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Who is your ROTY so far ?

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  • God dammit.....fine you win LOL.

    Oh, and one more random ass statistic about RG3....He is the only qb in nfl history to throw for 3,000 yards, rush for 750 yards, and have a completion percentage higher than 60.

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    • Originally posted by baphamet View Post
      to say luck doesn't belong in the conversation is ridiculous. the colts went from worst to a legit playoff team over night vastly because of Andrew luck.

      if you want to say its RG3, wilson, or some other guy in your opinion, that's fine. but to say that luck doesn't belong in the conversation tells me you are not being very realistic and are probably biased against him for some reason.
      It's not being unrealistic or bias. But perhaps maybe I should do a better job stating what my thought process is.

      I shouldn't say doesn't belong as in like nowhere near the top of all rookies. This is probably a little bit of a clowded throught process but I guess I'm thinking of it like the Heisman finalists. There tends to only be 3 players invited to N.Y.

      So in that case I've stated I thought it should be Wilson, RG3 and Morris. Which would leave Luck out of the picture. however it's probably stupid to think like that since the NFL ROTY doesn't work like that. So he does belong in the conversation. I just don't think it should be higher than 4th on the list.

      Yes 2-14 to 11-5 is impressive. Bigger turnaround. But let's not act like 5-11 to 10-6 and division champs isn't a good size turnaround either. RG3 still was a big cause for a significant turnaround for one of the worst teams in the league. Let's also not act like most people didn't think the Colts were better than a 2-14 team last year if not for one Curtis Painter. After all the Colts were a playoff team the year before. The Redskins were not.

      So I think even though the turnaround wasn't as big that it cancels out the argument and you go with stats. In which RG3 had way more impressive stats. Make excuses all you want for why they looked nice and shiny. Doesn't make a difference. Fact is he had them.
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      • Denver Blood, I agree with you 100%.

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        • Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
          RG3 still was a big cause for a significant turnaround for one of the worst teams in the league.
          Ehhhh, the Skins weren't THAT bad. I know you are what your record says you are, but they lost like 5 games on the last possession including one in OT.

          The Colts progress this season is much more impressive to me.
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          Hooray, beer!

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          • Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
            It's not being unrealistic or bias. But perhaps maybe I should do a better job stating what my thought process is.

            I shouldn't say doesn't belong as in like nowhere near the top of all rookies. This is probably a little bit of a clowded throught process but I guess I'm thinking of it like the Heisman finalists. There tends to only be 3 players invited to N.Y.

            So in that case I've stated I thought it should be Wilson, RG3 and Morris. Which would leave Luck out of the picture. however it's probably stupid to think like that since the NFL ROTY doesn't work like that. So he does belong in the conversation. I just don't think it should be higher than 4th on the list.

            Yes 2-14 to 11-5 is impressive. Bigger turnaround. But let's not act like 5-11 to 10-6 and division champs isn't a good size turnaround either. RG3 still was a big cause for a significant turnaround for one of the worst teams in the league. Let's also not act like most people didn't think the Colts were better than a 2-14 team last year if not for one Curtis Painter. After all the Colts were a playoff team the year before. The Redskins were not.

            So I think even though the turnaround wasn't as big that it cancels out the argument and you go with stats. In which RG3 had way more impressive stats. Make excuses all you want for why they looked nice and shiny. Doesn't make a difference. Fact is he had them.
            They were a playoff team with arguably the greatest QB of all time. I don't care who you are, you're not a 2-14 team without being a terrible football team. You can make all the excuses you want, Luck took the previous worst team in the league to an 11-5 playoff team without his head coach, and without a 1000 yd rusher.
            What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?
            I don't know and I don't care

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            • Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
              Ehhhh, the Skins weren't THAT bad. I know you are what your record says you are, but they lost like 5 games on the last possession including one in OT.

              The Colts progress this season is much more impressive to me.
              Same could be said for the Colts last year though. They nearly beat the 12-4 Steelers and were close in a lot of their games. I realize they were blown out some like the 62-7 Saints debacle. But that was mostly after the season was lost.

              The Colts had 7 losses by 1 posession. (8 points or less). Including a late season loss by 7 @ New England.

              So like you said if the Colts were what their record says they are then so was Washington. Close games or not. Indy had a much worse qb situation last year. So yes Luck was a big improvement over Painter. But the rest of the team wasn't that bad. So it shouldn't be as shocking as it's made out to be.
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              • Originally posted by the0rangecrush View Post
                They were a playoff team with arguably the greatest QB of all time. I don't care who you are, you're not a 2-14 team without being a terrible football team. You can make all the excuses you want, Luck took the previous worst team in the league to an 11-5 playoff team without his head coach, and without a 1000 yd rusher.
                And RG3 took a 5-11 team to a 10-6 record and division championship.

                That's a near sighted argument. Do people honestly think Morris would've rushed for 1600 yards if not for RG3? Get real people. McGahee had much better rushing yards last year because of Tebow. In the option threat where Tebow was a threat to keep the ball. McGahee's numbers went way up as a result of Tebow compared to Orton.

                Conversely his numbers have dropped back down this year with a more traditional pocket passer. McGahee was still a threat because manning is such a great passing threat. But McGahee was much more productive the last two seasons when he was lined up with the option threat in Tebow.

                Why are we pretending that RG3 had nothing to do with Morris' success? Not saying he isn't a great back. He earned a lot on his own. But do we really think it would be 1,600 yards without RG3? Come on now.
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                • Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
                  And RG3 took a 5-11 team to a 10-6 record and division championship.

                  That's a near sighted argument. Do people honestly think Morris would've rushed for 1600 yards if not for RG3? Get real people. McGahee had much better rushing yards last year because of Tebow. In the option threat where Tebow was a threat to keep the ball. McGahee's numbers went way up as a result of Tebow compared to Orton.

                  Conversely his numbers have dropped back down this year with a more traditional pocket passer. McGahee was still a threat because manning is such a great passing threat. But McGahee was much more productive the last two seasons when he was lined up with the option threat in Tebow.

                  Why are we pretending that RG3 had nothing to do with Morris' success? Not saying he isn't a great back. He earned a lot on his own. But do we really think it would be 1,600 yards without RG3? Come on now.
                  Actually he took a 5-11 team to 8.5 wins a +3.5 and luck took a 2-14 to 11-5 a +9. Also please RG3 and Morris's success go hand in hand. RG3 wouldn't be nearly as successful without Morris. Could he get 1600 without RG3? Probably, in Shanny's system I wouldn't be surprised, not to mention he had similar production with Cousins at QB.
                  What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?
                  I don't know and I don't care

                  Comment


                  • While we are at it I guess we should go ahead and award Luck the MVP right? Because the only thing that matters is worst team in the league to 11-5 right?

                    We'll just ignore Manning, Brady, Rodgers, and AP who all had far better production in leading their teams to the playoffs right?

                    Because the only stat that matters is worst to 11-5. Either agree with that statement ( which I'm being sarcastic about) or you guys are contradicting yourselves.

                    If he deserves ROTY for that reason then he certainly deserves league MVP for that reason.

                    Manning only led his team to +5 win differential and Brady and Rodgers actually had a negative differential. Guess they don't deserve MVP.
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                    • Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
                      While we are at it I guess we should go ahead and award Luck the MVP right? Because the only thing that matters is worst team in the league to 11-5 right?

                      We'll just ignore Manning, Brady, Rodgers, and AP who all had far better production in leading their teams to the playoffs right?

                      Because the only stat that matters is worst to 11-5. Either agree with that statement ( which I'm being sarcastic about) or you guys are contradicting yourselves.

                      If he deserves ROTY for that reason then he certainly deserves league MVP for that reason.

                      Manning only led his team to +5 win differential and Brady and Rodgers actually had a negative differential. Guess they don't deserve MVP.
                      Now you are reaching.

                      Change in wins shows the impact of each player, but there is more to it than that. You can't knock a guy for being successful the year before, but you can applaud a guy for carrying a bad team to success. Wins and losses the year before also show talent on the team, not to mention RG3's number 1 option was on the Colts the year before. You take RG3s go to guy and put him on the colts and they are still a 2 win team. That was a terrible team, and lost a number 1 calibur guy.
                      What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?
                      I don't know and I don't care

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by the0rangecrush View Post
                        Now you are reaching.

                        Change in wins shows the impact of each player, but there is more to it than that. You can't knock a guy for being successful the year before, but you can applaud a guy for carrying a bad team to success. Wins and losses the year before also show talent on the team, not to mention RG3's number 1 option was on the Colts the year before. You take RG3s go to guy and put him on the colts and they are still a 2 win team. That was a terrible team, and lost a number 1 calibur guy.
                        But didn't the colt's roster include 30+ new players so I'm guess it is nothing like last years team...




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                        • Originally posted by #87Birdman View Post
                          But didn't the colt's roster include 30+ new players so I'm guess it is nothing like last years team...
                          The colts went young, and that's even more impressive. Luck led an inexperienced team to the playoffs. The redskins had a lot of vet talent as well.
                          What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?
                          I don't know and I don't care

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                          • Question: how is rookie of the year determined? Is it a group of experts or something, or is entirely fan voting? I've been wondering this for a while now.

                            Because if its up to the fans, since the NFL is such a "what have you done for me lately" league, I could definitely see Wilson winning it. Due to the red hot December he had.

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                            • Originally posted by skins_fan82 View Post
                              Question: how is rookie of the year determined? Is it a group of experts or something, or is entirely fan voting? I've been wondering this for a while now.

                              Because if its up to the fans, since the NFL is such a "what have you done for me lately" league, I could definitely see Wilson winning it. Due to the red hot December he had.
                              It's media vote. So it won't go to Wislon due to east coast media bias as Yakka has pointed out before.
                              sigpic

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                              • Originally posted by the0rangecrush View Post
                                The colts went young, and that's even more impressive. Luck led an inexperienced team to the playoffs. The redskins had a lot of vet talent as well.
                                Included in those now gone were the high calibur QBs Curtis Painter and Dan Orlovsky who led that team.
                                Luck had a great year-especially for a rookie- but cmon, even Orton would have turned that team around for at least a few more wins.

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