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Who would you bring in at QB during the offseason, and why?

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  • DiveInstructor
    replied
    Originally posted by broncolee View Post

    They added Gronk and Brown and didn’t even need Brown. Probably didn’t need Gronk either.

    Having Brady got the Buc over the top but they were loaded with talent before he got there. That’s why he went there.
    Are you just trying to win an argument based on one irrelevant point? Because that loaded-with-talent Buccaneers team went 7-9, 5-11, and 5-11 the three years prior to Brady's presence, with no sign of being a playoff consistent team.

    And, my whole point is that's what the Broncos will do if they never get that special QB on their team. They blow this draft position opportunity on their BPA CB or LB, and it'll be years of losing and mediocrity, just like history has shown us with the Broncos, and just like the Buccaneers were without Brady.

    A "talented" team will be mediocre without that special QB. One special QB will elevate a mediocre team to the post season, and a good team to SB c-ship opportunities. The bar is always lower, no matter the talent on the team, without that special QB.

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  • broncolee
    replied
    Originally posted by DiveInstructor View Post

    I'd hope not. Because without Brady, the Bucs would've been lucky to see the post season.

    BTW, they had a crap defense in 2019. Also, you think Gronk would've come out of retirement without Brady? How 'bout AB signing on the Bucs? Without Brady, would he have? Nope. That amazing team Brady got with the Bucs was because of his presence. So stop with the, "he had a great team around him." Brady is the sole key to why that team is great. And, it's why the Broncos need their HOF QB before any other player, because without that guy, they'll be a lot of nothing, just like they have been.
    They added Gronk and Brown and didn’t even need Brown. Probably didn’t need Gronk either.

    Having Brady got the Buc over the top but they were loaded with talent before he got there. That’s why he went there.

    Leave a comment:


  • WYBRONCO
    replied
    Originally posted by DiveInstructor View Post

    Take away Rodgers and the Packers would be lucky to make the playoffs. For the millionth time, go look through SB championship history of at least the past 20 years, and 75% of the wins, which is considered to be team dynasty, are with an HOF QB under center. The few without are a flash in the pan.

    Yes, to win a Super Bowl, it takes a whole team. But, when you have a HOF capable QB, you can do it much easier, and you can do it year after year.
    Oh I agree with you. Elway got Denver to 3 Super Bowls with an okay Defense and pretty good supporting cast. I said in a post earlier of the Super Bowl winning QB's almost every winner was a Top 5 QB in the league at the time or a HOF QB. Without a HOF caliber QB you are a 1 hit wonder in today's game.

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  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by S037474 View Post

    To play devil's advocate, arnt you just wasting all those first round picks anyway If you don't have a QB to build around? You think we have a snowballs chance in hell to win the division with Mahomes and Herbert with out a STAR QB? Do you think a stellar defense with a game manger type QB beats the chiefs consistently? Like the 49ers?

    We need a QB, Lock can complete but we need a contender, it's like a lottery ticket and we need to keep buying tickets. Spend alllll the other draft picks on defense and all FA money on defense cause our offense is set other than QB.
    Not sure if my response is going to be as relevant to both, given there are two different members involved with my commentary, but here goes: the key is to either be very sound in who you scout, and therefore when you draft a QB high up in the draft, you do your very best to get it right. Not always easy but there are some young QBs that have a pretty high likelihood of success. So if you ever get close to #1, or if you see a guy like Wilson, who you could get lower down only because of a physical "thing", your chances and your draft effectiveness should be pretty solid. But if you continue to mess with borderline NFL QB talent in the draft - Tebow, Lynch, Lock,,,but using firsts and seconds in the process, your chances of success at finding a long term QB are not as likely, but you still pay a pretty heavy capital bill. Imagine who we might have lost by drafting those players? I know, it's easy in the rear view mirror, and Lock is not done by any means. Some will stand by Tebow back then, and that's fine.

    And in this year's case, if we use our pick at 9, you have to weigh out the competitive landscape, and in this draft....unless we move up (which is costly), we are trying to land our franchise QB after at least 2 or even 3 draftees are gone. The odds of landing a franchise QB with the 3rd or 4th best QB in the draft are slimmer. IMO, Lawrence might be the only sure thing this year...and even then, maybe just a decent starter for all we know.

    So I am fine if we had the #1 pick and took him. But we don't have the #1 pick. If we pick the 3rd or 4th QB as is currently ranked, I am not buying it. Lock might end up better.

    So yes, if another Manning opportunity came, where a quality, proven leader is available, and even in this year's case, at a pretty stiff price, I would prefer to go that route, without selling the farm. If he has 3 or 4 good years left, and we think we are close to a playoff run, I'd take the shot. You only win a SB once in a long while. Some teams forget what they are even competing for given their poor long term production. Conversely, I do not what retreads, or players who had one decent season in a career of ordinary success. We've tried that. it just resets the clock to "next year".

    So yeah, Manning faded at the end, but he helped us with 2 SB visits in just 4 seasons. CHECK! Brady took Tampa much farther than most expected (already), and he is 43. Though not as good when he arrived as the first two, but Brees made The Saints a winner. You do not need to draft a QB to win. You need a solid organization, involving a wisely selected roster (good coaching and more).

    So to get back to your devil's advocacy...I do not condone year after year of "maybe" long term QBs, unless you go after the stud very early, or if you land one a little deeper who has it all but perhaps one physical characteristic. You see, I don't care if a WR can run a 4.0 40, if he can run routes, be great off the line and in mid route moves, and catch the ball (as a receiver should). I want a consistent player with all facets of the game and not so much super speed. And as far I'm concerned, if you keep missing the target with these quality picks (1sts and 2nds) you will likely miss the mark with other positions on your team...where a late 1st or 2nd might fill a need on day one, as opposed to what a QB on the bench will do for you. And sure, lets give some leeway on drafting young QBs. It's not an easy thing. But if you keep missing 3, 4, 5 or more times with that type of draft capital, the endgame is you will lose a load of competitive edge to many opponents.

    As I say, easy for me to proclaim, but don't ever look at the guys we could have had while searching for our next potential QB in the draft. it might make you cry a little. (or in my case, a lot!)

    Leave a comment:


  • DiveInstructor
    replied
    Originally posted by broncolee View Post

    Never said that.
    I'd hope not. Because without Brady, the Bucs would've been lucky to see the post season.

    BTW, they had a crap defense in 2019. Also, you think Gronk would've come out of retirement without Brady? How 'bout AB signing on the Bucs? Without Brady, would he have? Nope. That amazing team Brady got with the Bucs was because of his presence. So stop with the, "he had a great team around him." Brady is the sole key to why that team is great. And, it's why the Broncos need their HOF QB before any other player, because without that guy, they'll be a lot of nothing, just like they have been.

    Leave a comment:


  • Taos_Broncomaniac
    replied
    Originally posted by DiveInstructor View Post

    So, you're saying that without Brady, the Bucs would still be in the SB because of the talent around him, eh? I call bull. Big time.
    Brady elevated that team the same way Manning elevated ours back in the day, he threw three int's against the Pack, and they still won. Shaq and that defense are the 2015 Broncos.

    Leave a comment:


  • broncolee
    replied
    Originally posted by Bronco51 View Post

    They were the 29th ranked defense last season. Brady's tide raised all ships for that team this season. And as to your second point, they were in the playoffs with him last year, and weren't this year.

    I pray the Broncos get a QB where we are talking contender every season instead of who's next
    Do you think they were ranked so low last season because the previous quarterback kept screwing them over?

    They could have easily been a top ten defense last season with any other quarterback that throws less than 15 interceptions.

    The point is, Brady isn’t the only reason the Bucs got to the Super Bowl. If he were, why would he have felt the need to leave New England?

    Leave a comment:


  • broncolee
    replied
    Originally posted by DiveInstructor View Post

    So, you're saying that without Brady, the Bucs would still be in the SB because of the talent around him, eh? I call bull. Big time.
    Never said that.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bronco51
    replied
    Originally posted by broncolee View Post

    They also had a top ten defense and a plethora of talent on offense.

    That same quarterback left New England because he didn’t think he could succeed there any longer, because of what would have been around him.
    They were the 29th ranked defense last season. Brady's tide raised all ships for that team this season. And as to your second point, they were in the playoffs with him last year, and weren't this year.

    I pray the Broncos get a QB where we are talking contender every season instead of who's next

    Leave a comment:


  • DiveInstructor
    replied
    Originally posted by broncolee View Post

    They also had a top ten defense and a plethora of talent on offense.

    That same quarterback left New England because he didn’t think he could succeed there any longer, because of what would have been around him.
    So, you're saying that without Brady, the Bucs would still be in the SB because of the talent around him, eh? I call bull. Big time.

    Leave a comment:


  • DiveInstructor
    replied
    Originally posted by broncolee View Post

    You can’t let the rest of the team go to crap while searching for the unicorn. ...:
    And, you can't get your dynasty without your unicorn. BTW, they've been trying to maintain that team without their HOF QBs. What has that gotten them? No playoff game in 5 years? 4 straight losing seasons? You think a CB is going to turn things around this next season? What nonsense. Building your roster without the one key position that proves itself year after year is the most idiotic, short-sighted team-building approach.

    They say repeating the same mistake time after time is insanity. I call it stuck on stupid. The Broncos have been stuck on stupid.

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  • broncolee
    replied
    Originally posted by Bronco51 View Post

    Yep. The Bucs hadn't made the playoffs in 13 years prior. A 43 year old GOAT strolls in and puts them in the Super Bowl immediately.
    They also had a top ten defense and a plethora of talent on offense.

    That same quarterback left New England because he didn’t think he could succeed there any longer, because of what would have been around him.

    Leave a comment:


  • broncolee
    replied
    Originally posted by DiveInstructor View Post

    Take away Rodgers and the Packers would be lucky to make the playoffs. For the millionth time, go look through SB championship history of at least the past 20 years, and 75% of the wins, which is considered to be team dynasty, are with an HOF QB under center. The few without are a flash in the pan.

    Yes, to win a Super Bowl, it takes a whole team. But, when you have a HOF capable QB, you can do it much easier, and you can do it year after year.
    You can’t let the rest of the team go to crap while searching for the unicorn. The Packers have the unicorn and still struggle to get as far as they want.
    I will say that Packer fans should be eternally grateful considering the destitute years between the first two Super Bowls and when they got Favre. They are at least in the mix on yearly basis.

    You can’t just keep drafting a guy early and think that you’re going to be competitive, even after you finally find the guy. What will be around him after the search for the unicorn is done? How long will it take to build around him? How long before he gets blamed and coaches get fired for not achieving the desired success?

    I don’t want the Broncos to become Cleveland West. might not have even found their unicorn yet. He might just be pretty little pony. He could be the carriage that turns back into a pumpkin at midnight.

    Hopefully they get things figured out sooner rather than later.

    Leave a comment:


  • DiveInstructor
    replied
    Originally posted by Bronco51 View Post

    Yep. The Bucs hadn't made the playoffs in 13 years prior. A 43 year old GOAT strolls in and puts them in the Super Bowl immediately.
    Not sure why this is so hard to understand by so many. Well, I do understand, but I can't speak my mind without possibly getting tossed from the board...LOL. Oh, and let's keep in mind that the strong players the Bucs brought in were enticed by the presence of Brady. Same thing happened here with the Broncos, once Manning arrived. No offense to the Lock believers, but Lock's not attracting anyone but guys afraid of never seeing the NFL field again. Heck, no QB the Broncos have had since Manning would be any different.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bronco51
    replied
    Originally posted by DiveInstructor View Post

    Take away Rodgers and the Packers would be lucky to make the playoffs. For the millionth time, go look through SB championship history of at least the past 20 years, and 75% of the wins, which is considered to be team dynasty, are with an HOF QB under center. The few without are a flash in the pan.

    Yes, to win a Super Bowl, it takes a whole team. But, when you have a HOF capable QB, you can do it much easier, and you can do it year after year.
    Yep. The Bucs hadn't made the playoffs in 13 years prior. A 43 year old GOAT strolls in and puts them in the Super Bowl immediately.

    Leave a comment:

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