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  • Originally posted by baphamet View Post
    yes we know you would take TD every time over any HOF RB, you have said that already. it was funny at first but now it's just getting annoying. the off season is over, you can put your homer opinions to bed now.
    In a career no but at the peak yes. There are many players in every sport who had a string of seasons that are insurmountable but were forced out early for one reason or another. TD is one of those players and in the height of his career there are few RB's that you could say you would rather have.

    Its like asking who would rather have leading your team Cardale Jones or Cody Kessler. Sure Cody Kessler has had a greater body of work but nothing hes done has compared to what Cardale did.
    Last edited by Joshecalpoly; 09-16-2015, 12:14 PM.
    2016 Draft: http://forums.denverbroncos.com/show...aft-Watch-list

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    • Originally posted by Joshecalpoly View Post
      In a career no but at the peak yes. There are many players in every sport who had a string of seasons that are insurmountable but were forced out early for one reason or another. TD is one of those players and in the height of his career there are few RB's that you could say you would rather have.

      Its like asking who would rather have leading your team Cardale Jones or Cody Kessler. Sure Cody Kessler has had a greater body of work but nothing hes done has compared to what Cardale did.
      Qbs are suppose to play well in the postseason, if a runningback named LT chokes it's his teams fault, if TD dominates it's only because of his oline and any rb could do it even though TD'S back ups never touched his postseason numbers.
      sigpic

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      • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
        Qbs are suppose to play well in the postseason, if a runningback named LT chokes it's his teams fault, if TD dominates it's only because of his oline and any rb could do it even though TD'S back ups never touched his postseason numbers.
        Dont forget that while TDs post season numbers dont matter he did carry Elway to the Championship...
        Originally posted by baphamet
        are you talking career or right now? because i don't see how you can say manning is top 5 even healthy.dude will never be a top 5 QB again, he is done.

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        • lol homers, too bad the entire world disagrees with you, huh? why wasn't TD first ballet HOF'er if he was better than everyone else? based on an 8 game career in the playoffs of course!

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          • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
            Qbs are suppose to play well in the postseason, if a runningback named LT chokes it's his teams fault, if TD dominates it's only because of his oline and any rb could do it even though TD'S back ups never touched his postseason numbers.
            show me one post where i said any of that LOL

            what's it like living in that puke orange bubble of yours?

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            • Originally posted by baphamet View Post
              show me one post where i said any of that LOL

              what's it like living in that puke orange bubble of yours?
              It may be hard often confusing vanilla ice cream for a creamsicle, with orange glasses.
              Last edited by fallforward3y+; 09-17-2015, 04:09 AM.

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              • Originally posted by Beagle View Post
                Dont forget that while TDs post season numbers dont matter he did carry Elway to the Championship...
                According to Baphs and Fall forward any bronco fan who would take the runningback who was MVP of the Superbowl the first year of back to back titles and the league MVP the second year of their back to back title runs is a homer because LT had better regular season stats? Who sounds like the homer to you the fan who backs his rb despite the fact he couldn't do anything in the postseason or the fan who appreciates one of the best 4 year runs in the regular and postseason by anyback in nfl history! ?!
                Manning had the greatest single season in regular season history, very few Broncos fans would take Manning over Elway, why two titles! Keep your records, will keep our trophies!!
                Rings over regular season stats is not a homer move it's just a winners mentality.
                Last edited by 58Miller; 09-17-2015, 05:44 AM.
                sigpic

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                • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
                  According to Baphs and Fall forward any bronco fan who would take the runningback who was MVP of the Superbowl the first year of back to back titles and the league MVP the second year of their back to back title runs is a homer because LT had better regular season stats? Who sounds like the homer to you the fan who backs his rb despite the fact he couldn't do anything in the postseason or the fan who appreciates one of the best 4 year runs in the regular and postseason by anyback in nfl history! ?!
                  Manning had the greatest single season in regular season history, very few Broncos fans would take Manning over Elway, why two titles! Keep your records, will keep our trophies!!
                  Rings over regular season stats is not a homer move it's just a winners mentality.

                  but remember he would rather get beat in the wild card or not make the post season, rather then lose in the superbowl....it is losers mentaility
                  sigpic
                  when do native Americans become human and not mascots

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                  • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
                    According to Baphs and Fall forward any bronco fan who would take the runningback who was MVP of the Superbowl the first year of back to back titles and the league MVP the second year of their back to back title runs is a homer because LT had better regular season stats? Who sounds like the homer to you the fan who backs his rb despite the fact he couldn't do anything in the postseason or the fan who appreciates one of the best 4 year runs in the regular and postseason by anyback in nfl history! ?!
                    Manning had the greatest single season in regular season history, very few Broncos fans would take Manning over Elway, why two titles! Keep your records, will keep our trophies!!
                    Rings over regular season stats is not a homer move it's just a winners mentality.
                    oh no it's total homer actually lol

                    you can blindly back TD because he was a broncos player and you being the premier homer on this board, that's what you do. but the entire world disagrees with you. never mind LT, go look up any top 10 RB all time list and most have barry sanders in the top 3 and he "choked" in the playoffs too.

                    ever ask yourself why RB's like barry sanders don't get questioned for why they don't have rings but QB's do? of course you don't, because you can only see through your donkey homer glasses and TD is just the best ever because what he did to help your team win rings and thats that!

                    its simply hilarious you have such a single minded point of view on things donkey related, even funnier still that the broncos have a RB in the HOF thats never even played in a playoff game yet TD is not in the HOF, and you think it is so important what TD has done in the playoffs?

                    i don't know why i keep feeding your trolling, i guess in that sense you are winning

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                    • Originally posted by baphamet View Post
                      show me one post where i said any of that LOL

                      what's it like living in that puke orange bubble of yours?
                      Well when talking about Rivers losses or poor performances its always a team game and you do mention that the others around him let him down like LT. When Manning loses its all his fault no matter if he played well.

                      Again if we are talking a career I would put Franco Harris, Thurman Thomas, and Emmit Smith over TD but for the seasons he was at his best I wouldn't want anyone else because nobody did more in a shorter period (only argument in the SB era might be Dickerson if he carried a team to the SB). Still holding the most consecutive 100 yard gain record most, highest career ypr after 100 attempts or more record and still holds most TD's in SB record

                      Best thing is you argue against Elway saying he had TD, but then argue against TD saying he wasn't that good. In the end your arguments are just as homeristic as ours.
                      Last edited by Joshecalpoly; 09-17-2015, 11:59 AM.
                      2016 Draft: http://forums.denverbroncos.com/show...aft-Watch-list

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                      • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
                        According to Baphs and Fall forward any bronco fan who would take the runningback who was MVP of the Superbowl the first year of back to back titles and the league MVP the second year of their back to back title runs is a homer because LT had better regular season stats? Who sounds like the homer to you the fan who backs his rb despite the fact he couldn't do anything in the postseason or the fan who appreciates one of the best 4 year runs in the regular and postseason by anyback in nfl history! ?!
                        Manning had the greatest single season in regular season history, very few Broncos fans would take Manning over Elway, why two titles! Keep your records, will keep our trophies!!
                        Rings over regular season stats is not a homer move it's just a winners mentality.
                        Because you are surrounded by fellow Bronco homers, you may actually get away with ignoring the points me and Baphs are making to make it sound like your point is obvious. Eventually, he and I may give up on rebuttling the homer responses and you may convince yourself we didn't come up with points to refute your argument because you kept ignoring the points we made.

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                        • Originally posted by Joshecalpoly View Post
                          Well when talking about Rivers losses or poor performances its always a team game and you do mention that the others around him let him down like LT. When Manning loses its all his fault no matter if he played well.

                          Again if we are talking a career I would put Franco Harris, Thurman Thomas, and Emmit Smith over TD but for the seasons he was at his best I wouldn't want anyone else because nobody did more in a shorter period (only argument in the SB era might be Dickerson if he carried a team to the SB). Still holding the most consecutive 100 yard gain record most, highest career ypr after 100 attempts or more record and still holds most TD's in SB record

                          Best thing is you argue against Elway saying he had TD, but then argue against TD saying he wasn't that good. In the end your arguments are just as homeristic as ours.
                          Your points about taking TD in his best season over any back are fair, although I will say that I think one could make a good argument for LT's 2003 and 2006 seasons being better than TD's 98 season, but I think that all 3 of those seasons were near the top of all time, statistically speaking. This is a fair point your making.

                          It's like how if JJ Watt didn't play in the NFL again after this season(I hope that doesn't happen to him)it would be hard for me to rank his career as one of the best all time, however I would probably be able to say that his best season was among the all time great seasons for a Defensive End in the NFL(up until now, at least).

                          However, if we are talking about a career(which the thread seems to be about)then it is very different to me, and I wouldn't rank TD near the top of the all time RB list.

                          When I mention things about help TD had around him, I'm not doing it to try and say what he did wasn't impressive. I'm more so doing it to discredit arguments that the difference in the postseason stats should be attributed to nothing more than TD's superiority. A great back can play with a great QB, and a great line and still be a great back, however if people start comparing stats of a back in that situation to another acting like it's a fair comparison, that gets a bit ridiculous to me.

                          Plus, it's hard to buy into claims about a player performing poorly 'despite the players around him' like ones made about LT in the postseason with his line, because it assumes that the line played well because they had good players, all while claiming a good player can play poorly in the postseason. It's hard to buy about any player really. It's why I don't like to do the 'measure players by wins by add and subtract by the players around him' game, it is often flawed.

                          A good example is with Aaron Rodgers in the playoff game versus the Cardinals. You could say 'despite a great defense, and a good group of skill players, he didn't get it done'. However, that great defense(that was very good that year imo)gave up 45 points to AZ. So, that makes it seem kind of ridiculous to make it seem like the defense was some huge help and they couldn't win despite how well it played. In actuality, Rodgers to me had an incredible playoff performance. Granted, he did fumble in OT which lead to the loss, however imo he had to play great for them to even be in the game at that point. Their defense was very good, however it did not play very well that game imo, so it seems kind of ridiculous to me to act like they lost despite having great play from their defense, because well...in that game they didn't imo, lol.

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                          • Originally posted by fallforward3y+ View Post
                            Your points about taking TD in his best season over any back are fair, although I will say that I think one could make a good argument for LT's 2003 and 2006 seasons being better than TD's 98 season, but I think that all 3 of those seasons were near the top of all time, statistically speaking. This is a fair point your making.

                            It's like how if JJ Watt didn't play in the NFL again after this season(I hope that doesn't happen to him)it would be hard for me to rank his career as one of the best all time, however I would probably be able to say that his best season was among the all time great seasons for a Defensive End in the NFL(up until now, at least).

                            However, if we are talking about a career(which the thread seems to be about)then it is very different to me, and I wouldn't rank TD near the top of the all time RB list.

                            When I mention things about help TD had around him, I'm not doing it to try and say what he did wasn't impressive. I'm more so doing it to discredit arguments that the difference in the postseason stats should be attributed to nothing more than TD's superiority. A great back can play with a great QB, and a great line and still be a great back, however if people start comparing stats of a back in that situation to another acting like it's a fair comparison, that gets a bit ridiculous to me.

                            Plus, it's hard to buy into claims about a player performing poorly 'despite the players around him' like ones made about LT in the postseason with his line, because it assumes that the line played well because they had good players, all while claiming a good player can play poorly in the postseason. It's hard to buy about any player really. It's why I don't like to do the 'measure players by wins by add and subtract by the players around him' game, it is often flawed.

                            A good example is with Aaron Rodgers in the playoff game versus the Cardinals. You could say 'despite a great defense, and a good group of skill players, he didn't get it done'. However, that great defense(that was very good that year imo)gave up 45 points to AZ. So, that makes it seem kind of ridiculous to make it seem like the defense was some huge help and they couldn't win despite how well it played. In actuality, Rodgers to me had an incredible playoff performance. Granted, he did fumble in OT which lead to the loss, however imo he had to play great for them to even be in the game at that point. Their defense was very good, however it did not play very well that game imo, so it seems kind of ridiculous to me to act like they lost despite having great play from their defense, because well...in that game they didn't imo, lol.
                            96-98 TD had 5,296 yard and averaged 4.8 ypc 83 Touchdowns

                            2003-2005 LT had 4,442 and average 4.5 ypc 48 Touchdowns

                            but thats ok he never had a 2,000 yard season in his career so those stats just get skewed I guess for those 3 seasons

                            2004-2006 LT still only had 4,612 yards for 4.6 63 Touchdowns

                            LT's best season was 60 yards more then TD's 2nd best and it came in a year TD didnt even complete that season.

                            And thats just regular season Postseason its not even a contest even per game he averaged 41 yards more, but thats what happens when you average 1.5 ypc carry more. He was a work horse and honestly its a big reason his career was cut so short.
                            Last edited by Joshecalpoly; 09-18-2015, 05:04 AM.
                            2016 Draft: http://forums.denverbroncos.com/show...aft-Watch-list

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                            • Originally posted by Joshecalpoly View Post
                              96-98 TD had 5,296 yard and averaged 4.8 ypc 83 Touchdowns

                              2003-2005 LT had 4,442 and average 4.5 ypc 48 Touchdowns

                              but thats ok he never had a 2,000 yard season in his career so those stats just get skewed I guess for those 3 seasons

                              2004-2006 LT still only had 4,612 yards for 4.6 63 Touchdowns

                              LT's best season was 60 yards more then TD's 2nd best and it came in a year TD didnt even complete that season.

                              And thats just regular season Postseason its not even a contest even per game he averaged 41 yards more, but thats what happens when you average 1.5 ypc carry more. He was a work horse and honestly its a big reason his career was cut so short.
                              By all 3 I meant TD's 98, LT's 03 and LT's 06, as in those 3 efforts in a single season were among the best all time statistically, not the best 3 consecutive seasons for a RB. I was thinking of total yards, rushing and receiving. His total yards I believe in both 03 and 06 were more than TD's 98 season.

                              In judging a player's impact I don't want to leave that out since it plays a big role.

                              In the 2006 post season LT had 123 yards rushing and 64 yards receiving, 187 total yards in one game. For just that season, it was a pretty good post season out put as well. For individual seasons statistically, I would rank LT in 2006 as one of the best of all time.

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                              • Originally posted by fallforward3y+ View Post
                                By all 3 I meant TD's 98, LT's 03 and LT's 06, as in those 3 efforts in a single season were among the best all time statistically, not the best 3 consecutive seasons for a RB. I was thinking of total yards, rushing and receiving. His total yards I believe in both 03 and 06 were more than TD's 98 season.

                                In judging a player's impact I don't want to leave that out since it plays a big role.

                                In the 2006 post season LT had 123 yards rushing and 64 yards receiving, 187 total yards in one game. For just that season, it was a pretty good post season out put as well. For individual seasons statistically, I would rank LT in 2006 as one of the best of all time.
                                That's fair though really in the Broncos O they didn't use RB's in the passing game all that much, the west coast offense just doesn't involve a lot of using a RB as a receiver except maybe on a few screens or hitches. I am not dissing the 4th best yards from scrimmage RB all time (faulk, payton, and emmitt smith being better) but a lot of that has more to do with offense you are in rather then your actual skills

                                Barry Sanders for one who had 111 less rushes and 272 less receptions only had 166 less yards then LT. I don't put LT ahead of him

                                Also I am showing that consistently TD in that small window versus the what is LT's best window TD was a better rusher. Do not get me wrong I would have loved having LT if we could of sucked so badly or traded the house to get him but we didn't. TD fell into our lap and was a rare talent that fought through literal blinding pain for some of the best seasons in NFL history
                                Last edited by Joshecalpoly; 09-18-2015, 07:33 AM.
                                2016 Draft: http://forums.denverbroncos.com/show...aft-Watch-list

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