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Notice that no DL is remotely among the league leaders at their position. Denver's DL are mediocre at best, inadequate at worst.
jeez this annoys me no end. other than champs picks, we have NO DEFENSIVE PLAYERS EVEN REMOTELY AMONG THE LEAGUE LEADERS AT THEIR POSITIONS. does that mean our linebackers are mediocre at best, inadequate at worst?
i dont care if you like the broncos dline or not. but this endless spinning of the stats is ridiculous. we dont have a player in the top 50 in tackles so why would our defensive line, who coyer uses to tie up blockers, have big numbers? it is an inadequate point at best, completely useless at worst.
"Philosophers have hitherto merely interpreted the world in various ways; the point, however, is to change it."--Karl Marx
"And I tell you this, that you must give an account on judgement day of every idle word you speak. The words you say now reflect your fate then; either you will be justified by them or you will be condemned."--Jesus Christ
You guys nailed it on the head. Couldnt say it better myself. So why am I still typing. Eh, who knows. But yh, developing your own is the best way to go. Plus homegrown players are more likely to stay, build cohesiveness, which is huge in a team game like football. Providing we get Abe I hope that doesnt deter us from drafting Dline. At the same pt, I woudl turn my attention to DT, not DE. Abraham and Brown are both young enough that they will be here for a while. The better question is what do we have at DT, Warren we are not sure of, and other that not a whole heck of a lot. So that would be our greatest weakness if we get Abraham. That and I wouldnt mind a proper R guard, TE, and cover safety.
id agree. plus we have 5 other ends currently on the roster (brown, engleburger, ekuban, 2 practise squad guys). the write up on jackson on the main page is positive. and with wilson having said good things about jackson, he may end up being a player down the road a bit.
at tackle though, we dont have much. even if we get warren back, behind him is only myers, veal and pope. myers is a solid depth and motor guy. but he obviously is not a long term solution. veal played well this past season, but he is small. may or may not be a contributor in the future. did pope do anything this past season? not sure how much longer he will be in the picture for.
i definately think we need to draft a tackle early. one in the first two rounds, and another later would be ideal, imo. if we bring in abe, i would hold off on drafting an end. a four man rotation of brown, abe, ekuban, and engleburger is pretty solid. and no one is old in that group, so they should have a couple good seasons at least.
there is only so much development time. i would rather invest the time in the two practise squad guys for another season, than add another unknown into the mix (a draft pick). at the end of the season, evaluate all six and move on from there.
"Philosophers have hitherto merely interpreted the world in various ways; the point, however, is to change it."--Karl Marx
"And I tell you this, that you must give an account on judgement day of every idle word you speak. The words you say now reflect your fate then; either you will be justified by them or you will be condemned."--Jesus Christ
So your telling me teams like the Patriots, Steelers, and Chargers dont draft well and dont have guys waiting in the wings.... okay.
Yeah, but all of those teams have had top picks in the last few years. The Pats had two first rounders 2 years ago, the Steelers picked 11 overall to get Big Ben, and the Chargers have been drafting top ten for years! C'mon, especially the Chargers! With how many top ten picks they've had over the years, it's amazing that they haven't been a Superbowl Team. Let's see, LT, Brees, Jammer, Merriman, Rivers.
It's easy to build through the draft when you have high draft picks every year! Denver almost never gets inside the top 20 (without trading up) and to stay so competitive is amazing for a franchise to do. We just don't have the draft position to draft "impact players" so we've gotta trade for them or sign 'em in FA ala Plummer, Champ, Lynch, Brown, Warren, and now possibly Abraham. Building through FA isn't all bad.
Abraham is a good trade. #29 for a guy of his production is along the lines of the Champ for Portis trade.
But yh, developing your own is the best way to go. Plus homegrown players are more likely to stay, build cohesiveness, which is huge in a team game like football. Providing we get Abe I hope that doesnt deter us from drafting Dline. At the same pt, I woudl turn my attention to DT, not DE. Abraham and Brown are both young enough that they will be here for a while. The better question is what do we have at DT, Warren we are not sure of, and other that not a whole heck of a lot. So that would be our greatest weakness if we get Abraham. That and I wouldnt mind a proper R guard, TE, and cover safety.
I think everyone would agree that DT is the biggest need other than TE on the entire team.
Mike Myers wouldn't start on most NFL teams. He's a journeyman backup. Warren isn't exactly elite, but he's the best tackle. If Denver drafted a DT in the first round to go along side Warren, then the starting DL would be:
Courtney Brown, LDE
Rookie DT, LDT
Warren, RDT
Abraham, RDE
with Ekuban and Engleberger backing up at the ends and Myers and Pope in the middle. That rotation (assuming a decent rookie DT) would be a lot better than 2005's DL.
The main reason beyond need to draft a Defensive Lineman is that this a very good group this year. Ngata is a stud but will be long gone at 22. Bunkley is a future star and we have a slight chance to land him. Wroten, Watson are very good but have character questions. With proper motivation you can't miss. John Mcargo is very draftable and appears very solid.
Other than Vern Davis (top ten)I am not sure about the TE class. I am really hoping Duke and Jackson step it up this year.
Mike Myers wouldn't start on most NFL teams. He's a journeyman backup. Warren isn't exactly elite, but he's the best tackle. If Denver drafted a DT in the first round to go along side Warren, then the starting DL would be:
Courtney Brown, LDE
Rookie DT, LDT
Warren, RDT
Abraham, RDE
They might actually generate some sacks for once!
That is what I am talking about. Dline that gets legit pressure without blitzing. What more could you ask for. And oh yh..all still relatively young, with a chane to grow together...sounds perfect.
GET ABRAHAM!!!!! i prefer for less money, but we had around 16 sacks last year w/ d-line, JOHN GOT10.5 PLUS 6 FORCED FUMBLES!!!!!! make sure ther's enough for TO!!!!!!
Again, I'd have to say that's not too much for a player of Abraham's quality.
But really it shows WHY top teams like the Patriots get their DL through the draft.
Abraham isn't better right now than Giants #2nd round draft pick Osi Umenyiori, who had 70 tackles and 14.5 sacks. And his salary (not incuding bonus) was $350,000 last year. That's because he's got 1 year to go on his rookie contract!
That's how the smart teams manage the salary cap. Not by paying $9 million a year for a veteran FA.
I'd rather have John Abraham than have Shanahan ignore DE in the draft for another year, but he should still draft a DE or DT #1 this year -- unless a top TE is available, since there's now also a need at that position after Jeb Putzier's departure.
As was brought out in an earlier post, considering that Denver has drafted at the bottom 20-25% of each round for so many years, the picks haven't been that bad. A top 5 pick over a 25-30 pick is a big difference. New England has dominated for the last 4-5 years, but what about before that? They played in 1985 and got creamed by the Bears. Between then and the late 90s, they were getting all kinds of early 1st round picks and not making the playoffs. San Diego and Chokeland both have histories of numerous early picks and they have both been in one Super Bowl in the last twenty years. Over the last decade (at least), it takes a blend of the draft and the free-agency to be successful. Obviously, the Broncos have been more successful with free-agents as they are usually proven players and have less chance of failure to make the team. WIth Shannahan's winning record at Denver, he has to be one of the better decision-makers over the total picture. The wins are not all attributed to Shannahan's on-field coaching, as the talent level at Denver has been very much improved since he arrived. His decision-making on who he chooses as his coaches has to be considered. All this Shannahan bashing is about as silly as the Jake bashers. Based on what really counts, WINNING, the Denver Broncos organization is the most successful in the NFL over the last decade. Guess what, that relates to Shannahan's tenure as the top decision-maker. Give credit where it is due and show some respect by waiting until all the opportunities are over. Just like last year, many posters are whining and crying about decisions being made early in the time frame available for change. The staff did a very good job last year, remember 14-4, and have a much better draft situation coming up. If you want to criticize, wait until the decisions have been made. No one, that includes you MUG, can know what the staff will do to improve the team.
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