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What's the difference? Elway 1997-98 vs Manning 2012-13

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  • What's the difference? Elway 1997-98 vs Manning 2012-13

    What's the difference between Elway winning 2 straight SBs in a row vs Manning choking in the championship and SB 2 straight years in a row? How was Elway able to get it done when Manning hasn't? We're the Ravens and Seahawks really that good or what is that Manning is simply living up to his "choke artist playoff label" in big games? I mean at the same age level one got it done, one hasn't.

    Swapping teams here would the 97 Broncos and John Elway have been able to beat the Ravens in 2012 without choking? What about the 2013 Seahawks, would Elway and Davis including the defense have lost and choked so badly?

    I mean we're the Ravens and the Seahawks really that good or is it just that Manning is bound to choke in the POs and there is nothing anyone can do about it?

    Who had the better supporting cast for the years mentioned, Elway or Manning?

    You have what 1 maybe 2 years left with Manning and then it's back to the Dweebow QB board and to the bottom of the basement once again.

    Hurry up Denver fans, I haven't got all day here.
    Last edited by NoRingNoGlory; 10-14-2014, 12:20 PM.
    Sorry Denver Haters...I've been on an extended business trip....:thumb:

  • #2
    A running back.


    To elaborate, look at the cowboys, they beat the Seahawks on the legs of Murray. I think the biggest piece of our puzzle that we are missing (and really were to an extent missing last year) is that bruising back like TD.
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    • #3
      A great O line




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      • #4
        Originally posted by #87Birdman View Post
        A great O line
        An elite C, an elite RB, and an elite TE make a big difference. Then add Mobley Atwater and Romanowski on the D and you have a team that had a much wider core
        Last edited by Joshecalpoly; 10-14-2014, 12:41 PM.
        2016 Draft: http://forums.denverbroncos.com/show...aft-Watch-list

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Freyaka View Post
          A running back.


          To elaborate, look at the cowboys, they beat the Seahawks on the legs of Murray. I think the biggest piece of our puzzle that we are missing (and really were to an extent missing last year) is that bruising back like TD.
          I don't know if I'd ever call TD a bruising back. He was a decisive one cut guy that typically ran through huge holes and was at full speed before the secondary knew it. He was big enough that he didn't go down easy with arm tackles, I'll give you that.

          The difference between Manning and Elway was Elway was still mobile and could PA you to death if you tried to focus on TD. The Elway Broncos could move the pocket from side to side because Elway could move. This kept the D honest and playing the entire field from side to side and front to back.

          Manning can fine pass you to death but as a D you know exactly where he's gonna be every down. You also know that the pass is going to come in three seconds or less most of the time and you don't really have to worry about longer than that or a scramble for a first. Manning can still cause misery but it's pretty much all on him because he keeps the D close to the line and all focused in the middle of the field. Our only move to get the field wide is the bubble screens. This makes running the ball awful hard. Defense can pretty much sit and wait and hope for drops when Manning scientific approach fails. With good CB's it's just play tight. With the Jets and bad CB's it was get Peyton to move which actually left gaps for our run game.
          Anybody know how to get out of Plan A? - Elway

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          • #6
            Originally posted by MegaOrange View Post
            I don't know if I'd ever call TD a bruising back. He was a decisive one cut guy that typically ran through huge holes and was at full speed before the secondary knew it. He was big enough that he didn't go down easy with arm tackles, I'll give you that.

            The difference between Manning and Elway was Elway was still mobile and could PA you to death if you tried to focus on TD. The Elway Broncos could move the pocket from side to side because Elway could move. This kept the D honest and playing the entire field from side to side and front to back.

            Manning can fine pass you to death but as a D you know exactly where he's gonna be every down. You also know that the pass is going to come in three seconds or less most of the time and you don't really have to worry about longer than that or a scramble for a first. Manning can still cause misery but it's pretty much all on him because he keeps the D close to the line and all focused in the middle of the field. Our only move to get the field wide is the bubble screens. This makes running the ball awful hard. Defense can pretty much sit and wait and hope for drops when Manning scientific approach fails. With good CB's it's just play tight. With the Jets and bad CB's it was get Peyton to move which actually left gaps for our run game.
            he was a cut back mostly which is why he had knee and ankle issues so early on, he avoided hits very well but he also played with a bit of power
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            • #7
              Originally posted by Joshecalpoly View Post
              he was a cut back mostly which is why he had knee and ankle issues so early on, he avoided hits very well but he also played with a bit of power
              I don't recall TD ever having any issues besides migraines early on. Sharpe had ankle issues, non-stop. I recall TD being super healthy until Griese threw that pick and his own linemen took out his knee. After that happened he never was the same.
              Anybody know how to get out of Plan A? - Elway

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              • #8
                Originally posted by MegaOrange View Post
                I don't recall TD ever having any issues besides migraines early on. Sharpe had ankle issues, non-stop. I recall TD being super healthy until Griese threw that pick and his own linemen took out his knee. After that happened he never was the same.
                later in his career he got ankle and knees, which is common with cut backs and rib issues which is common with power backs. Those are things that ware and tare as time goes on

                The knees are what took him out completely, the ankles got swollen at times and he played often with bruised or even broken ribs.
                Last edited by Joshecalpoly; 10-14-2014, 01:12 PM.
                2016 Draft: http://forums.denverbroncos.com/show...aft-Watch-list

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by NoRingNoGlory View Post
                  What's the difference between Elway winning 2 straight SBs in a row vs Manning choking in the championship and SB 2 straight years in a row? How was Elway able to get it done when Manning hasn't? We're the Ravens and Seahawks really that good or what is that Manning is simply living up to his "choke artist playoff label" in big games? I mean at the same age level one got it done, one hasn't.

                  Swapping teams here would the 97 Broncos and John Elway have been able to beat the Ravens in 2012 without choking? What about the 2013 Seahawks, would Elway and Davis including the defense have lost and choked so badly?

                  I mean we're the Ravens and the Seahawks really that good or is it just that Manning is bound to choke in the POs and there is nothing anyone can do about it?

                  Who had the better supporting cast for the years mentioned, Elway or Manning?

                  You have what 1 maybe 2 years left with Manning and then it's back to the Dweebow QB board and to the bottom of the basement once again.

                  Hurry up Denver fans, I haven't got all day here.
                  Elways team won two superbowls.
                  Whats the difference between the Chargers and every team every year that doesn't win the Superbowl.
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                  • #10
                    The difference was Elway forgoing the vast majority of his salary his last two years. (restructuring) After all the Super Bowl failures I guess he got fed up. As I remember it, he played for something like $300,000 and $1,000,000 in his last two years. Since the salary cap was around $50,000,000 at the time, it is equivalent to Manning playing for $700,000 and 2,500,000 for consecutive years. The resultant players signed could push the Broncos over the top today as it did back then. Not going to happen nowadays in the present environment of fan concern over NFL integrity. The NFL would not allow it without severe restrictions to prevent the owner from compensating Manning in the future like what happened with Elway.

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                    • #11
                      Seattle was really good last year.

                      I don't think Bal was all that great when they won it, just got hot, like the Giants did.

                      Your obsession is sad though.

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                      • #12
                        Elway is my favorite Bronco of all time but he was known as the guy who couldn't win the big game until he did. Manning already has a ring, you have no point!

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Freyaka View Post
                          A running back.


                          To elaborate, look at the cowboys, they beat the Seahawks on the legs of Murray. I think the biggest piece of our puzzle that we are missing (and really were to an extent missing last year) is that bruising back like TD.
                          You make a very good point. Without TD there is no way Elway wins those rings. I think we all can agree on that. BTW, think about the 1996 Denver Broncos for a second. Denver was 13-3 and the top rushing team that year with TD. With HFA throughout they ended up getting ushered right out of the playoffs losing to the 9-7 Jaguars by 3 points (27-30). This loss is still a mystery to many a faithful long time Denver fans, it is un-explicable to this day. There is not a good enough excuse anywhere for that loss.
                          Sorry Denver Haters...I've been on an extended business trip....:thumb:

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by ERoyal248 View Post
                            Seattle was really good last year.

                            I don't think Bal was all that great when they won it, just got hot, like the Giants did.

                            Your obsession is sad though.
                            I don't know, the Broncos seemed pretty hot and running on all cylinders both years deep into the PO's.
                            Oh I forgot, Manning didn't have TD on his team so its a given they were supposed to lose both times. I get it.

                            Next.

                            Sorry Denver Haters...I've been on an extended business trip....:thumb:

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by #87Birdman View Post
                              A great O line
                              So if Manning had a "great O line" protecting him the Broncos would have 4 rings by now?
                              Hmmmm.....do you really think that was the problem here?
                              So Elway had a "great O line", much much better than Mannings, where he could sit down for a picnic lunch and then get back up and throw a touchdown real quick, is that what you are saying?
                              Sorry Denver Haters...I've been on an extended business trip....:thumb:

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