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  1. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    I'm not advocating drafting a guard. I'm advocating filling a hole that exists, RB is not a pressing need, so why use high capital on filling it? The best teams are generally the most well rounded teams.

    [bAs for the "best RB prospect in 10 years" that's great, Trent Richardson had that label too. [/b]Doesn't actually mean much since none of those highly touted picks have led the team that drafted them to a Super Bowl victory.
    The Browns Effect. They killed his confidence. Add in the Bama top 10 bust factor as well. only Julio has worked put, because he wasn't beat down & overworked by Saban

  2. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by SMR81 View Post
    It's a little different when you have Manning at QB, he will make a playmaker out of the mascot if need be. I think DT is a good receiver, and also highly overrated. He is not a playmaker at this point without Manning.
    Sanders? Maybe, although he was non existent this year and may not even be here next. Not really sure who everyone is after those two.

    Virgil Green?
    Heuerman?
    Latimer?

    Have you ever noticed that good QBs tend to make just about every receiver they play with into a playmaker? Likewise have you ever noticed that a lot of playmakers become free agents, go to new teams and fizzle? That's because QBs generally are able to make playmakers from players on the roster.

    QBs are important. A playmaker can't do anything if the QB can't get him the ball. You overvalued Siemian, and now you're undervaluing the negative effect he and the other QBs have had on the lack of playmakers. Remember Latimer and Heuerman looking like playmakers against the Colts.

    DT is highly overrated? Everyone on here talks about how awful he is on a weekly basis.

  3. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    Are you saying there hasnít ever been a guard drafted in the first round that was on a Super Bowl winning team since 2000?
    yup. Alan Fanec (drafted in 1998, #26) was the last OG to be drafted in 1st round to win a super bowl. He was there for Big Ben's 1st super bowl then left to jets the next yr.

  4. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by munoz1987 View Post
    The Browns Effect. They killed his confidence. Add in the Bama top 10 bust factor as well. only Julio has worked put, because he wasn't beat down & overworked by Saban

    Okay what was the problem for McFadden? And Moreno? And CJ Spiller? RBs are too dependent on too many other factors to buy into their high stock by themselves. They need an o-line, and at least competent QB play in order to be most effective.

    I hope Barkley is successful, I just don't want Denver to draft them.

  5. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    Are you saying there hasn’t ever been a guard drafted in the first round that was on a Super Bowl winning team since 2000?
    Don't go down this rabbit hole, he doesn't think players who played Tackle in college can be drafted as guards, even if they're moved to guard immediately upon entrance into the NFL.

  6. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by munoz1987 View Post
    yup. Alan Fanec (drafted in 1998, #26) was the last OG to be drafted in 1st round to win a super bowl. He was there for Big Ben's 1st super bowl then left to jets the next yr.
    Kendell Simmons was a 1st round guard drafted by the Steelers got two championships with them.

    Iím not sure how old this article is but itís very interesting how undervalued guards are in the draft.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/blackan...a-history/amp/

    Edit: I think itís from the 2013 draft. So from 2000-2013 only 10 guards taken in the first round.

  7. #172
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    Here's my final 2 cents:

    Fournette is WAY better than CJ. CJ only needed 55 YPG to get 1000, and Fournette did it in less games, with less weapons around him

    Zeke is definitely worth the pick. He should never have been suspended in the first place, and the Cowboys played worse without him. However that was not Dak's fault, that was the D

    For DEN, RB is the last pick that you take at 5. They need QB, OL, LB, and possibly DB depending on FA. Barkley would be the definition of a luxury pick for them. I think it's moot since IND, NYG, and CLE might grab him 1st
    Rod Smith for the HOF. TEBOW RULES!

  8. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    Don't go down this rabbit hole, he doesn't think players who played Tackle in college can be drafted as guards, even if they're moved to guard immediately upon entrance into the NFL.
    Arenít most nfl guards college tackles? Maybe not most but some of the more notable ones. The guy on the raiders was a tackle on the ravens and is now a guard. I can see Orlando brown being the next big thing at guard once they switch him off tackle.

  9. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    Okay what was the problem for McFadden? And Moreno? And CJ Spiller? RBs are too dependent on too many other factors to buy into their high stock by themselves. They need an o-line, and at least competent QB play in order to be most effective.

    I hope Barkley is successful, I just don't want Denver to draft them.
    The Fact that Broncos will have at least 3 returning starters on the o-line for the 1st time since 2014 will make them a better unit.
    I'm all for Drafting Barkley IF we get Cousins. If not we have to draft a QB.

  10. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    Kendell Simmons was a 1st round guard drafted by the Steelers got two championships with them.

    Iím not sure how old this article is but itís very interesting how undervalued guards are in the draft.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/blackan...a-history/amp/

    Edit: I think itís from the 2013 draft. So from 2000-2013 only 10 guards taken in the first round.
    so there's 1 and he was was on IR for their 2nd super bowl

  11. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    Aren’t most nfl guards college tackles? Maybe not most but some of the more notable ones. The guy on the raiders was a tackle on the ravens and is now a guard. I can see Orlando brown being the next big thing at guard once they switch him off tackle.
    Given what ive heard about his strengths and weaknesses that very well could be the case
    Glen Haven Fire

  12. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawinkerpoppin View Post
    Arenít most nfl guards college tackles? Maybe not most but some of the more notable ones. The guy on the raiders was a tackle on the ravens and is now a guard. I can see Orlando brown being the next big thing at guard once they switch him off tackle.
    Yes college OTs make good NFL OGs, because they are the better athletes then the guy that was just a college OGs. Green Bay Packers are notorious for Drafting College OTs to be NFL OGs.

  13. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    Don't go down this rabbit hole, he doesn't think players who played Tackle in college can be drafted as guards, even if they're moved to guard immediately upon entrance into the NFL.
    Someone's still mad that they got owned in this arguement.
    But my argument was NFL doesn't value guys that just played OG in college, high in the draft. But they will take them high if the played OT and then play them at OG.
    examples Schreff and Martin both OTs in college and now great OGs
    Last edited by munoz1987; 01-09-2018 at 08:54 PM.

  14. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by munoz1987 View Post
    Someone's still mad that they got owned in this arguement.
    But my argument was NFL doesn't value guys that just played OG in college, high in the draft. But they will take them high if the played OT and then play them at OG.
    examples Schreff and Martin both OTs in college and now great OGs
    So, teams will take someone high if they are pretty sure that they can be an impact starting OG in the NFL then?

  15. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by munoz1987 View Post
    The Fact that Broncos will have at least 3 returning starters on the o-line for the 1st time since 2014 will make them a better unit.
    I'm all for Drafting Barkley IF we get Cousins. If not we have to draft a QB.
    Yeah, except the fact that the 2 open positions were the biggest holes on the line. As bad as RT was made out to be, and it was pretty bad, Garcia was worse, he was giving players a straight path to the QB.

    Drafting an RB that high would be a mistake for this team.

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