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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kansas Bob View Post
    BTW, does anyone understand why Elway wants to draft QB's 6'7" and over in the first few rounds? I am not sure there is any QB's in the draft tall enough for John to draft???
    The answer to this is actually quite simple, and it has nothing to do with height.

    Elway is drafting quarterbacks that he sees traits of himself in. Ex: cannon arm, mobile, ability to throw on the run, etc

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAsianPA View Post
    The free agent QB market in my opinion is not as enticing as the QBs in the draft pick. Brees is going to be 40 soon. He may even retire if the Saints win the big one. Cousins is decent, but I don't see him worth Stafford's contract which will take away our chances at other free agents. Other QBs like Bradford, Bridgewater, etc all come with red flags that it may be better to just save space in the cap and draft instead.
    Iíd take Bridgewater. Wonít cost a ton. Low risk, high reward.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bronco51 View Post
    No, he can not. Especially after the debacle of the freaking Colorado Rockies drafting Russell Wilson when they had the chance and the Broncos chose..... Osweiler.
    Am really sick of hearing about our "missing" on Russell Wilson. Wilson would have had to back up Peyton Manning, and a system that works for Wilson is totally different than the one that works for Manning. Unless you think it would have been a good idea to take a scrambling quarterback who needs to get outside the pocket to see over his linemen and try to mold him into a pocket passer so he can running Manning's offense. Which is the same reason we couldn't have Tebow back up Manning -- neither one of them would fit the system. At all.

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by CasualFan View Post
    Am really sick of hearing about our "missing" on Russell Wilson. Wilson would have had to back up Peyton Manning, and a system that works for Wilson is totally different than the one that works for Manning. Unless you think it would have been a good idea to take a scrambling quarterback who needs to get outside the pocket to see over his linemen and try to mold him into a pocket passer so he can running Manning's offense. Which is the same reason we couldn't have Tebow back up Manning -- neither one of them would fit the system. At all.
    Manning wasn't going to be here forever. They took Osweiler and missed....horribly. Then they brought him back and missed again...horribly. And are you under the impression the Brock was brought in because he is the definition of pocket QB coming out of college?
    Last edited by Bronco51; 11-24-2017 at 04:39 PM.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingelway7 View Post
    The answer to this is actually quite simple, and it has nothing to do with height.

    Elway is drafting quarterbacks that he sees traits of himself in. Ex: cannon arm, mobile, ability to throw on the run, etc
    Yes, Elway seems overly enamored with pure athletic ability, giving the other aspects of being an excellent quarterback short shrift.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    I think he would be worth it. I rather get into the business of winning with a sure thing rather than taking another gamble in the draft or spending money on a lesser talent and wishing we had gone all in on him later. 3 solid years of high level production from cousins so we know there is no fluke.
    Cousins has a similar team around him compared to ours. This year our defense is much worse than theirs though, and they are still only 5-6. Getting Cousins here only ensures we go 8-8 or 9-7 consistently instead of 4-12 with Lynch or Siemian. We wouldn't be contenders and we're stuck paying him 25+ million a year.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingelway7 View Post
    Iíd take Bridgewater. Wonít cost a ton. Low risk, high reward.
    He probably won't produce a whole lot either. He wasn't exactly Deshaun Watson levels of hype before he went down. Closer to Jameis Winston if anything.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAsianPA View Post
    Cousins has a similar team around him compared to ours. This year our defense is much worse than theirs though, and they are still only 5-6. Getting Cousins here only ensures we go 8-8 or 9-7 consistently instead of 4-12 with Lynch or Siemian. We wouldn't be contenders and we're stuck paying him 25+ million a year.
    Washingtonís defense is ranked 21st in yards ours is 3rd they also give up the same amount of ppg and that is without thier offense and special teams gifting points to the other team. That defense isnít close to what we have. They have 5 wins only becuase he is the QB or else they would be competing for the #1 pick in the draft. 9-7? If we had him this year at worst we would be 8-2 and thatís with the special teams issues.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    Washingtonís defense is ranked 21st in yards ours is 3rd they also give up the same amount of ppg and that is without thier offense and special teams gifting points to the other team. That defense isnít close to what we have. They have 5 wins only becuase he is the QB or else they would be competing for the #1 pick in the draft. 9-7? If we had him this year at worst we would be 8-2 and thatís with the special teams issues.
    Our defense is bad in other ways. Near last in categories that made us contenders last year such as QB pressure, interceptions, and forced fumbles. As much as I like Cousins, what he is doing for Washington isn't impossible to find in the draft. He is just simply not worth over 25 million when he isnt doing what Rogers or Brady is for their teams. I'm not sure how you can claim we'd only lose two games with Cousins either.
    Last edited by TheAsianPA; 11-25-2017 at 07:38 AM.

  10. #85
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    No love for Alex Smith?

    The guys got heart, tough as nails, accurate and scrambles. What will he bring on the open market next year?
    [

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAsianPA View Post
    Cousins has a similar team around him compared to ours. This year our defense is much worse than theirs though, and they are still only 5-6. Getting Cousins here only ensures we go 8-8 or 9-7 consistently instead of 4-12 with Lynch or Siemian. We wouldn't be contenders and we're stuck paying him 25+ million a year.
    Our D is not much worse than Washington's. According to NFL.com we're still #3 in total defense while theirs is 21st. Each team has given up about the same number of points. You can attribute that to our pathetic, turnover prone offense. Cousins is having a fine year and at least gives his team a chance. His stats compare favorably to the best in the game.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taos_Broncomaniac View Post
    No love for Alex Smith?

    The guys got heart, tough as nails, accurate and scrambles. What will he bring on the open market next year?
    Alex Smith is that type of QB that at one moment your like, ď this guy is great. I would really love him on my teamĒ. To moments where you think, ď Smith canít carry his team and wonít ever take his team deep in the playoffsĒ.

    With the teams Smith has had in Kc and with his age, if he hasnít been able to do it then with them, he prob wonít be able to do it now.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAsianPA View Post
    Our defense is bad in other ways. Near last in categories that made us contenders last year such as QB pressure, interceptions, and forced fumbles. As much as I like Cousins, what he is doing for Washington isn't impossible to find in the draft. He is just simply not worth over 25 million when he isnt doing what Rogers or Brady is for their teams. I'm not sure how you can claim we'd only lose two games with Cousins either.
    Itís pretty easy to claim. 5/7 of our losses the defense kept us in the game. Buffalo NY KC LA cincy. The flow of those games would have been significantly different with a QB that can move the ball put up points and take care of it. We donít lose those games with cousins. Between Brock and Trevor we have 12TDs and 13ints cousins has 19TDs and 6ints. You can possibly find an elite QB in the draft but he might take several years to get where he needs to be and people have written lynch off in 2.5 games lol. If the goal is to contend he is the guy. But if the goal is to rebuild sure then letís draft and miss the playoffs for several more seasons.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murph2432 View Post
    Alex Smith is that type of QB that at one moment your like, “ this guy is great. I would really love him on my team”. To moments where you think, “ Smith can’t carry his team and won’t ever take his team deep in the playoffs”.

    With the teams Smith has had in Kc and with his age, if he hasn’t been able to do it then with them, he prob won’t be able to do it now.
    The guy is 33 and hasn't actually had great teams in KC, Kelce and a couple of receivers no one remembers. Hunt is good but now that DC's are figuring them out Reid (forever a bridesmaid) has no answers. He might be a solid transitional QB who won't lose any games for us until the next franchise QB comes along.

    Plus he would destroy KC twice a year for spite (hopefully), just saying we might kick the tires on what might be the best affordable option while we sort out this mess of an O-line.
    Last edited by Taos_Broncomaniac; 11-25-2017 at 10:08 AM.
    [

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bronco51 View Post
    Manning wasn't going to be here forever. They took Osweiler and missed....horribly. Then they brought him back and missed again...horribly. And are you under the impression the Brock was brought in because he is the definition of pocket QB coming out of college?
    Elway didn't miss at all. Osweiler was an excellent pick. Elway was picking a backup quarterback, nothing more, and Osweiler delivered on that job during the Super Bowl run, going 5-2 in relief of the injured Manning. At the bottom of the second round, a backup quarterback is all you're getting:

    Again, you can see that QBs who are consistent contributors are concentrated very early in the draft Ė so much that, by the time you get 30-40 picks into the draft, a QBís expected contribution drops below Brock Osweiler/Cody Kessler levels.

    Itís amazing to me that Osweiler has spent three years on the bench, played reasonably well for half a season, and played badly enough in his only year as a full-time starter that his team gave away draft picks to avoid paying him Ė and yet, for all that, he has had above-average production for a second-round draft pick. Thatís why you donít reach down for QBs in the draft.
    The Browns Need A Great QB, Which Is Why They Didnít Draft One

    Repeat: Osweiler has had ABOVE AVERAGE PRODUCTION FOR WHERE HE WAS DRAFTED. If you want to criticize Elway's drafting, look elsewhere.

    I did an analysis in another thread of the quarterbacks picked below #20 in the first round but at least in rounds 1-2 of the draft in the last ten years. There is only a 10% chance that a quarterback picked at that level goes on to become a starting-caliber quarterback, with the only two clear-cut starters being Derek Carr and Andy Dalton. In Carr's case he was likely under-drafted because of David Carr's unfortunate history. The rest of the time you get Brandon Weedens and Brady Quinns. Even when drafting at the top of the first round, the chances of getting a franchise quarterback are only 50%. Drafting a franchise quarter back is really hard.

    Elway can't say publicly that "I only picked Osweiler to be a backup, with a 10% lottery ticket chance of starting-caliber upside" because that would destroy his confidence and destroy the team's confidence in him. And so we have to endure these tedious threads about why Elway can't seem to draft quarterbacks when he played the position at a HoF level himself.

    The other reason the Russell Wilson critique is not that germane is that there are always going to be a few examples where someone drafted way below the second round pans out. This is because a) scouts spend a lot less time scouting some prospects that are high-risk simply because of limited time and resources, some of which may eventually succeed, and b) people fall in the draft for character reasons and then sometimes manage to turn their lives around. Dak Prescott is an example of the latter -- getting a DUI two whole days before his pro day. Yet Elway still gets criticized for not drafting him. In Russell Wilson's case, Elway didn't draft him, but so did every other GM in the league until Round 3.

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