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  • gtown53
    replied
    Originally posted by fraguela09 View Post
    Cowboys certainly don't regret drafting Zach Martin at 16. I mean, if you were to guarantee it.... would you prefer an All Pro over an All Pro RB right now.

    We do have CJ and and 2 draft pick RBs from last year (and it seems finding quality RBs is easier than OL).....

    Anyway... I believe you build from the inside out.... especially when you have young QBs.... don't want them Seeing ghosts or developing happy feet or bad habits (or taking a beating).

    With our young QB.... the most important thing is solidifying the LOS. So, while it may not be sexy.... Lamp at 20 might be a smart decision.

    Now, given out state of OL, and fact OG seems to be set....
    Still, who cares.

    Lamp-Paradis-Leary would be a solid interior front.
    Keep in mind that it's the "Draft Gurus" who have Lamp moving to Guard. He played Left Tackle for most of his college career. But just because his arm isn't one inch longer, he can't play that position in the NFL? I'm not buying that at all. Would Lamp make a good Guard? I would assume so, but we really don't have a lot to go on with that. I like the guy as a Draft Pick more than I like the Tackle prospects.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rich_C
    replied
    Originally posted by samparnell View Post
    Good Points. I think Zach Martin is the player with whom Forrest Lamp is most often compared and he might even become a better player. Like you said, even if he didn't play Tackle, he'd do great at some spot.

    If McCaffrey is available at #20, he'd be a great temptation, but I think some pretty good RBs would still be available in the 4th round due to the depth at that position this year.
    I agree but he is far more than just a RB. That is the real temptation.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rich_C
    replied
    Originally posted by montee2ball View Post
    I know it's Happy Hour now and maybe I'm digging a little deep. But hear me out. This can be wishful thinking or a possibility.

    Let's stop the Romo talk. With McCaffrey possibly going earlier in the draft, 10 draft picks, the uncertainty of Paradis and over $10+ million left in salary cap. I propose this:

    Draft Forrest Lamp at #20, trade back into the first round with Seattle at #26. Seattle can use some picks. Draft Robinson.

    Robinson-Lamp-Garcia-Leary-Watson

    Just a brain freeze.
    Others may already have posted this but Leary's natural position is LG not RG.

    Leave a comment:


  • samparnell
    replied
    Originally posted by fraguela09 View Post
    Cowboys certainly don't regret drafting Zach Martin at 16. I mean, if you were to guarantee it.... would you prefer an All Pro over an All Pro RB right now.

    We do have CJ and and 2 draft pick RBs from last year (and it seems finding quality RBs is easier than OL).....

    Anyway... I believe you build from the inside out.... especially when you have young QBs.... don't want them Seeing ghosts or developing happy feet or bad habits (or taking a beating).

    With our young QB.... the most important thing is solidifying the LOS. So, while it may not be sexy.... Lamp at 20 might be a smart decision.

    Now, given out state of OL, and fact OG seems to be set....
    Still, who cares.

    Lamp-Paradis-Leary would be a solid interior front.
    Good Points. I think Zach Martin is the player with whom Forrest Lamp is most often compared and he might even become a better player. Like you said, even if he didn't play Tackle, he'd do great at some spot.

    If McCaffrey is available at #20, he'd be a great temptation, but I think some pretty good RBs would still be available in the 4th round due to the depth at that position this year.

    Leave a comment:


  • fraguela09
    replied
    Cowboys certainly don't regret drafting Zach Martin at 16. I mean, if you were to guarantee it.... would you prefer an All Pro over an All Pro RB right now.

    We do have CJ and and 2 draft pick RBs from last year (and it seems finding quality RBs is easier than OL).....

    Anyway... I believe you build from the inside out.... especially when you have young QBs.... don't want them Seeing ghosts or developing happy feet or bad habits (or taking a beating).

    With our young QB.... the most important thing is solidifying the LOS. So, while it may not be sexy.... Lamp at 20 might be a smart decision.

    Now, given out state of OL, and fact OG seems to be set....
    Still, who cares.

    Lamp-Paradis-Leary would be a solid interior front.
    Last edited by fraguela09; 04-02-2017, 04:58 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • samparnell
    replied
    Originally posted by SYRbronco View Post
    I am curious why forest lamp is being left out of the conversation to solve our issue at LT. I know all the experts say he is a guard and doesnt have the length to play on the outside but just because he is projected as an all-pro level guard doesnt mean he couldnt be a good tackle for a year or so. Go back and watch him play vs Alabama and LSU those are NFL defenders and his length wasnt an issue those games.

    I think it is amusing that once one person says it everyone believes it. Ramczyk has 2 less years as a starter and his arms are only 1.5" shorter. I know football is a game of inches but really a guy is going to be pegged as a guard only prospect because of that? Lamp is a much more polished player then all three of the "top tackles" more experience then 2 of them and isnt way to old to take as a rookie. I am not saying Lamp is perfect but I think there are far worse options to play LT then Lamp with his "short arms"
    Good points. It is possible that arm length is over emphasized. Personally, I'm more concerned with an O-Line prospect being a knee bender rather than a waist bender. Arm length might be more of an issue for D-Linemen. It's not the length of the arms so much as what an O-Linemen does with them. Pass protection is passive, so one of the ways an O-Linemen has to redirect a pass rusher is the punch; violent hands.

    Joe Thomas has 32 1/2" arms and he is a perennial All-Pro. Forrest Lamp has 32 1/4" arms, but his explosion number is 71. Anything 70+ is pretty explosive. Forrest Lamp has 48 starts at Left Tackle. Dion Dawkins has 40 starts at Left Tackle, but he is also projected as a Guard and he has 35" arms. Go figure.

    Another measurable that may be overemphasized is 40 times. The only times I can think of when it might translate to the field is running or covering a Go Route or covering a Punt/Kick. Justin Simmons ran a 4.52 40 which isn't impressive, but his 3-cone was 3.85 and his short shuttle was 6.58 which is extremely quick and agile. It came in handy when he leaped over the line and blocked an XPA at New Orleans.

    For all we know, Forrest Lamp may be on Elway & Company's radar. He could be a guy who could play every spot on the O-Line. Versatility is underrated and unappreciated. I consult NFL Draft Scout and they have Lamp rated ahead of Garrett Bolles by three spots and over Cam Robinson by seven spots. They do have Lamp eleven spots behind Ramczyk, but that may have more to do with Forrest being projected as a Guard.

    If Denver takes Lamp at #20, it will be because they think he can play Left Tackle. In the end, what we project here or what the numerous internet big boards project doesn't matter because the ultimate ranking will occur at the end of the month. Pro scouts, Front Office people and coaches always say that the most decisive information about where to rank and how to grade a player comes from their body of work in college including how they do in All-Star games. I'm sure what you observed in how Lamp dealt with the competition he faced will not go unnoticed.

    Leave a comment:


  • Murph2432
    replied
    Originally posted by SYRbronco View Post
    I am curious why forest lamp is being left out of the conversation to solve our issue at LT. I know all the experts say he is a guard and doesnt have the length to play on the outside but just because he is projected as an all-pro level guard doesnt mean he couldnt be a good tackle for a year or so. Go back and watch him play vs Alabama and LSU those are NFL defenders and his length wasnt an issue those games.

    I think it is amusing that once one person says it everyone believes it. Ramczyk has 2 less years as a starter and his arms are only 1.5" shorter. I know football is a game of inches but really a guy is going to be pegged as a guard only prospect because of that? Lamp is a much more polished player then all three of the "top tackles" more experience then 2 of them and isnt way to old to take as a rookie. I am not saying Lamp is perfect but I think there are far worse options to play LT then Lamp with his "short arms"
    i think at this point teams are looking at what would be the best position for this player to succeed in the next level. Just because his size and length didn't affect him in college doesn't mean it wouldn't get exposed in the pros. You're going against players stronger and faster than the Alabama players once you enter the league. I think he could be one of the best guards his rookie year because of his body, strength, and foot work. A lot harder to make that transition from college to pros at LT because you're going against the best pass rusher in league each week not just when you play bama or lsu

    Leave a comment:


  • SYRbronco
    replied
    I am curious why forest lamp is being left out of the conversation to solve our issue at LT. I know all the experts say he is a guard and doesnt have the length to play on the outside but just because he is projected as an all-pro level guard doesnt mean he couldnt be a good tackle for a year or so. Go back and watch him play vs Alabama and LSU those are NFL defenders and his length wasnt an issue those games.

    I think it is amusing that once one person says it everyone believes it. Ramczyk has 2 less years as a starter and his arms are only 1.5" shorter. I know football is a game of inches but really a guy is going to be pegged as a guard only prospect because of that? Lamp is a much more polished player then all three of the "top tackles" more experience then 2 of them and isnt way to old to take as a rookie. I am not saying Lamp is perfect but I think there are far worse options to play LT then Lamp with his "short arms"

    Leave a comment:


  • KWHIT97
    replied
    As a Buckeye fan I can tell u we don't want Elfein. I've seen that dude get tossed around like a rag doll too many times, way overrated imo.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheAsianPA
    replied
    Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    The problem I see with this, Seattle had a worse line than Denver in 2016, and need upgrades as well. If Robinson is there at 26 I don't think they hesitate to select him.
    I think Seattle has a history of undervaluing the offensive line, even more so then the Broncos. They may reason that with Russell Wilson, an amazing offensive line isn't necessary and draft BPA. Still hard to pass up Robinson though if he's still there

    Leave a comment:


  • TheAsianPA
    replied
    Originally posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    What team is gonna trade a proven LT that isn't on the verge of retirement? And for the love of god do not say Joe Thomas.
    So...how about that Joe Thomas trade?

    Leave a comment:


  • Broncos-R-Great
    replied
    Originally posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    What team is gonna trade a proven LT that isn't on the verge of retirement? And for the love of god do not say Joe Thomas.
    Joe Thomas????

    I kid... I kid

    Leave a comment:


  • samparnell
    replied
    Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    2017 Starting LT: Michael Schofield. I've been saying since probably December, so might as well keep going, I think he'll start OTAs there and could end up being the guy. Just my gut feeling. I think they moved him in to guard to settle him down and get him some success, but I think the plan all along was for him to move back outside.
    It's a bold prediction, but it could happen. He played Right Tackle and Left Guard at Michigan. He has played Right Tackle and Right Guard in Denver with a few snaps here and there at Left Tackle. Ryan Harris had next to no experience at Left Tackle when he moved to that spot in 2015 and did a satisfactory job. Shuffling is something O-Line coaches do and something that most O-Linemen experience.

    According to Vance Joseph, the big deal with Offensive Tackles in the NFL is blocking speed, especially on the outside. Okung and Stephenson did not do a good job of that last year. Stephenson's technique was inscrutable. Some say he might do better on the left. Maybe ... if there is some sort of problem with his right arm that can be solved by flipping sides.

    Michael Schofield had some bad experiences with outside pass rushers in 2015. Is he strong enough now to stand up to bull rushers? He'll need to break down that 6'6" frame to get leverage. Does he now have the feet to chop and kick slide to take an outside rusher upfield? IDK. Would flipping him to the left have a good result as sometimes happens with a shuffle? Only one way to find out.

    If Schofield is a candidate for Left Tackle, then Ty Sambrailo should be, too. He started the first three games of 2015 at LT as a rookie and showed promise. He required labrum surgery on his shoulder which I think was an old injury. Then in Spring 2016, he injured his elbow. I don't think he was recovered from that until the end of the season. Question about him is how is his health and has he been able to work out in the offseason and strengthen himself? What little I've seen indicates Ty may be more athletic than Michael.

    Schofield and Sambrailo may need to stay outside if Denver uses more angle blocking in their rushing attack. Guards in an angle blocked rushing attack need to down block and pull consistently and effectively. 6'6" guys are a little tall for the breakdown/stay low on the move stuff Guards must do on angle blocked run plays, although Orlando Franklin did quite well at it when he was moved to G. Orlando is one heck of a crushing down blocker which I doubt we'll ever see from Ty and Michael.

    The odd man out on all this O-Line shuffling may turn out to be Donald Stephenson unless a miracle happens when they try him on the left. I saw enough of him on the right last year to not want a rerun.

    Leave a comment:


  • Butler By'Note
    replied
    Originally posted by montee2ball View Post
    I know it's Happy Hour now and maybe I'm digging a little deep. But hear me out. This can be wishful thinking or a possibility.

    Let's stop the Romo talk. With McCaffrey possibly going earlier in the draft, 10 draft picks, the uncertainty of Paradis and over $10+ million left in salary cap. I propose this:

    Draft Forrest Lamp at #20, trade back into the first round with Seattle at #26. Seattle can use some picks. Draft Robinson.

    Robinson-Lamp-Garcia-Leary-Watson

    Just a brain freeze.
    The problem I see with this, Seattle had a worse line than Denver in 2016, and need upgrades as well. If Robinson is there at 26 I don't think they hesitate to select him.

    Leave a comment:


  • shawinkerpoppin
    replied
    Originally posted by Montoya View Post
    I'd rather use our first and trade for a LT and get a proven starting LT. instead of reaching and drafting a rookie who very well could be a bust. I'd rather get Davenport in the second or 3rd and grab a playmaker in the 1st. But that's just my opinion.
    What team is gonna trade a proven LT that isn't on the verge of retirement? And for the love of god do not say Joe Thomas.

    Leave a comment:

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