be able to make a tackle as the last line of defense. The most important part of this is Bunkley, our run defense lives and dies by him. If he is controlled by one blocker then somebody can block Mays and get to the second level where only Carter/Moore is in position to make this tackle. The significance of his position/job is very similar to that of a 3-4 nose tackle in this way. 3-4 defense can not succeed with out a good nose. We can't succeed without our 1 technique nose tackle.

    Leave a comment:


  • Hoserman117
    replied
    You can use a NT in a 4-3. The other DT then plays the Under Tackle position, I'm pretty sure we run that. Obviously not all the time, but we run it with relatively high frequency.

    Leave a comment:


  • DWill27<3
    replied
    Originally posted by ironfootball39 View Post
    I don't know what football terms you are using but 0 is head up center, 1 is shoulder. I think you have offensive and Defense gaps confused. 13579 and 2468 are offensive gaps. A is the first gap between Center and guard.

    First off there is NO Nt in the 4-3. Bunk plays the head up or inside shoulder guard 90% of plays. A Nt plays head up (0 tech) or shoulder 1 tech of the center. The only time bunkley plays close to this is where he is in goaline and one time in tape he had a crossing stunt with mccbean where he lines up head up A Gap which is STILL not a NT position. So no he does not play a Nt. If you can find film showing other wise id consider him a 'potential' Nt. But its a stinkin four man front.
    He plays like a nosetackle though... its just a name, no one said 0 tech or 1 tech till you did. Bunkley holds the point of attack and takes on double teams, thus he is our NT.

    Leave a comment:


  • ironfootball39
    replied
    Originally posted by THEdraftnik View Post
    Bunkley has been playing in the 1 or 0, mostly 1, gap this whole season. He doesn't penetrate. He stays at the line and is an immovable object. He is a nosetackle, he plays like a nosetackle. We don't have any body who penetrates well. That doesn't make Bunkley a penetrator.
    I don't know what football terms you are using but 0 is head up center, 1 is shoulder. I think you have offensive and Defense gaps confused. 13579 and 2468 are offensive gaps. A is the first gap between Center and guard.

    First off there is NO Nt in the 4-3. Bunk plays the head up or inside shoulder guard 90% of plays. A Nt plays head up (0 tech) or shoulder 1 tech of the center. The only time bunkley plays close to this is where he is in goaline and one time in tape he had a crossing stunt with mccbean where he lines up head up A Gap which is STILL not a NT position. So no he does not play a Nt. If you can find film showing other wise id consider him a 'potential' Nt. But its a stinkin four man front.
    Last edited by ironfootball39; 10-31-2011, 12:59 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • THEdraftnik
    replied
    Originally posted by ironfootball39 View Post
    Really? Show me one play highlight where he is head up center. There isn't one. The closest he gets is head up a gap in the goal line formation. Lol Nt pfft. He doesn't even line up outside shoulder C.

    And his penetration is the best out of our line. Get realistic dude
    Bunkley has been playing in the 1 or 0, mostly 1, gap this whole season. He doesn't penetrate. He stays at the line and is an immovable object. He is a nosetackle, he plays like a nosetackle. We don't have any body who penetrates well. That doesn't make Bunkley a penetrator.

    Leave a comment:


  • ERoyal248
    replied
    Good post....

    I'd say QB, OL, WR, DT, DE, and CB are our biggest needs in no order. We can live with what we got at RB for another year since RB's are dime a dozen.

    Leave a comment:


  • ironfootball39
    replied
    Really? Show me one play highlight where he is head up center. There isn't one. The closest he gets is head up a gap in the goal line formation. Lol Nt pfft. He doesn't even line up outside shoulder C.

    And his penetration is the best out of our line. Get realistic dude

    Leave a comment:


  • Kyousukeneko
    replied
    Originally posted by ironfootball39 View Post
    I agree that we have some talent on this team but a few of your points jumped out at me.

    First bunkly is playing pretty darn well but a Nt he is not. There is not a Nt in a four front. The closest he gets to that position is inside shoulder of a guard. That added to the fact he floats 300-310 he is a better 3 tech anyways. I think a larger interior dt is still a need (under 28ys old).

    And DE is such a need its Obnoxious. They never get double teamed leading to our pretty decent lbs having to tackle 5-10 yds back with no help. With the amount of sacks our de's have produced I would rather have larger de's to stop the run. Sorry but Doom is out of position and it shows. He MAY be able to be productive ONLY if we get some elite DT which isn't happening soon enough.
    hes been playing the zero tech or nt o a four man front and three tech does not suit him he gets no penetraition against an o-line

    Leave a comment:


  • ironfootball39
    replied
    I agree that we have some talent on this team but a few of your points jumped out at me.

    First bunkly is playing pretty darn well but a Nt he is not. There is not a Nt in a four front. The closest he gets to that position is inside shoulder of a guard. That added to the fact he floats 300-310 he is a better 3 tech anyways. I think a larger interior dt is still a need (under 28ys old).

    And DE is such a need its Obnoxious. They never get double teamed leading to our pretty decent lbs having to tackle 5-10 yds back with no help. With the amount of sacks our de's have produced I would rather have larger de's to stop the run. Sorry but Doom is out of position and it shows. He MAY be able to be productive ONLY if we get some elite DT which isn't happening soon enough.

    Leave a comment:


  • BroncoooJohnson
    replied
    the thing i disagree with is "number one cornerback." you need two number ones these days, and maybe 3 considering how Champ plays the nickel a lot and is ready for a move to safety in a year or two.

    Leave a comment:


  • FlowdaBroncoFan
    replied
    Good post!!! It is very nice to see a positive thread amoung all of these angry, moment of weakness threads. People are real quick to say fire this person or bench that person. It is nice to see the light at the end of the tunnel aproach.

    I agree with all of our strong positions you pointed out. IMO we need to go BPA this draft, but in the most needed positions. We need a RT, OC, CB, WR, and RB in a bad way. QB might take the lead on this list if Tebow can't improve within the next couple of weeks. Our OL needs to step it up and protect him. They are setting him up for failure.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X