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AFC West 2019 offseason grades: Broncos' shrewd offseason helps close gap on Chargers

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  • #76
    Originally posted by Kyousukeneko View Post
    i don't see it happening. i see Fumagali on his out looking taking butt can stay health. i think we bring 3. Javo is not only one of the best FB in the NFL. he is super valuble on special teams i am pretty sure he played on all of the units. he may actually be one of the FBs worth big moneys
    Stackhouser: He hasn't seen the field a whole lot due to the offense they ran the last couple years.
    You (Kyousukeneko): Javo is not only one of the best FB in the NFL.

    How can Janovich be one of the best when he rarely sees the field?

    Apparently Andy Janovich has reached legend status.

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    • #77
      Originally posted by mozzerpete View Post
      Stackhouser: He hasn't seen the field a whole lot due to the offense they ran the last couple years.
      You (Kyousukeneko): Javo is not only one of the best FB in the NFL.

      How can Janovich be one of the best when he rarely sees the field?

      Apparently Andy Janovich has reached legend status.

      He didn't see the field much..... I wouldn't say he's the best in the league, but being there are very few FB's used, he could be. You brought up college stats and his draft prospect to grade him?? Not sure why?? He has only been targeted 23 times on passes in Denver with 17 catches. That is 74% catching percent. He doesn't drop the ball. You also have to consider the QB's he's had the last 3 years. Thing is, with the plan to run the ball and use the personnel they have, he's going to be a bigger proponent in the offense this year in my opinion. The TE's they have are not an H-back style. You don't use a 6'5" to 6'7" guy back at FB. It would be cool if they tried to figure out how to use him like Daryl Johnston was used by Dallas back in the 90's..... That's a true H-back....
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      • #78
        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
        He didn't see the field much..... I wouldn't say he's the best in the league, but being there are very few FB's used, he could be.
        '18 NFL Fullbacks: Zach Line, Kyle Juszczyk, Alex Armah, Derek Watt, C.J. Ham, James Develin, Andy Janovich, Roosevelt Nix, Tre Madden, Derrick Coleman, Nick Bellore, Tommy Bohanon, Keith Smith.

        Out of the 13 fullbacks I listed, still think he could be the best in the league?

        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
        You brought up college stats and his draft prospect to grade him?? Not sure why??
        Because I couldn't find his high school stats.

        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
        He has only been targeted 23 times on passes in Denver with 17 catches. That is 74% catching percent. He doesn't drop the ball.
        Every receiver drops the ball, even the great Jerry "Stickum" Rice.

        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
        You also have to consider the QB's he's had the last 3 years. Thing is, with the plan to run the ball and use the personnel they have, he's going to be a bigger proponent in the offense this year in my opinion.
        I've considered that plus Rich Scangarello's use of Kyle Juszczyk in his offense which led to this conversation.

        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
        The TE's they have are not an H-back style. You don't use a 6'5" to 6'7" guy back at FB.
        NFL offenses are changing and perhaps we should look into a TE/FB role before shutting it down.

        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
        It would be cool if they tried to figure out how to use him like Daryl Johnston was used by Dallas back in the 90's..... That's a true H-back....
        You previously state Janovich is a "true FB" and now you suggest he could be a true H-back?

        The legend continues, apparently.
        Last edited by mozzerpete; 07-01-2019, 03:14 PM.

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        • #79
          Originally posted by mozzerpete View Post
          '18 NFL Fullbacks: Zach Line, Kyle Juszczyk, Alex Armah, Derek Watt, C.J. Ham, James Develin, Andy Janovich, Roosevelt Nix, Tre Madden, Derrick Coleman, Nick Bellore, Tommy Bohanon, Keith Smith.

          Out of the 13 fullbacks I listed, still think he could be the best in the league?



          Because I couldn't find his high school stats.



          Every receiver drops the ball, even the great Jerry "Stickum" Rice.



          I've considered that plus Rich Scangarello's use of Kyle Juszczyk in his offense which led to this conversation.



          NFL offenses are changing and perhaps we should look into a TE/FB role before shutting it down.



          You previously state Janovich is a "true FB" and now you suggest he could be a true H-back?

          The legend continues, apparently.
          you are stuck on the H back, which is different then a traditional lead blocking, we need 3 yards lower the helmet and knock someone out of the way so the RB can get it, fullback

          we have a need for a Fullback, we already have Tes like Butt that can act as a H back if needed to lead block on sweeps ot screens
          but I don't think any TE we have can lower the shoulder, go off off guard and knock the Lb out of the play so we can get a short yardage 1st down or TD

          jano can
          sigpic
          when do native Americans become human and not mascots

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          • #80
            Originally posted by mozzerpete View Post
            '18 NFL Fullbacks: Zach Line, Kyle Juszczyk, Alex Armah, Derek Watt, C.J. Ham, James Develin, Andy Janovich, Roosevelt Nix, Tre Madden, Derrick Coleman, Nick Bellore, Tommy Bohanon, Keith Smith.

            Out of the 13 fullbacks I listed, still think he could be the best in the league?



            Because I couldn't find his high school stats.



            Every receiver drops the ball, even the great Jerry "Stickum" Rice.



            I've considered that plus Rich Scangarello's use of Kyle Juszczyk in his offense which led to this conversation.



            NFL offenses are changing and perhaps we should look into a TE/FB role before shutting it down.



            You previously state Janovich is a "true FB" and now you suggest he could be a true H-back?

            The legend continues, apparently.
            Again, they won't be moving the TE's to FB. They have a FB who is quite capable to play the position and 2 TE's that haven't even really seen the field so.......... and "WE" won't be looking in to a TE/FB position because "WE" aren't coaching the team.......

            As for the second highlighted comment from you, Yes I did say that..... Way to use your head to understand the grammar..... He is a "true FB"........ Then I stated that it would be cool if they could figure out how to use him like Daryl Johnston, to which I said is a true H-back........... Not sure how you got that I stated that Jano could be a true H-back??? I state Moose was a true H-back.....
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            • #81
              Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
              Again, they won't be moving the TE's to FB. They have a FB who is quite capable to play the position and 2 TE's that haven't even really seen the field so.......... and
              Apparently, we haven't seen Jano much on the field either, so..........This all started because I asked a simple question,
              "Does anyone know if Janovich can catch and be a similar threat as Juszczyk?"

              Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
              WE" won't be looking in to a TE/FB position because "WE" aren't coaching the team.......
              You might be missing the whole point of a message board. (I'm sure I did at some point.)

              Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
              As for the second highlighted comment from you, Yes I did say that..... Way to use your head to understand the grammar..... He is a "true FB"........ Then I stated that it would be cool if they could figure out how to use him like Daryl Johnston, to which I said is a true H-back........... Not sure how you got that I stated that Jano could be a true H-back??? I state Moose was a true H-back.....
              So you want a "True FB" to assume a "True HB" role but refuse to see how a TE can be a lead blocker out of the backfield?

              Don't worry, "WE" won't be looking into either scenario because someone with great wisdom stated, "'WE' aren't coaching the team......." lol

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              • #82
                Originally posted by arapaho View Post
                you are stuck on the H back, which is different then a traditional lead blocking, we need 3 yards lower the helmet and knock someone out of the way so the RB can get it, fullback

                we have a need for a Fullback, we already have Tes like Butt that can act as a H back if needed to lead block on sweeps ot screens
                but I don't think any TE we have can lower the shoulder, go off off guard and knock the Lb out of the play so we can get a short yardage 1st down or TD

                jano can
                Maybe the Broncos can look into it before the start of the season?
                (Assuming Janovich cannot replicate Juszczyk's catching production)

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by mozzerpete View Post
                  Apparently, we haven't seen Jano much on the field either, so..........This all started because I asked a simple question,
                  "Does anyone know if Janovich can catch and be a similar threat as Juszczyk?"



                  You might be missing the whole point of a message board. (I'm sure I did at some point.)



                  So you want a "True FB" to assume a "True HB" role but refuse to see how a TE can be a lead blocker out of the backfield?

                  Don't worry, "WE" won't be looking into either scenario because someone with great wisdom stated, "'WE' aren't coaching the team......." lol
                  SMH........ Again, it would be cool if they could figure out how to use him as Dallas did with Moose.... I firmly believe Jano could develop into that H-back roll. Now, we have that pass catching TE on the team and a true FB, so why change the dynamic?? As Arapaho stated, "but I don't think any TE we have can lower the shoulder, go off off guard and knock the Lb out of the play so we can get a short yardage 1st down or TD". That's Jano's roll. The new offense is going to be run heavy as Kubiaks was..... Jano will be a strong proponent to this style.
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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                    SMH........ Again, it would be cool if they could figure out how to use him as Dallas did with Moose.... I firmly believe Jano could develop into that H-back roll.
                    IMO, it would be "cool" to see if another player could assume Jano's limited O-role so that Denver could keep a roster bubble player at TE, DL, LB or DB.

                    Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                    Now, we have that pass catching TE on the team and a true FB, so why change the dynamic??
                    Because we have four TEs or LBer who could assume Jano's limited O-role.
                    (Just offseason thoughts, here)

                    Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                    As Arapaho stated, "but I don't think any TE we have can lower the shoulder, go off off guard and knock the Lb out of the play so we can get a short yardage 1st down or TD". That's Jano's roll.
                    No need to shake your head, instead come up with a better argument rather than
                    riding the coat tail of another poster who made a reasonable argument.

                    Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                    The new offense is going to be run heavy as Kubiaks was..... Jano will be a strong proponent to this style.
                    I haven't heard any official news about Denver running a run-heavy offense.
                    Perhaps this is my mistake, but I figured it would be similar to SF's offense given
                    Rich Scangarello was brought aboard as the Broncos newest OC.

                    2018 49ers offense:
                    Total Offensive Yds 5769
                    Total Rushing Yds 1902 (Matt Breida: 153 att for 814 yds.)
                    Total Passing Yds 3867

                    That does not look like a run heavy O to me.

                    Where did you read, "The new offense is going to be run heavy as Kubiaks was...."
                    Last edited by mozzerpete; 07-03-2019, 11:20 PM.

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                    • #85
                      https://www.espn.com/blog/denver-bro...eliable-scheme

                      Running the ball and play-action..... Going back to the Shannahan and Kubiak scheme..... And what is that? RUNNING THE BALL!!!!

                      So why would you take a 6'6", slower, line blocking guy that has never put his head down and opened lanes on the inside running lanes and replace a FB that is successful at doing such to just open a roster spot for a 4th TE??? Do you truly take a Fumagali or Butt that has had ZERO production or experience at that and replace a ST Captain and a successful lead blocker how can catch the ball as well? That makes absolutely zero sense.......

                      As for riding another posters coat tail? I do believe I responded to your initial comment on this subject and have gone back and forth with you. Arapaho as commented twice and I agree with his statement and use it as a quote. Guess that is riding a coat tail???......


                      FYI: 2018 49ers offensive yard totals shows absolutely NOTHING about how much they ran the ball and threw the ball..... They were 11th out of the 32 teams on rushing attempts and 20th on passing. That's heavy on rushing....... Just saying.
                      Last edited by Stackhouser; 07-05-2019, 07:20 AM.
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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                        https://www.espn.com/blog/denver-bro...eliable-scheme

                        Running the ball and play-action..... Going back to the Shannahan and Kubiak scheme..... And what is that? RUNNING THE BALL!!!!
                        I never stated Denver was not going to "run the ball." Also, to be fair, it also reads, "Scangarello believes there is a place for the run game in what the Broncos will do." Time will tell if it's "run heavy."

                        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                        So why would you take a 6'6", slower, line blocking guy that has never put his head down and opened lanes on the inside running lanes and replace a FB that is successful at doing such to just open a roster spot for a 4th TE??? Do you truly take a Fumagali or Butt that has had ZERO production or experience at that and replace a ST Captain and a successful lead blocker how can catch the ball as well? That makes absolutely zero sense.......
                        For the same reason, you would like to see a "true FB" used similarly to a "true HB," in that it may improve the team. You keep stating "Janovich can catch," but his collegiate career did not prove that nor is he currently known as a pass catching FB. Leading back to my original question, "Can he really catch?" I hope so.

                        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                        As for riding another posters coat tail? I do believe I responded to your initial comment on this subject and have gone back and forth with you. Arapaho as commented twice and I agree with his statement and use it as a quote. Guess that is riding a coat tail???......
                        Stating someone's height is clearly not a reason I'm accepting. Can you come up with something better?

                        Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                        FYI: 2018 49ers offensive yard totals shows absolutely NOTHING about how much they ran the ball and threw the ball..... They were 11th out of the 32 teams on rushing attempts and 20th on passing. That's heavy on rushing....... Just saying.
                        There is a nuisance in "run heavy" that I believe is the problem.

                        The 49ers had 423 rushing attempts to 532 passing attempts.
                        Given the 49ers had over 100 more passing attempts than rushing attempts, I personally wouldn't call that run heavy.
                        Perhaps, balanced?

                        Run heavy to me is when a team runs the ball more than it passes.

                        As an olive branch, it seems the 49ers emphasized running the ball and I hope Denver returns to that because I would like to see Freeman showcase his talent.

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                        • #87
                          Originally posted by mozzerpete View Post
                          I never stated Denver was not going to "run the ball." Also, to be fair, it also reads, "Scangarello believes there is a place for the run game in what the Broncos will do." Time will tell if it's "run heavy."



                          For the same reason, you would like to see a "true FB" used similarly to a "true HB," in that it may improve the team. You keep stating "Janovich can catch," but his collegiate career did not prove that nor is he currently known as a pass catching FB. Leading back to my original question, "Can he really catch?" I hope so.



                          Stating someone's height is clearly not a reason I'm accepting. Can you come up with something better?



                          There is a nuisance in "run heavy" that I believe is the problem.

                          The 49ers had 423 rushing attempts to 532 passing attempts.
                          Given the 49ers had over 100 more passing attempts than rushing attempts, I personally wouldn't call that run heavy.
                          Perhaps, balanced?

                          Run heavy to me is when a team runs the ball more than it passes.

                          As an olive branch, it seems the 49ers emphasized running the ball and I hope Denver returns to that because I would like to see Freeman showcase his talent.


                          Sometimes you need to read between the lines. When the statements come from the coaching staff that they want to go back to the Kubiak and Shanahan offenses, what does that tell you??? Unless you never watched the Broncos from those offensive schemes, you know exactly what it means.

                          I never said I want to see them make Jano an H-back.... Only thing I said is that it would be cool if it happened. He is a FB and will play as such. Please stop trying to use College stats as a marker for a players skill set. Jano hasn't played the college game since 2015 and he is a different player by now. Give him a little credit. The offense in Nebraska was not built on a FB catching a lot of passes. Again, with the last coach in Denver, Jano didn't see the field as much as he will in a run heavy play-action scheme. When they did throw his way, he was great as pass catching plays. 17-23 is a great number, only a small sample size.

                          SF was a run heavy offense last season. Since 2015, there have only been 2 teams that have ran the ball more than they passed. Prior to 2015, there were at least 2 or more teams that did it. You can put all the attempt numbers up you want, but SF was 20th in pass attempts last season and 11th in running attempts. This is a passing league nowadays, and being in the top half of the league in rushing attempts and the bottom half of the league in passing attempts means they were one of the running heavy attempt teams, (even if the numbers still skew to the passing numbers). This league has changed a lot to a passing league.
                          Last edited by Stackhouser; 07-05-2019, 03:00 PM.
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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                            Sometimes you need to read between the lines. When the statements come from the coaching staff that they want to go back to the Kubiak and Shanahan offenses, what does that tell you??? Unless you never watched the Broncos from those offensive schemes, you know exactly what it means.

                            I never said I want to see them make Jano an H-back.... Only thing I said is that it would be cool if it happened. He is a FB and will play as such. Please stop trying to use College stats as a marker for a players skill set. Jano hasn't played the college game since 2015 and he is a different player by now. Give him a little credit. The offense in Nebraska was not built on a FB catching a lot of passes. Again, with the last coach in Denver, Jano didn't see the field as much as he will in a run heavy play-action scheme. When they did throw his way, he was great as pass catching plays. 17-23 is a great number, only a small sample size.

                            SF was a run heavy offense last season. Since 2015, there have only been 2 teams that have ran the ball more than they passed. Prior to 2015, there were at least 2 or more teams that did it. You can put all the attempt numbers up you want, but SF was 20th in pass attempts last season and 11th in running attempts. This is a passing league nowadays, and being in the top half of the league in rushing attempts and the bottom half of the league in passing attempts means they were one of the running heavy attempt teams, (even if the numbers still skew to the passing numbers). This league has changed a lot to a passing league.
                            I’m expecting a heavy dose of both Lindsay and Freeman who will be led by Jano.

                            What’s the perfect compliment a GM can give his great defense? A running, clock controlling offense! We haven’t yet seen that type of compliment in Denver but I believe we will this season and Jano will be a huge part of that!

                            Heck Elway even got Jano a back up even though the majority of the board thinks he’s just a camp body or an experiment in an attempt to replace Jano after the season. But No matter what, the 2019 is going to be good for the Denver Broncos!
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                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Stackhouser View Post
                              Sometimes you need to read between the lines. When the statements come from the coaching staff that they want to go back to the Kubiak and Shanahan offenses, what does that tell you??? Unless you never watched the Broncos from those offensive schemes, you know exactly what it means.

                              I never said I want to see them make Jano an H-back.... Only thing I said is that it would be cool if it happened. He is a FB and will play as such. Please stop trying to use College stats as a marker for a players skill set. Jano hasn't played the college game since 2015 and he is a different player by now. Give him a little credit. The offense in Nebraska was not built on a FB catching a lot of passes. Again, with the last coach in Denver, Jano didn't see the field as much as he will in a run heavy play-action scheme. When they did throw his way, he was great as pass catching plays. 17-23 is a great number, only a small sample size.

                              SF was a run heavy offense last season. Since 2015, there have only been 2 teams that have ran the ball more than they passed. Prior to 2015, there were at least 2 or more teams that did it. You can put all the attempt numbers up you want, but SF was 20th in pass attempts last season and 11th in running attempts. This is a passing league nowadays, and being in the top half of the league in rushing attempts and the bottom half of the league in passing attempts means they were one of the running heavy attempt teams, (even if the numbers still skew to the passing numbers). This league has changed a lot to a passing league.
                              At this point, I feel my original question and subsequent comments speak for themselves.
                              Enjoy the offseason.

                              Go Broncos.

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