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DenverPost Suggests We move Up to Grab Mike Willams

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  • #46
    Anyone that says our defence is okay is crazy. we have lost hayward,we losing pryce, we lost kennedy. Is it just me or is it lookin not too great for the broncos

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    • #47
      We didn't have Pryce last year.. Hayward would have been impossible to keep because of the money and even with him we had almost no pass rush.. and although I think Kennoy was great I think that a better coverage safety can get the job done back there... don't worry too much.

      The motto of the current NFL should be do what the Patriots do. Would they do this? Nope.
      My Adopt a Bronco: Champ Bailey

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by OhNoKoolAid
        I'm suprised that the most recent go-for-broke strategy tried hasn't been brought up in this thread yet. The Saints and Ricky Williams should be enough of a warning sign to show you don't mortgage your future on one draft pick. It would be most wise to add picks, not subtract, ala Philadelphia and New England, the REAL model franchises.
        Nice post guy! I'm glad you brought us the drafting of Ricky Williams by the Saints its definitely what a team should not do. No number one pick is worth giving up all others just to get him. Again ONKA very nice post.
        John 11: 25-27

        My Adopt-A-Bronco is D.J. Williams



        Thanks Snk16

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Javalon
          Thanks for being a voice of reason!

          Mike Williams is a good prospect but by no means is he a guarantee. The cost to trade up to get him would be extremely prohibitive. The several first and second round picks we'd have to throw in to move up into the #5 - #12 range would kill all kinds of potential future contributors for the Broncos. How many great receivers make their their teams Super Bowl caliber? How many touches per game does a wide receiver get? Even the best receivers start to have a tougher time when the field gets shorter in the red zone. Anyway, look these top 15 receivers this century that have not turned out to be the next Randy Moss (to borrow MilitantDBFan's comparison):

          Larry Fitzgerald #3
          Roy Williams #7
          Reggie Williams #9
          Lee Evans #13
          Michael Clayton #15
          Charles Rogers #2
          Andre Johnson #3
          Donte Stallworth #13
          David Terrell #8
          Koren Robinson #9
          Rod Gardner #15
          Peter Warrick #4
          Plaxico Burress #8
          Travis Taylor #10

          Yes, there are some good players there. But there are also some duds. And how many of those good players pushed their team over the top? Hell, even Randy Moss didn't push his team over the top.

          Also, I'd suggest that a really good tight end would be more important to our offense than a wide receiver. Our 3rd-down percentage & red zone offense were very good with Shannon Sharpe and a running back with a burst out of the backfield. Well, I think Bell will fill Portis's role this year so we'd be back in great shape if we could find a top tier tight end.

          My point is that Mike Williams might be a good prospect but he's far from a sure thing. What if we traded our first round pick (in addition to other picks/players) to move up, drafted Williams and he does okay for us, but the team that takes our #25 pick drafts the next Randy Moss? Moss was only the #21 pick in his draft which shows just how much pre-draft analysts really know. And who knows what college player is going to step it up this year and be considered "the next Randy Moss" next year.

          There's no need to make a desperation move in the draft when we have enough other needs to fill outside of receiver.
          You guys are missing it. Of all of those teams that drafted those great wide recievers, those teams are nowhere near complete as the broncos are this day. Why do you think those teams are picking in the top 10 or 15 i the first place. We are one of the most talented teams on defense as well as offense. Im not saying we will be over the top with the addition, but we will be a upper echelon team. We wont lose to teams like the bengals, raiders or jaguars. Understand just how good we are and just how great we could become. I guess you guys just arent seeing what im seeing. If bell is going to be like portis we didnt win anything when he was here so why would it be different this time around. You cannot teach height. Mike williams is a bonafide TARGET on third and redzone situations. something we do not have consistently. At the very least of production for his career Mike williams would be a redzone target and thats all. But its exactly what our offense needs. I dont think you guys realize how CLOSE we are to doing something special. I saw it last year. what this year brings i dont know but if we add Mike Williams i would feel much better.
          A Wise Man Once Told Me Dont Argue With Fools Cuz People From a Distance Cant Tell Who is Who

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          • #50
            Originally posted by MilitantDBFan
            You guys are missing it. Of all of those teams that drafted those great wide recievers, those teams are nowhere near complete as the broncos are this day. Why do you think those teams are picking in the top 10 or 15 i the first place. We are one of the most talented teams on defense as well as offense. Im not saying we will be over the top with the addition, but we will be a upper echelon team. We wont lose to teams like the bengals, raiders or jaguars. Understand just how good we are and just how great we could become. I guess you guys just arent seeing what im seeing. If bell is going to be like portis we didnt win anything when he was here so why would it be different this time around. You cannot teach height. Mike williams is a bonafide TARGET on third and redzone situations. something we do not have consistently. At the very least of production for his career Mike williams would be a redzone target and thats all. But its exactly what our offense needs. I dont think you guys realize how CLOSE we are to doing something special. I saw it last year. what this year brings i dont know but if we add Mike Williams i would feel much better.
            Yeah the point is those receivers haven't changed the fortunes of their respective teams by themselves. I think Mike Williams is going to be a great receiver but if we gave up all our picks just get him that would be moronic because then have not addressed any other needs. As it has been mentioned before the drafting of Ricky Williams is the poster child of what not to do with your draft picks.
            John 11: 25-27

            My Adopt-A-Bronco is D.J. Williams



            Thanks Snk16

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by MilitantDBFan
              You guys are missing it. Of all of those teams that drafted those great wide recievers, those teams are nowhere near complete as the broncos are this day. Why do you think those teams are picking in the top 10 or 15 i the first place. We are one of the most talented teams on defense as well as offense. Im not saying we will be over the top with the addition, but we will be a upper echelon team. We wont lose to teams like the bengals, raiders or jaguars. Understand just how good we are and just how great we could become. I guess you guys just arent seeing what im seeing. If bell is going to be like portis we didnt win anything when he was here so why would it be different this time around. You cannot teach height. Mike williams is a bonafide TARGET on third and redzone situations. something we do not have consistently. At the very least of production for his career Mike williams would be a redzone target and thats all. But its exactly what our offense needs. I dont think you guys realize how CLOSE we are to doing something special. I saw it last year. what this year brings i dont know but if we add Mike Williams i would feel much better.

              We have no defensive line. Our LB core and Secondary can't do it by themselves. Even the best will be exploited if there is no pass rush, and our small LBs will be gashed by the run with no D-linemen to clog up blockers and make tackles.

              We have no idea if Walls or Middlebrooks can stay healthy and hold down the fort opposite Bailey. Lynch is a liability in coverage. I don't see a great defense by any means.

              On offense, we have questions at RB. Durability for Bell, Griffin, and Anderson. Droughns could be traded and if not, he might wear down again towards the end of the season.

              Plummer is Jekyll and Hyde. He could win us games or he could lose us games singlehandedly. Our WRs are solid. TE is a question mark. Our O-line will be getting an overhaul next season when Lepsis and Nalen leave.

              I don't think we are that close to being a top team. We aren't even a playoff team until our defensive line actually becomes a reality instead of a hodgepodge of castoffs and stopgaps.

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by MilitantDBFan
                You guys are missing it. Of all of those teams that drafted those great wide recievers, those teams are nowhere near complete as the broncos are this day. Why do you think those teams are picking in the top 10 or 15 i the first place. We are one of the most talented teams on defense as well as offense. Im not saying we will be over the top with the addition, but we will be a upper echelon team. We wont lose to teams like the bengals, raiders or jaguars. Understand just how good we are and just how great we could become. I guess you guys just arent seeing what im seeing. If bell is going to be like portis we didnt win anything when he was here so why would it be different this time around. You cannot teach height. Mike williams is a bonafide TARGET on third and redzone situations. something we do not have consistently. At the very least of production for his career Mike williams would be a redzone target and thats all. But its exactly what our offense needs. I dont think you guys realize how CLOSE we are to doing something special. I saw it last year. what this year brings i dont know but if we add Mike Williams i would feel much better.
                Portis was one of the top five most explosive playmakers in his time in Denver, what makes Mike Williams more explosive that he can actually add wins to a roster? D.J. Williams was one of the best rookie OLBs of rcent memory, but he failed to add onto victories either. In fact, the Eagles didn't use Owens to get over their playoff hump, winning with roughly the same team they had the last time. What this should show you is that one player cannot improve a team so significantly that he alone is worth 3 more wins. It just doesn't happen in the parody filled era of the NFL. If Williams was worth three or more wins alone, wouldn't he be a first pick-of-the-draft lock?

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by TXBRONC
                  Yeah the point is those receivers haven't changed the fortunes of their respective teams by themselves. I think Mike Williams is going to be a great receiver but if we gave up all our picks just get him that would be moronic because then have not addressed any other needs. As it has been mentioned before the drafting of Ricky Williams is the poster child of what not to do with your draft picks.
                  You cant name 5 solid players from that saints team. They put the franchise on the shoulders of one guy. We already have a TEAM that is near completion. We have a system that produces already. Mike Williams will SOLVE our third down, red zone situation. To me that is our only problem on offense besides jakes turnovers. top 5 offense and top 5 defense bottom of the league red zone % middle of the pack 30 down%.

                  Look at the teams those recievers were going to. When they came they had to be the guy. Hines Ward wasnt a factor when Plaxico got drafted. All of those guys were drafted by poor non playoff caliber teams. We are a superbowl caliber team lacking exactly what mike williams brings.
                  A Wise Man Once Told Me Dont Argue With Fools Cuz People From a Distance Cant Tell Who is Who

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by OhNoKoolAid
                    Portis was one of the top five most explosive playmakers in his time in Denver, what makes Mike Williams more explosive that he can actually add wins to a roster? D.J. Williams was one of the best rookie OLBs of rcent memory, but he failed to add onto victories either. In fact, the Eagles didn't use Owens to get over their playoff hump, winning with roughly the same team they had the last time. What this should show you is that one player cannot improve a team so significantly that he alone is worth 3 more wins. It just doesn't happen in the parody filled era of the NFL. If Williams was worth three or more wins alone, wouldn't he be a first pick-of-the-draft lock?
                    different strokes for different folks. We are not the dolphins or the 49ers. We dont have the first pick for a REASON. I understand we have a defensive line in shambles, but its still 11 guys that have to get on that field and compete. Who was reggie hayward before he had 8 sacks 2 years ago. Who was bert berry before he had 10 sacks 2 years ago. Who are Kelly Herndon and Lenny Walls yet they stepped up. Who was terrell davis. Who was Shannon Sharpe. THese are professional athletes. I have faith in the guys we have right now. Im not saying trade 7 picks for mike williams and mike williams alone. What im saying is we have a MAJOR problem besides the dline. REDZONE PRODUCTION. The chiefs had the worst defense in the league yet were in EVERY SINGLE game they played because they come out with 7 instead of 3 when they get there. Mike Williams coming to our team would be a tremendous upgrade. You have to score in order to win football games and we were not able to do it consistantly because we struggled on third down and red zone situations. Situations were the games are won.
                    A Wise Man Once Told Me Dont Argue With Fools Cuz People From a Distance Cant Tell Who is Who

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by OhNoKoolAid
                      Portis was one of the top five most explosive playmakers in his time in Denver, what makes Mike Williams more explosive that he can actually add wins to a roster? D.J. Williams was one of the best rookie OLBs of rcent memory, but he failed to add onto victories either. In fact, the Eagles didn't use Owens to get over their playoff hump, winning with roughly the same team they had the last time. What this should show you is that one player cannot improve a team so significantly that he alone is worth 3 more wins. It just doesn't happen in the parody filled era of the NFL. If Williams was worth three or more wins alone, wouldn't he be a first pick-of-the-draft lock?
                      I LOVE IT! the "parody" filled era of the NFL!

                      "2 : a feeble or ridiculous imitation"

                      The NFL IS in a "parody filled era" all right!

                      If you're going to have a spelling error, why not have an inspired one like that?!

                      sigpic

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Cugel
                        I LOVE IT! the "parody" filled era of the NFL!

                        "2 : a feeble or ridiculous imitation"

                        The NFL IS in a "parody filled era" all right!

                        If you're going to have a spelling error, why not have an inspired one like that?!


                        Oh yeah, my mistake, "parity" is more like it isn't it. I'll proof read some of my longer posts, but I just rushed myself I guess.

                        It does make since though, and very fitting that we will be copying the defense of the champs, huh.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by MilitantDBFan
                          http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,...752310,00.html

                          I like the idea. Im glad someone else realizes that we do need another wide reciever. Mike Williams would be an ideal number one for us when rod smith retires. Im all for it. It probably would take Pryce another first day draft pick and probably another future first day draft pick. But these are the type of bold moves that can turn around the fortune of franchises.

                          What do you think. Do we risk the depth and potential that the draft brings to trade for a gamebreaker in Mike Williams, when we have issues along the defensive? Im prepraed to only add one or two defensive line through the draft.

                          Browns
                          Dolphins
                          Titans
                          Vikings
                          Lions
                          Cowboys
                          Texans

                          I would say the dolphins are our best shot to move up. They only have one first day draft choice. Falling down to 25 still lets them address their oline needs only thing is they just signed two defensive ends and are moving to the 34 defense.
                          I agree about Miami. I think the Phins are going to want to trade down for more picks, especially since they're sort of rebuilding and only have 2 or 3 picks in this year's draft.™
                          This space for rent

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by MilitantDBFan
                            You cant name 5 solid players from that saints team. They put the franchise on the shoulders of one guy. We already have a TEAM that is near completion. We have a system that produces already. Mike Williams will SOLVE our third down, red zone situation. To me that is our only problem on offense besides jakes turnovers. top 5 offense and top 5 defense bottom of the league red zone % middle of the pack 30 down%.

                            Look at the teams those recievers were going to. When they came they had to be the guy. Hines Ward wasnt a factor when Plaxico got drafted. All of those guys were drafted by poor non playoff caliber teams. We are a superbowl caliber team lacking exactly what mike williams brings.
                            But Williams doesn't SOLVE our needs of defense and that is where the problem is. Are going line Mike Williams up at DE or DT? Me thinks not.
                            John 11: 25-27

                            My Adopt-A-Bronco is D.J. Williams



                            Thanks Snk16

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by MilitantDBFan
                              different strokes for different folks. We are not the dolphins or the 49ers. We dont have the first pick for a REASON. I understand we have a defensive line in shambles, but its still 11 guys that have to get on that field and compete. Who was reggie hayward before he had 8 sacks 2 years ago. Who was bert berry before he had 10 sacks 2 years ago. Who are Kelly Herndon and Lenny Walls yet they stepped up. Who was terrell davis. Who was Shannon Sharpe. THese are professional athletes. I have faith in the guys we have right now. Im not saying trade 7 picks for mike williams and mike williams alone. What im saying is we have a MAJOR problem besides the dline. REDZONE PRODUCTION. The chiefs had the worst defense in the league yet were in EVERY SINGLE game they played because they come out with 7 instead of 3 when they get there. Mike Williams coming to our team would be a tremendous upgrade. You have to score in order to win football games and we were not able to do it consistantly because we struggled on third down and red zone situations. Situations were the games are won.

                              That is fine, and I agree that it is a serious concern, but I just believe that there are better ways to solve the problem without selling the farm. A guy like Chris Henry from West Virginia could be had at a second round price, and offers similar posession qualities. Fred Gibson, although not nearly as polished, could also do the job AND become a gamebreaking threat in the vertical game, and with the Broncos play-action offense, size and downfield speed would make a good combination. Larry Brackins and Vincent Jackson are other tall recievers that can fill the role. I'm not saying the idea is bogus, but I think that there is a way to handle the problem under the current perameters we are faced with.

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                              • #60
                                I would rather trade up and Grab Alex Smith at QB in the Draft than trade for Williams. If we are going to make a trade to move up to the top six it will cost us this year and next years 1st and possibly a 2nd plus Pryce.
                                sigpic WHEC-724

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