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Thread: Drew Lock

  1. #556
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianmcfarlane View Post
    I have now watched over an hour of plays of Mullens while at So Miss some were highlights most of it was playing in games not specifically highlights. I saw one play that he was under center and it was a PAP that was completed. None of his highlights were under center. Maybe this is an indication that Scangarello can develop QBs to play under center well, considering SF ran more than half from under center... looks like a positive thing no matter what QB they may draft?
    It's not a hard concept to learn, high school kids will make the transition in an off-season to be able to do it comfortably. Compound this when you're in an environment where every single day you are studying, practising, evaluating, repeating, and your life is dedicated to it, it's not a momentous mountain to climb, and it hasn't made or broken a single prospect I can ever remember. Mullen is another example I guess of a guy who was totally forgotten during the draft process, wasn't even considered draft worthy, and he adapted with no hitches at all to playing under center, it's a complete non-issue.

  2. #557
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    Also Sam, did you watch the Senior Bowl game this year ? Drew Lock took a handful of snaps from under center, off-set I formation handing the football off, ran some naked boots out of it with tight end movement in the backfield, and he looked perfectly comfortable doing so. He also ran a 3rd or 4th down quarterback sneak from under center, and in the 2 minute offense spiked the ball from under center as well. Both of these show some different actions and requirements of playing from the position, and Lock was comfortable before even entering the NFL doing so. I have other concerns for Lock which are much more integral than this non-issue of taking snaps from under center.
    That's good. I'm not worried about rookie QBs learning Sangarello's offense given time to absorb it, and with enough practice reps to work from under Center without thinking about it. I do challenge those who claim the transition from gun to under is not a big deal. It will be interesting to see how under, two back and PAP is used and how balanced the O turns out to be.

    Denver's first pick could end up being any position except RB, WR, S, LS, PK and P. If it turns out to be Drew Lock, I'm sure it will have been an informed decision with everyone's input taken into consideration. I'm looking forward to seeing Sangarello's offense in action. It should be a worthy complement to Fangio's defense.

  3. #558
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    Quote Originally Posted by samparnell View Post
    http://www.denverbroncos.com/news/wh...-a-quarterback

    http://www.milehighreport.com/2019/3...s-a-good-thing

    There you go, DB. Denver will probably join the Rams, Pats, Niners and Saints going under Center about half the snaps or more. Sufficiently relevant for you?
    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    It's not a hard concept to learn, high school kids will make the transition in an off-season to be able to do it comfortably. Compound this when you're in an environment where every single day you are studying, practising, evaluating, repeating, and your life is dedicated to it, it's not a momentous mountain to climb, and it hasn't made or broken a single prospect I can ever remember. Mullen is another example I guess of a guy who was totally forgotten during the draft process, wasn't even considered draft worthy, and he adapted with no hitches at all to playing under center, it's a complete non-issue.
    My part of the conversation began talking with some who doubted Denver would be under Center much. Links show Denver's QB may be under half the snaps. That is the issue and it isn't a non-issue. It's an example of how the game can swing like a pendulum to one extreme only to swing back as a result of coaches utilizing elements that have been around a long time.

  4. #559
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    It's not a hard concept to learn, high school kids will make the transition in an off-season to be able to do it comfortably. Compound this when you're in an environment where every single day you are studying, practising, evaluating, repeating, and your life is dedicated to it, it's not a momentous mountain to climb, and it hasn't made or broken a single prospect I can ever remember. Mullen is another example I guess of a guy who was totally forgotten during the draft process, wasn't even considered draft worthy, and he adapted with no hitches at all to playing under center, it's a complete non-issue.
    One of the comments about Lock from the Senior Bowl was about how quickly he responded to coaching.

    During the Combine one of the quarterbacks (Minshew?) had difficulty with timing on a 5 step drop back post route. After two poor passes Greg Knapp stopped him and said he needed to hit the last step and fire the ball - there was an extra half step which threw off the timing. On the next attempt Minshew hit the last step and fired the ball with a perfect strike with the receiver coming out of the break. This was an example of how a small amount of coaching goes a long way.

    If I recall correctly, Lock hired his own QB coach to work on aspects such as taking snaps from under center, footwork, etc. The work he put in beyond what was required on the team illustrates his commitment to developing. That doesn’t guarantee a successful transition but it says a lot about his drive to improve.
    Last edited by Fantaztic7; 04-12-2019 at 06:19 PM.

  5. #560
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    Even with his consistency issues, some scouts are comparing him to Matthew Stafford. He makes a lot of anticipation throws in college, which is unique. Here's a scouting breakdown of him game that I like:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMZEx-9n9p4

  6. #561
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoStampede View Post
    Even with his consistency issues, some scouts are comparing him to Matthew Stafford. He makes a lot of anticipation throws in college, which is unique. Here's a scouting breakdown of him game that I like:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMZEx-9n9p4
    Comparing him to a qb that can't with a playoff game and has been inconsistent in the NFL is not a good look. I wouldn't want MS.

  7. #562
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    Quote Originally Posted by samparnell View Post
    That's good. I'm not worried about rookie QBs learning Sangarello's offense given time to absorb it, and with enough practice reps to work from under Center without thinking about it. I do challenge those who claim the transition from gun to under is not a big deal. It will be interesting to see how under, two back and PAP is used and how balanced the O turns out to be.

    Denver's first pick could end up being any position except RB, WR, S, LS, PK and P. If it turns out to be Drew Lock, I'm sure it will have been an informed decision with everyone's input taken into consideration. I'm looking forward to seeing Sangarello's offense in action. It should be a worthy complement to Fangio's defense.

    My part of the conversation began talking with some who doubted Denver would be under Center much. Links show Denver's QB may be under half the snaps. That is the issue and it isn't a non-issue. It's an example of how the game can swing like a pendulum to one extreme only to swing back as a result of coaches utilizing elements that have been around a long time.
    I think it is a big deal, from a footwork and mental processing stand point, but not from the angle that people often talk about, the exchange. Reading a defense during a 5 step drop, making your checks, and knowing when to get off those checks is a lot different then when doing the same from the shot-gun, and your footwork needs to line up with this, that is where the adjustment is. As I asked, when has this ever been a problem with these young guys transitioning to the NFL in recent times when moving under center ? It's a played out rhetoric which isn't supported by actual evidence, it's a pointless talking point.

    I didn't have anything to do with that conversation, didn't say a word about it. I commented on the points being made about it potentially being a seamless transition from Flacco to Lock in a hypothetical world, and the concerns regarding playing under center when that occurs. My point, Lock is already showing he could do it (Senior Bowl), he would have plenty of time to learn in that scenario, and there is no evidence to suggest that playing under center would be a problem for him, therefore a non-issue.

  8. #563
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ear2dastreets View Post
    Agreed ^^^^^... I say it time and time again. He just has a big arm. His completion % is awful.
    Pretty much the same Rosen had at UCLA. Same as Sam Darnold at USC. Higher than Josh Allen. Lower than Mayfield, Murray and Haskins, though with lower quality receivers and a lesser O-line. Of course, stats don't tell the full story. I do see waaay too many passes from Lock where he is retreating backwards with an erratic release point, but he is still surprisingly accurate doing it, if inconsistently so. His weak O-line plays a role in that, but Daniel Jones' was far worse at Duke. I still think I would be happy with Lock, but he will need time.
    Last edited by CheyennePress; 04-13-2019 at 10:04 PM.

  9. #564
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    https://www.profootballfocus.com/new...ins-ohio-state

    I know PFF isnt the last word but still kind of interesting.
    "I'm scared if I stop all at once, the cumulative hangover will literally kill me."

  10. #565
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    Quote Originally Posted by MHS View Post
    https://www.profootballfocus.com/new...ins-ohio-state

    I know PFF isnt the last word but still kind of interesting.
    The last quote from this article......


    "Perhaps the biggest flaw in Haskins’ play was his performance when facing pressure. He faltered massively this season when pressure was applied, recording a 56.7 passing grade and the lowest big-time throw rate out of the top QBs in the class."

    Anyone can be good and make all the necessary throws when they aren't pressured.


    Andy Jano 2017 adopted Bronco

  11. #566
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    I think it is a big deal, from a footwork and mental processing stand point, but not from the angle that people often talk about, the exchange. Reading a defense during a 5 step drop, making your checks, and knowing when to get off those checks is a lot different then when doing the same from the shot-gun, and your footwork needs to line up with this, that is where the adjustment is. As I asked, when has this ever been a problem with these young guys transitioning to the NFL in recent times when moving under center ? It's a played out rhetoric which isn't supported by actual evidence, it's a pointless talking point.

    I didn't have anything to do with that conversation, didn't say a word about it. I commented on the points being made about it potentially being a seamless transition from Flacco to Lock in a hypothetical world, and the concerns regarding playing under center when that occurs. My point, Lock is already showing he could do it (Senior Bowl), he would have plenty of time to learn in that scenario, and there is no evidence to suggest that playing under center would be a problem for him, therefore a non-issue.
    Splitting snaps between under Center, one and two back, and direct snap/shotgun is a multiple formation, high volume, balanced offense. When it is part of a WCO system, it is called from the sideline/box because the concept is to dictate to the defense through the use of formations. Bill Walsh wrote a thirteen part outline on that subject.

    During his years with the Colts, Peyton Manning ran a limited formation, low volume, pass heavy offense. He used mostly 11 personnel, balanced shotgun formations from which there was little or no motion. He used the play clock to get a clean read from how the D aligned and what coverage they showed. He would audible changes based on his pre-snap read.

    When Gary Kubiak installed his offense in 2015, it was much more under Center than Gase's previous system. There were some observers at the time who thought it had an adverse effect on Manning's play although there were injury issues involved as well. I think I remember Peyton getting stepped on by a puller sometime that season when he was running a play from under.

    Then we had the Paxton Lynch experience. He doesn't seem like much of an under Center kind of guy, but maybe that's just him. If an offense splits the snaps between under and gun, it will be a more complicated system than a pass heavy offense run from shotgun only. On top of that, if it's a WCO, the play calls are very verbose. So, there's a lot to it, if an offense is going to be both under Center and shotgun, too. I'm looking forward to seeing what the Broncos new O looks like.
    Last edited by samparnell; 04-14-2019 at 10:51 AM. Reason: needed a verb
    "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

  12. #567
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianmcfarlane View Post
    I have now watched over an hour of plays of Mullens while at So Miss some were highlights most of it was playing in games not specifically highlights. I saw one play that he was under center and it was a PAP that was completed. None of his highlights were under center. Maybe this is an indication that Scangarello can develop QBs to play under center well, considering SF ran more than half from under center... looks like a positive thing no matter what QB they may draft?
    I saw one list from 2017 that ranked Nick Mullens lower than Kyle Sloter. Apparently Rich Scangarello is a pretty good scout of college QBs as well as a good developer of them. I hope he is given ample input into the construction of Denver's Draft Board. If Denver drafts a QB, it will be very interesting when we find out who.
    "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

  13. #568
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    Quote Originally Posted by JvDub95 View Post
    The last quote from this article......


    "Perhaps the biggest flaw in Haskins’ play was his performance when facing pressure. He faltered massively this season when pressure was applied, recording a 56.7 passing grade and the lowest big-time throw rate out of the top QBs in the class."

    Anyone can be good and make all the necessary throws when they aren't pressured.
    Lock also when pressured either rolls out and there his ball placement have been downfall. Also when pressured, Lock continues to throw off his back foot creating INTs. I’d pass on both.Give me DEFENSE!!

  14. #569
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    I think most would agree that there would be no reservations taking Lock in the 2nd round, yes? He may or may not be available at that point, but I think there is that possibility.

  15. #570
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    Quote Originally Posted by montee2ball View Post
    Lock also when pressured either rolls out and there his ball placement have been downfall. Also when pressured, Lock continues to throw off his back foot creating INTs. I’d pass on both.Give me DEFENSE!!
    He threw what, 8 ints last season? Same as Haskins and one less than Murray. You knock him because he has the athleticism to escape pressure? It sounds to me you dont like him just to not like him.


    Andy Jano 2017 adopted Bronco

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