MUG You Have Me Convinced About Moreno

[downinbellum]

I don't know if everyone has seen this post, but I think everyone should read it.

MUG I apologize if taking your post and making it a thread is taboo... I think it's an incredible analysis of the situation. Much more in depth than any other "expert" article I've read thus far about the draft.

Serious Props


Here it is..

http://forums.denverbroncos.com/show...=141983&page=3

[BroncosFan0226]

definitely a good assessment by MUG

[broncos SB2010]

Yes, MUG does write good posts doesn't he? He is the best poster on these boards.

Anyway...I agree with the Moreno idea though. I think at 12 the only viable choices are Raji, Moreno, or Malcolm Jenkins. Anyone who thinks Moreno is a bad idea is not thinking clearly, imo.

[Mat'hir Uth Gan]

Thanks for the nice words, much more enjoyable to read then the "MUG's a moron" that I usually get.


I like that thread. From that page to the end, there is a lot of very good discussion from multiple posters on the Moreno debate. An excellent thread if you enjoy well supported and thought out stances.

That being said, I'm not trying to "convince" anyone we must have Moreno, I just wanted to identify and clarify my stance as to why I believe drafting him at #12 Overall is our best option and value.

I think MYoung's stance that the Front-7 must be addressed first and foremost, likely with Tyson Jackson, is the more popular stance and also more likely to occur.


With all that being said, I think Moreno is greatly needed by us and should be our #12 selection UNLESS BJ Raji or Brian Orakpo slip to us.

[DancingHorsey]

The other thing that many seem to be missing is that McD wants to win now. In all honesty, I think he needs to win now. Moreno will have a much bigger impact this upcoming season than any other pick we might make at the 12 spot, and I seriously doubt McD isn't aware of that.

[fraguela09]

Great analysis. I, too, definitely feel that DEN will draft Moreno at 12. Only players I see ahead of Moreno would be Curry, Orakpo & Raji. I bet they would hold their breath and hope he was there at 18 though.

I do agree that it might come down to Jenkins or Moreno. They would take the guy they liked more, obviously.... but also knowing they could get the next BPA at 18 (Smith or Brown).... SO, they'll probably target RB & DB in the first round if Raji is gone.

I think they'll shoot for Brace and Gilbert in the next 2 rounds, maybe even trading back into the 2nd round to get their guy.

I mean, would Moreno (RB), Smith (DB), Brace (NT) & Gilbert (DE) be horrible? Even if we had to waste both third rounders to jump up?

Let's be honest though.... before we pick at 12:

2 QB (Stafford & Sanchez) will go.... a WR (Crabtree) for sure. Curry certainly, At least 2 OTs are going. Right there, that's 5 selections. There's always a surprise guy, maybe it's Ayers, Maybin or something.

SO, who are the next 4 guys gone before we pick?

Probably another WR, then.... Raji, Jackson, Orakpo, Jenkins as the most likely candidates, right?

We can always hope a 3rd OT goes, maybe even something else out of the ordinary.... BUT, if Raji is gone.... I want Jenkins or Moreno ahead of anyone else.

I like Maualuga, but with Woody, Larsen, DJ & Davis.... I think we're set at the ILB position, at least more secure than the other layers of this new 3-4 scheme.

Day-1 DB is an absolute must.... I would say DL as well, but this is not a great top-heavy DL draft class. You know what, the new regime with have to earn their money this draft and fine a DE and a NT in the later rounds. Dallas grabbed an All-Pro NT in the 7th!

Jenkins, Smith, Delmas.... we need one of these guys.

Aside from Raji? What other NT is a dire need? Will Brace be better than Sammie Lee Hill?

Will Jackson be better than Gilbert?

[-Rod-]

Can you imagine us taking Moreno with the 12th pick? I would be thrilled.

[Bronco-24]

Yes, MUG does write good posts doesn't he? He is the best poster on these boards.

Either him or my fav poster.......CanDB.

[broncos SB2010]

Either him or my fav poster.......CanDB.

Agreed, CanDB is good as well.

[broncos SB2010]

The other thing that many seem to be missing is that McD wants to win now. In all honesty, I think he needs to win now. Moreno will have a much bigger impact this upcoming season than any other pick we might make at the 12 spot, and I seriously doubt McD isn't aware of that.

I don't think the win now philosophy will come in at all. He will take the BPA even if that player won't make a huge impact this year or not. For example, Jenkins could be the pick but not start the year outside of the nickel.

[broncos SB2010]

Great analysis. I, too, definitely feel that DEN will draft Moreno at 12. Only players I see ahead of Moreno would be Curry, Orakpo & Raji. I bet they would hold their breath and hope he was there at 18 though.

I do agree that it might come down to Jenkins or Moreno. They would take the guy they liked more, obviously.... but also knowing they could get the next BPA at 18 (Smith or Brown).... SO, they'll probably target RB & DB in the first round if Raji is gone.

I think they'll shoot for Brace and Gilbert in the next 2 rounds, maybe even trading back into the 2nd round to get their guy.

I mean, would Moreno (RB), Smith (DB), Brace (NT) & Gilbert (DE) be horrible? Even if we had to waste both third rounders to jump up?

Let's be honest though.... before we pick at 12:

2 QB (Stafford & Sanchez) will go.... a WR (Crabtree) for sure. Curry certainly, At least 2 OTs are going. Right there, that's 5 selections. There's always a surprise guy, maybe it's Ayers, Maybin or something.

SO, who are the next 4 guys gone before we pick?

Probably another WR, then.... Raji, Jackson, Orakpo, Jenkins as the most likely candidates, right?

We can always hope a 3rd OT goes, maybe even something else out of the ordinary.... BUT, if Raji is gone.... I want Jenkins or Moreno ahead of anyone else.

I like Maualuga, but with Woody, Larsen, DJ & Davis.... I think we're set at the ILB position, at least more secure than the other layers of this new 3-4 scheme.

Day-1 DB is an absolute must.... I would say DL as well, but this is not a great top-heavy DL draft class. You know what, the new regime with have to earn their money this draft and fine a DE and a NT in the later rounds. Dallas grabbed an All-Pro NT in the 7th!

Jenkins, Smith, Delmas.... we need one of these guys.

Aside from Raji? What other NT is a dire need? Will Brace be better than Sammie Lee Hill?

Will Jackson be better than Gilbert?

Brace > Hill, maybe, it's a toss up
Jackson > Gilbert, NO!!! Gilbert is a much better choice for DE than jackson.

[Cugel]

Thanks for the nice words, much more enjoyable to read then the "MUG's a moron" that I usually get.


I like that thread. From that page to the end, there is a lot of very good discussion from multiple posters on the Moreno debate. An excellent thread if you enjoy well supported and thought out stances.

That being said, I'm not trying to "convince" anyone we must have Moreno, I just wanted to identify and clarify my stance as to why I believe drafting him at #12 Overall is our best option and value.

I think MYoung's stance that the Front-7 must be addressed first and foremost, likely with Tyson Jackson, is the more popular stance and also more likely to occur.


With all that being said, I think Moreno is greatly needed by us and should be our #12 selection UNLESS BJ Raji or Brian Orakpo slip to us.

If people write "MUG'S a moron!" that's what we call "projection."

Just more evidence of the 50% rule: "50% of the population has below average intelligence - and that explains a lot!"

I'm still not convinced on Moreno though. He'd be a very good RB, and might well be the best value at #12.

But, so was Calvin Johnson the "best available player at #2" and where is Matt Millen now?

I honestly think that if McDaniels drafts Moreno #1 that will ultimately get him fired in 2 years time; rather like Shanny drafting Moss & Crowder #1 and #2 in 2007 ultimately led to HIS firing. He will sink or swim with the moves he makes to fix the defense. He can get by for a year with the RBs he's got. They're not great, but they can collectively do the job adequately.

He can't get by with the DL he now has. And if he wants to trade Moss & Crowder he needs an OLB. Hell, the defense needs about everything. And McDaniels doesn't have an unlimited amount of time to get things fixed either. Two losing seasons and he's gone.

As Bowlen could say: "His tires were bald, and they went flat. So did our love. And that was that!"

[Bowie Man]

Another thing to consider is that Tyson Jackson could(and I think will) be available at 18, assuming the Chargers like Maualuga over Jackson, of course. But if he's not and we still want a DE, Ziggy Hood will be there, along with some good OLB prospects and an outside shot of Jenkins(if something happens like New Orleans takes Maualuga, Houston takes Beanie Wells, and San Diego takes Jackson). Bottom line is, if nobody makes a surprise fall whoever we don't take at 12 has a shot at being there at 18, I just think Moreno has a smaller chance than Jackson.

[CanDB]

Either him or my fav poster.......CanDB.

Thanks so much B-24.......I really appreciate you saying that.

But when it comes to drafts and mocks and all that cool stuff.......MUG is #1!!!

[CanDB]

Agreed, CanDB is good as well.

Also thanks to you b SB2010.......