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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by baphamet View Post
    the chargers had their paxton lynch, his name was cardale jones. RIP to our season if rivers goes down. the way geno holds onto the ball, you would think that thing was made of gold.
    Since you argued Geno is better than Keenum and predicted Keenum will get injured, you must believe Denverís season is over already?
    Oh, wait you predicted Denver would go 9-7?

    Donít get offended just explain how that could be.....

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by baphamet View Post
    the chargers most definitely did not have the most talented roster in the league between 2006-2010
    Yet a guy that lives in a glass house tends to throw the most stones.

    Hey if you ever decide to throw rocks in the projects be careful you donít hit one of Philis Riverís kids!

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by baphamet View Post
    esser talent? you mean guys like desmond king who he drafted in he 5th round who would start on your team?

    so now you're telling me that because the chargers haven't had any recent playoff success, that means they have no talent?

    i suppose because the broncos won a ring a few years ago, that means this team is chalk full of talent?

    think about that for just a second and you will realize how dumb that logic is.

    the chargers have talent all over the field, telesco has done alright for himself but he isn't the best GM in the league like john elway who couldn't draft to save his life.
    Desmond King was definitely a good find in the 5th round but heís hardly at CHJ level YET. CHJ was a walk on player/rookie free agent and look how far heís come.

    You want to poke fun but CHJ is one of the most stand up players in the league. The guy took a home town discount, heís regarded as one of the best in the league, best all around slot corner plus he has a super bowl ring!

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiny Barph
    😭😭😭Trophy smack trophy smack😭😭😭
    You never hear his name in the news for anything negative plus Iím sure King idolizes him to an extent!

    Also I wonít say anything negative about King, heís been through quite a bit with the murder of his brother.
    The guy has a high amount of talent skies the limit for him however itís too bad he ended up your team of mediocrity though because he deserves better!
    Last edited by Sam_Z; 09-02-2018 at 06:40 PM.

  4. #19
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    All he has become, is another cheap knockoff in a long line of Elway haters. Since he has become such, and cannot ever change , he has now been permanently renamed Elway Hater. He cannot deny this anymore then any other in the LOOOONG line of Elway Haters. Just like none of them can deny that Elway was the person responsible for bringing us 3 RINGS!!! Oh, I know, Terrell Davis, and Peyton Manning were the ones, isn't that right Elway Hater? You are no different the hundreds of Elway Haters who come before you! I have seen this for 35 years now. You are nothing new. You are nothing special. You are not original. You are Elway Hater, nothing more.
    oh YEAH?

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axemaster View Post
    All he has become, is another cheap knockoff in a long line of Elway haters. Since he has become such, and cannot ever change , he has now been permanently renamed Elway Hater. He cannot deny this anymore then any other in the LOOOONG line of Elway Haters. Just like none of them can deny that Elway was the person responsible for bringing us 3 RINGS!!! Oh, I know, Terrell Davis, and Peyton Manning were the ones, isn't that right Elway Hater? You are no different the hundreds of Elway Haters who come before you! I have seen this for 35 years now. You are nothing new. You are nothing special. You are not original. You are Elway Hater, nothing more.
    Yep and that is why he has tried to spin the claim that Superbowls donít matter. No one in sports would agree with that argument. If the bolts every win one, will be hilarious to see him change his tune.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by 58Miller View Post
    Yep and that is why he has tried to spin the claim that Superbowls donít matter. No one in sports would agree with that argument. If the bolts every win one, will be hilarious to see him change his tune.
    Hahahahaha but until then we are going to continue to hear this on a daily basis

    lets be honest with ourselves, weíre going to be hearing this for the next millennium

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by baphamet View Post
    elway's 2017 draft class....

    1) Garett Bolles
    2) DeMarcus Walker
    3) Carlos Henderson = GONE
    3) Brendan Langley = GONE
    5) Jake Butt
    5) Isaiah McKenzie = GONE
    6) DeíAngelo Henderson = GONE
    7) Chad Kelly
    McKenzie is back on the active roster, Carlos Henderson is on our practice Squad as is Langly so basically De'Angelo Henderson is "gone". So this thread was started prematurely (which shouldn't come as a surprise) Only one of those 7 guess is truly done with the team. At least 3 of them have a chance of making a big impact to the team as rotational players or starters this year. So let's take the smack glasses off and examine this a little deeper


    1) Garett Bolles
    Starting LT. He struggled last year, but he appears to have grown a lot if the offseason is an indication. Having Leary next to him is really going to help him grow further this year.
    2) DeMarcus Walker
    Last year he played out of position due to our coaching staff's ineptitude. He is back in his natural position and looked good, he will see some time in an already deep d-line that has improved with Adam Gotsis stepping up and playing well.
    3) Carlos Henderson
    This was a good pick, it's still a good pick IF Henderson can get his head on straight. Talent wise, this kid is a very good player, he's just gotta get past his off the field crap and put the work in. Time will tell how this pick works out, I'm not giving up yet.
    3) Brendan Langley
    Langley had big shoes to fill, he's simply not there yet. Time on the practice squad will provide him an opportunity to grow and make a push to make the team in 2019, it's possible he could be moved up sooner depending on what happens in the year.
    5) Jake Butt
    Butt would be the starter this year if Jeff IRman hadn't finally gotten healthy and balled out this offseason. Look for Butt to be a productive part of the offense despite not being the starting TE.
    5) Isaiah McKenzie
    With the Su'a Cravens injury, McKenzie is back on the 53. He took a huge step forward this offseason and actually looked really solid as a returner. If he's going to stick long term though, he's going to have to play really well on special teams, or he's going to have to get his fumble issues taken care of as a receiver as well. If he holds onto the ball, this kid is EXPLOSIVE.
    6) DeíAngelo Henderson = GONE
    The one player from 2017 that is truly gone from the team. 1 out of 7 isn't a bad rate so far. We'll see in future years if anyone else gets left behind.
    7) Chad Kelly
    Looks extremely solid for the last pick in the draft. Elway did a great job with this pick. The kid has the physical abilities to have been a 1st-2nd round QB, but fell back due to off the field issues and injury. He seems to have the off the field issues under control he's healthy. Swag looks ready to ball out in the future after he has a little more time to develop. In his first year of play, he's already moved firmly into the backup QB role. Not bad for his first meaningful offseason. He's essentially a rookie, and he made some rookie mistakes, but he seemed to take them in stride and will grow from them.
    Last edited by Freyaka; 09-04-2018 at 07:57 AM.


  8. #23
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    You ain't kidding... Our scouting department is a major issue. I think adding Gary was a big step in the right direction, however... Matt Russell is an absolute joke and should have been let go years ago. Our scouting department, from everything I read, is "by far" the smallest staff in the NFL. That also needs to be remedied.

  9. #24
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    Elway has had some bad draft choices, no doubt about it. Every GM in the NFL has as well, it happens. I think the philosophy has changed a bit and hopefully that has impacted the way he thinks.

    With that said, bottom line in sports is winning, which John and the Broncos have done a good job of for a long time. Free agency is one of the resources all teams can use to build a successful team, Elway uses it well. He has used all resources this well =
    Anonymity is cowardice, and cowards are not known for their wisdom.

  10. #25
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    I'm gonna go into more depth than a smack thread deserves here. Comparing one team that drafts well (New England) One that hasn't (The Browns) and our two teams. For the purposes of this thread, "Still in the league" means that as of today, they are on a current NFL roster.

    Code:
    Team	Still on the team-Still in the League-Out of the NFL-Total Drafted
    2011				
    Broncos   	1	2	7	9
    Chargers	1	3	5	8
    Patriots	0	4	5	9
    Browns	        0	4	4	8
    We tie with the Chargers as the only team to still retain any picks from 2012. Roughly 11% of our picks are still on the team. 22% still in the league. Chargers are 12% and 37% respectively. New England 0% and 44%, browns are 0% and 50%.

    Code:
    Team	Still on the team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    2012				
    Broncos	        1	4	3	7
    Chargers	1	2	5	7
    Patriots	2	4	3	7
    Browns	        0	4	7	11
    Year two. This was actually a really strong draft class for the Broncos. We still only retained one, but that's pretty much the average. For us, from this class 14% are still on the team 57% are still in the league. For the Chargers 14% are still on the team 28% still in the league. Patriots have 28% still on their team and 57% still in the league.

    Code:
    Team	Still on the team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    2013				
    Broncos	        0	4	3	7
    Chargers	1	3	4	7
    Patriots	1	3	4	7
    Browns	        0	2	3	5
    2013 was another year with some players that managed to stick around the league for Denver. 0% still on the team, but 57% still on an NFL roster. For Chargers 14% still on the team, 42% still in the league. Patriots 14% still on the team, 42% still in the league. The browns have 0 on the team 40% still on the team.

    Will continue in another post.
    Last edited by Freyaka; 09-05-2018 at 07:28 AM.


  11. #26
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    Part 2
    Code:
    Team	Still on the team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    2014				
    Broncos	        2	4	2	6
    Chargers	1	2	4	6
    Patriots	1	6	3	9
    Browns	        2	4	2	6
    This was an odd rarity, a good draft for the Browns. For the Browns and Broncos 33% of the players are still on the team, 66% still in the league. For the chargers, 16% are still on the team 33% still in the NFL. For the patriots 11% still on the team 66% still in the league.

    Code:
    Team	Still on the team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    2015
    Broncos	        3	8	1	9
    Chargers	5	5	0	5
    Patriots	6	8	3	11
    Browns	        2	9	3	12
    I'll leave it at here for now because I have to get back to work. I'll pick up with 2016 and 2017 this afternoon. 33% of this class is still on the roster. 88% still in the league. I will actually commend the Chargers on this draft with a 100% stick rate. Not a bad draft. The patriots kept 54% of this draft class and 75% are still in the league. The browns kept 16% of this draft class and 75% still in the league.

    For that period,

    Code:
    Team	Still on the team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    Broncos	        7	22	16	38
    Chargers	9	15	18	33
    Patriots	9	25	18	43
    Browns	        4	23	19	42
    The Broncos had 18% of their prospects stay with the team 57% are still in the league. The Chargers had 27% stick with the team and 45% still in the NFL. The patriots kept 20% of their players and 58% are still in the league. Finally, the browns kept 9% of their players (abysmal) 54% are still in the league.

    What this tells me. We need to get better at retaining our picks. We draft just as well as the average (and we'll revisit these numbers once they are complete over the full period from 2011-2017 draft classes) On average from those 4 teams, about 50% of all players are out of the NFL over that period of time. We're in the same range as everyone, we need to retain more talent that we draft. The drafting talent isn't the issue.

    At the same time, we've been really good in FA. So if you have a talented FA player, you don't just cut him in favor of a lesser draft pick because you drafted one and not the other. You keep the better player.
    Last edited by Freyaka; 09-05-2018 at 07:26 AM.


  12. #27
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    One thing I would add to my thoughts at the end. None of this takes into account our undrafted free agents each year. We are among the best at finding UDFA talent and we have a longstanding history of at least one UDFA making the team almost every year. Once I finish with the draft picks, I'll revisit this vs the other 4 teams if I can.


  13. #28
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    Part 3
    Code:
    Team	Still on the Team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    2016				
    Broncos	        6	8	0	8
    Chargers	5	5	3	8
    Patriots 	6	8	1	9
    Browns	        6	9	5	14
    Of the Broncos 8 2016 picks, 75% stuck around. All are still on a roster. For the chargers (I'll grant you, of the 3, some might be on IR, had a hard time finding right info) 62% still on the roster and in the league. The other 3 have not played a down in preseason or regular since since 2016. Patriots 66% still on the roster 88% still in the league. The browns 42% still on the roster 64% in the league.

    Code:
    Team	Still on the Team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    2017				
    Broncos	        7	8	0	8
    Chargers	7	7	0	7
    Patriots 	2	4	0	4
    Browns	        6	7	3	10
    Now onto the topic of the thread. It's hard to judge a class one year out. My method I used is If they are on the practice squad for the team, they are still on the team as they still have a chance to get promoted within this year. If they are not on an active roster or practice squad, they will fall under the out of the league category, but they still can make an NFL comeback so it's not truly "out of the league"


    To finish it up. Since Elway's been here
    Code:
    Team	Still on the Team	Still in the League	Out of the NFL	Total Drafted
    Broncos	        18	38	16	54
    Chargers	21	27	21	48
    Patriots	18	33	15	56
    Browns	        16	39	27	66
    33% of our picks are still on the roster. 70% are still in the NFL. The chargers still have 43% on their roster, but only 56% are still in the NFL. The patriots have 32% of the players on their roster, 59% still in the NFL. The browns have 24% on their roster and 59% are still in the NFL.

    So again. We're doing fine. We do struggle keeping players on the Roster, but it's not due to making the wrong pick. If 70% of Elway's picks are still on an NFL team, he's not doing terrible. The chargers do a lot better job of keeping their players on their team, but a larger percentage of their draft picks don't make it.

    Neither of our teams draft bad, despite the attempt at smack you tried in this thread.
    Last edited by Freyaka; 09-05-2018 at 07:25 AM.


  14. #29
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    I don't have an easy way to break down our UDFA vs others, but looking at our roster,

    Lindsey, Patrick, LaCosse, Barrett, Johnson, Harris Jr., Thomas (CB), Carter (IR) are all currently on the roster (other than Carter, but he has a shot when he comes back) That's 7 players that are UDFA and a lot of those UDFA players are from 2018. So when you've got that many guys that are playing so well they make the team...You are going to have some draft picks that you either have to cut outright or stash on your practice squad.

    Having success with UDFA is NOT a knock on Elway, it's a praiseworthy attribute. This team excels at finding diamonds in the rough. 13% of our roster is UDFA
    Last edited by Freyaka; 09-05-2018 at 07:24 AM.


  15. #30
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    Good digging on all that Frey!!!!

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