Hate to say it, Chargers have had a very good draft, AFC West got tighter

[JakeNbake]

I'll be real.. the chargers on paper had a great draft. They aren't going to catch us while we have Manning, and really not many teams could. We'd have been first in any AFC division last year. But for the feature they are doing a good job.

[arapaho]

yes you have argued it many times and i have owned you will facts every time as well. would you like me to post the stats again? you use 2006 as an example when you know full well that was rivers' first year as a starter. of course they are not going to open him up his first year.

how about 2007, 2008, and 2009? ya know, when rivers was either first or second in the NFL in air yards per attempt? they also threw to their backs less on average, its a fact jack!

don't you think its odd that we actually threw to our backs more after sproles left? yet so many of you think he was so important to what we did on offense? lol

there were seasons he had less than 30 catches yet he was just so damn important to what we did on offense!

its funny when donkey fans think they know everything, stick to your own team donk fans, you are clueless about mine.

bullbap!!... you have aurgued that the short passing game which specificaly utilizes the backs isnt a big part of rivers offense...i kept telling you it was a huge part of his offense

sure last season rivers might have needed short quick passes more than it seems typical for him...but not by much


rivers pass completion less than 10 yards %

2006......69.5%
2007......71%
2008......67%
2009......68.2%
2010......68.5%
2011......67%
2012.....76%


as you can see ...the short passing game HAS ALWAYS BEEN A BIG PART OF RIVERS OFFENSE!!!

[baphamet]

bullbap!!... you have aurgued that the short passing game which specificaly utilizes the backs isnt a big part of rivers offense...i kept telling you it was a huge part of his offense

sure last season rivers might have needed short quick passes more than it seems typical for him...but not by much


rivers pass completion less than 10 yards %

2006......69.5%
2007......71%
2008......67%
2009......68.2%
2010......68.5%
2011......67%
2012.....76%


as you can see ...the short passing game HAS ALWAYS BEEN A BIG PART OF RIVERS OFFENSE!!!

now compare those same numbers to the rest of the QB's in the league and come back and talk to me. those numbers also include WR's and TE's but you didn't mention that did you?

what part of the air yards per attempt stat do you not understand? that is the stat that reflects how far the ball actually travels per pass and up until the last two years rivers was always in the top 10 in the league (even in 2006) and three of the years in the top 1 or 2

yet as soon as the OL went into the tank and sproles left he dropped far out of the top 10, meaning he is throwing a lot less deep balls and a lot ore shorter ones on average.

these are facts that you cannot argue arapahole.

and to those of you trying to argue that simply having sproles in the game is what made our deep ball work so well, in case you weren't aware and you missed it the first time i pointed this out, sproles wasn't always in the game when we threw the ball deep, not even close.

there were games he wasn't even active and we threw the ball deep. we had time to throw it deep then because we had better pass protection. this is really a basic football concept to grasp if you are not football retarded lol

[arapaho]

now compare those same numbers to the rest of the QB's in the league and come back and talk to me. those numbers also include WR's and TE's but you didn't mention that did you?

what part of the air yards per attempt stat do you not understand? that is the stat that reflects how far the ball actually travels per pass and up until the last two years rivers was always in the top 10 in the league (even in 2006) and three of the years in the top 1 or 2

yet as soon as the OL went into the tank and sproles left he dropped far out of the top 10, meaning he is throwing a lot less deep balls and a lot ore shorter ones on average.

these are facts that you cannot argue arapahole.

and to those of you trying to argue that simply having sproles in the game is what made our deep ball work so well, in case you weren't aware and you missed it the first time i pointed this out, sproles wasn't always in the game when we threw the ball deep, not even close.

there were games he wasn't even active and we threw the ball deep. we had time to throw it deep then because we had better pass protection. this is really a basic football concept to grasp if you are not football retarded lol

those are passes less then ten yards....never stated they were only rbs did i?....your whole contention is rivers was a long ball guy..didnt use the quict hits until his line crumbled...right...wrong he has always used it

08 ...106 completions was to rbs

09...91

2010...128

2011...116
2012....111

yeah tell me again how he really didnt utilize the backs in his offense again...lol

[kishzilla]

those numbers also include WR's and TE's but you didn't mention that did you?

A pass is not a pass if it's not a forward pass. Screens often don't get counted as passes. But Baph wouldn't know that, because he doesn't know what he's talking about. If he knew what he was talking about, he would know that teams that are good deep, are also very often good at the screen, and will do both prolifically. A screen play is nothing more than tricking the Defense into believing you're going deep.

Now think for a minute. If you throw a bunch of screens that don't count as forward passes, and you throw the ball deep a few times, what's that going to do to your air yardage?

Some people's children.

[jhildebrand]

The Chargers just keep getting better. Now they have Freeney on a 2 year deal. All that remains to be seen is how well the team adjusts to McCoy and McCoy's abilities as a 1st year coach. I wouldn't write off the Chargers or the Chiefs this year. You can write off the Raiders (even though I love Dennis Allen) but you can always write off the Raiders.

[kishzilla]

The Chargers just keep getting better. Now they have Freeney on a 2 year deal. All that remains to be seen is how well the team adjusts to McCoy and McCoy's abilities as a 1st year coach. I wouldn't write off the Chargers or the Chiefs this year. You can write off the Raiders (even though I love Dennis Allen) but you can always write off the Raiders.

Freeney's stats have been declining almost as rapidly as Rivers passer rating and the Chargers number of wins. lol

The Chargers Defense aint that bad, but I'm more than dubious that their offense will have their act together by this season. Not worried.

[bronx_2003]

Chargers and Chiefs won't get 8 wins.

Denver were 13-3 and are loaded. No one in this division will get anywhere near them barring a PM injury. It will all be about the playoffs and making sure that this time we play our best football in January, not our worst.

KC don't have the QB or weapons on offense to consistently win and to beat the better teams. With their O you need a top 5 D, and their D is OK but looks about 10-12 best in the league.

SD are more worrying because they have a dangerous QB, but their LT is terrible and the line looks just as bad as last year. They also struggle running with Mathews, Gates was banged up and looked old last year, and Alexander looked their only weapon....... Keenan Allen will help but a 2nd round rookie probably won't explode next season.

The D is decent but probably behind KC and an average NFL one.

I can't see any way Denver are challenged in the West.

[arapaho]

freeney sucked in the 3-4 last yr

[denversdivision]

The Chargers just keep getting better. Now they have Freeney on a 2 year deal. All that remains to be seen is how well the team adjusts to McCoy and McCoy's abilities as a 1st year coach. I wouldn't write off the Chargers or the Chiefs this year. You can write off the Raiders (even though I love Dennis Allen) but you can always write off the Raiders.

The chargers need a WHOLE LOT MORE than just dwight to even be relevant. They lost melvin and sp. And basicly have mancry and dwight now ... not exactly scary. Dwight isnt the player he once was and isnt very good at playing olb. He can be a decent de but not in the 3-4 hes walking into. Hes a ten sack guy at de , much less impact outside.

Hes a very smart player but isnt fast like he once was , his moves are becoming less effective also. Good sign for the chargers as they should be picking up anyone who will sign damn near ... but hes a big name with little impact ...sp will do far more for us than dwight will for them

[denversdivision]

Chargers and Chiefs won't get 8 wins.

Denver were 13-3 and are loaded. No one in this division will get anywhere near them barring a PM injury. It will all be about the playoffs and making sure that this time we play our best football in January, not our worst.

KC don't have the QB or weapons on offense to consistently win and to beat the better teams. With their O you need a top 5 D, and their D is OK but looks about 10-12 best in the league.

SD are more worrying because they have a dangerous QB, but their LT is terrible and the line looks just as bad as last year. They also struggle running with Mathews, Gates was banged up and looked old last year, and Alexander looked their only weapon....... Keenan Allen will help but a 2nd round rookie probably won't explode next season.

The D is decent but probably behind KC and an average NFL one.

I can't see any way Denver are challenged in the West.

Kc is the only team thats got the talent to give us a run...unlikely however but they did get better this offseason, coach and players. They might make some noise ...but wee are without question the fav for afc west...manning going down would make it interesting but brocks looking good , coaches like his progression and improvements in general over last year with the three guys we have catching bubby brister could come back and limp us into the playoffs :-)

[bronx_2003]

Kc is the only team thats got the talent to give us a run...unlikely however but they did get better this offseason, coach and players. They might make some noise ...but wee are without question the fav for afc west...manning going down would make it interesting but brocks looking good , coaches like his progression and improvements in general over last year with the three guys we have catching bubby brister could come back and limp us into the playoffs :-)

I keep hearing how KC got better, but I don't really see it.

I do like Reid, but players win games.

Last off-season I heard how KC were really good and I told everyone they were a 5-6 win team IMO, they lacked targets which severely hindered the passing game, had an average QB, and the D had a couple of holes... although the LB corps is good.

All I see is they changed from Cassell to Smith, a marginal upgrade at best, cut their NB Arenas who I thought was decent, and drafted Fisher who is good but still leaves the interior line pretty average.

I just don't see how Smith and this O will out-gun Manning either game, or go into Dallas/NY or Washington and be good enough to beat them.......... as well as Indy and Houston.

When you play that many teams who have a much better QB then you do, you really need to be elite in other places.

[ERoyal248]

The Chargers just keep getting better. Now they have Freeney on a 2 year deal. All that remains to be seen is how well the team adjusts to McCoy and McCoy's abilities as a 1st year coach. I wouldn't write off the Chargers or the Chiefs this year. You can write off the Raiders (even though I love Dennis Allen) but you can always write off the Raiders.

Meh, Freeney is good, hell of a career but he's a better fit for a 4-3 scheme which we run.

Still gonna come down to their OL protecting Rivers, if they give him enough time, they'll contend somewhat, if not, it's gonna be tough.

[ERoyal248]

To their draft.

- Fluker is solid, probably a little bit of a reach, but good pick.

- Te'o, bigger fan than him over most, but why not stay where they were and take Arthur Brown. Then move up in the 3rd to get Armstread, ridiculousally athletic LT. Some word he may start for the Saints.

- Keenan Allen is a great steal, but more of a future pick. Unless they release, say, Meachem/Royal, etc, not sure he'll play that much.

- Don't know much about the rest of the draft though.

- Still lost their best OL who didn't sign a huge contract, some say Vaz is better than Levitre or close, and got 2 mil less per year. Don't have a LT, depending if they sign a FA (only Starks is left)

- Lost Ingram to injury for who knows how long, lost solid depth at OLB with Phillips/Barnes, both who didn't sign for all that much.

[denversdivision]

I keep hearing how KC got better, but I don't really see it.

I do like Reid, but players win games.

Last off-season I heard how KC were really good and I told everyone they were a 5-6 win team IMO, they lacked targets which severely hindered the passing game, had an average QB, and the D had a couple of holes... although the LB corps is good.

All I see is they changed from Cassell to Smith, a marginal upgrade at best, cut their NB Arenas who I thought was decent, and drafted Fisher who is good but still leaves the interior line pretty average.

I just don't see how Smith and this O will out-gun Manning either game, or go into Dallas/NY or Washington and be good enough to beat them.......... as well as Indy and Houston.

When you play that many teams who have a much better QB then you do, you really need to be elite in other places.

I agree mostly but they are going to be tough if healthy , smith is better than he was 2 years back not elite but he will get bowe the ball and charles is a monster. They need depth at wr, and half a/dozen other positions but and Reid is a top ten coach and has a way with players. 8-8 is a good bet in my book with 10-6 being top end 7-9 low end . They dont have to beat us to sneak into the playoffs (though it would help)