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Thread: Flacco

  1. #1321
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Rod- View Post
    I believe all Drew Lock has to do is make Elway and Fangio feel he is ready to match or get close to Flacco's performance on the field. If he does that, the Broncos should be very comfortable moving forward with Lock while adding $20,25 million in cap space [Flacco's 2020 cap number, $0 guaranteed money] to improve the roster.

    If Flacco plays poorly, Lock is in. If Flacco plays average, Lock must convince the staff he already is average. If Flacco has a strong season, Lock will have to 'wow' everyone in the building, pretty much like Mahomes replacing Alex Smith in KC.

    And if someone comes up with 'Mahomes was a top-10 pick, Lock is a 2nd-round QB': the Broncos have one less year to develop and evaluate Lock before he hits FA, which could lead to an interest in getting him on the field sooner rather than later.
    I agree. I also think the staff will give Lock every chance to make those impressions as well. I don't believe for one second that Flacco has a long leash.

  2. #1322
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    Quote Originally Posted by gtown53 View Post
    We could have Drafted Lock at 10, as many on this Board were hoping for. We could have Drafted Lock at 20, but we didn't. We could have Drafted Lock at 41 in the 2nd Round, but we didn't. When Lock, a 2nd Round talent was still available, the the Broncos were pro-active in going after a "2nd Round talent", ............................................. in the 2nd Round.

    Hopefully he isn't another Brock Osweiler! In fact, I'm anxious to see how he compares to ................................ Rypien in pre-season. Should be fun to watch!
    regardless of where Lock was drafted, the draft capital spent to acquire him as well as zero guaranteed money on Flacco's contract means it won't take much for Flacco to be supplanted. This year we have nearly half of the entire starting defense on their contract year. Wolfe, both Harris', Gotsis, Parks, and Simmons all will need to be re-signed or replaced, which will cost money. It's in the organization's best interest for a young QB on a cheap rookie contract to step up and free up that space to make the team better.
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  3. #1323
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    Quote Originally Posted by listopencil View Post
    Holy cow? We drafted Lock three times? Well, I sure hope one of those Locks work out.
    Better hope one of those Flaccos works out too. If you count altogether, in this year alone we spent 25 million in cap space for the QB position, and four draft picks to fill the spot with talent, and one of those QB's isn't even playing for us anymore. You better hope one of those 'Locks' works out.
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  4. #1324
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam_Z View Post
    Have you considered the offensive line in Baltimore the last few years?

    Joe D'Alessandris Is not the greatest coach in the world, in fact heís known to have multiple names for the same formation creating a ton of confusion for his linemen.

    His past Offensive linemen have said that his scheme is one of these most confusing theyíve ever had to get accustomed to.

    Not only that but he doesnít allow his lineman to change up their stance or point of attack to counter a weakness. Nor does he adjust to the style of the players that he has.

    How is any offensive lineman supposed to block for a QB when they have a very arrogant hard case giving them strict yet very little options?

    You should go do some research on Joe D'Alessandris because Iím telling you a good chunk of joes failures originate with this man.
    The Raven's OL has been average at worst, if not top tier, for almost the entirety of Flacco's career.

    Depending on what method of analysis you prefer, they were 10th(3rd pass protection), 18th(5th pass pro), 9th, 13th, 3rd, 23rd, 17th, 8th, 4th, and 5th in the league from 2009-2018 by Pro Football Focus.

    If you like Football Outsiders, the have the Raven's pass protection ranked at 8th(best), 4th, 8th, 2nd, 4th, 16th, 13th, 12th, 25th, 19th, and 20th from 2008-2018.

    If you go by purely sacks given up per game, the Ravens were 12th(fewest), 8th, 13th, 3rd, 1st, 28th, 14th, 17th, 24th, 13th, and 15th from 2008-2018

    If you go by sacks given up on a per-pass basis, the Ravens were 15th(least-often), 6th, 7th, 1st, 2nd, 20th, 14th, 15th, 27th, 16th, and 20th from 2008-2018.

    If you go by QB hits, the Ravens had the 2nd fewest(5th fewest pressures) in 2018, and the 2nd fewest(3rd fewest pressures) in 2017- the two years D'Alessandris has been the OL coach.



    Speaking of D'alessandris, his previous job was SD's OL coach. He took over in 2013, where he elevated their play from 28th the year before his hire to 18th in his first year. The chargers followed that by getting injured and had two bad years along the OL, leading him to take over in Baltimore. But SD was not his first OL gig, prior to that he was in Buffalo from 2010-2012, where he coached the 19th, 2nd, and 5th best pass protecting OLs by Pro Football Focus and the 17th, 1st, and 10th best pass protecting OLs by Football Outsiders.

    Whether or not players like him or think he puts them in position to succeed, he has had success in several places, including coaching Baltimore's OL.

    Pretty much every way you can look at it, Flacco has had solid, if not great pass protection his whole career.

  5. #1325
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    Quote Originally Posted by jflee66 View Post
    No, who knows if Lock can become an NFL starter? It's going to take time. But I doubt JF has a bad year w/ this team around him. JF starting in 2020 would be anything BUT, a disaster. It more then likely means we made the POs. Which I believe we will.
    If Flacco passes for 3200 yards, 24 TDs, and 12 INTs and we make the playoffs would you want him to be the unquestioned starter going into next year? For the long term, I think itís better to get Lock on the field at some point this season as it allows us to create cap room to field a strong team around Lock for the duration of his rookie contract. Obviously this will depend on how Lock performs in practice this season as well as any additional game time he may receive whether it be during a blowout or an injury to Flacco. If he does well it makes the decision easier, if he doesnít then I think you have to look into getting Flacco to renegotiate although that likely adds guaranteed money to the deal.

  6. #1326
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    Any notion of Lock supplanting Flacco early or at any point this season is premature. Lock spent the majority of the offseason as the teamís No. 3 QB. He took only a small number of second-team reps while Kevin Hogan received the majority.

    During minicamp Lock got an opportunity with the 2ís going against the first-team defense. It didnít go well for the Lock. He had an interception during 11 on 11 team period. Fangio said Lock is slowly making strides.

    Itís very early in the process and Lock is a very hard worker. He could accelerate development in training camp and preseason - will have to wait and see.

  7. #1327
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    Quote Originally Posted by Papa-pwn View Post
    The Raven's OL has been average at worst, if not top tier, for almost the entirety of Flacco's career.

    Depending on what method of analysis you prefer, they were 10th(3rd pass protection), 18th(5th pass pro), 9th, 13th, 3rd, 23rd, 17th, 8th, 4th, and 5th in the league from 2009-2018 by Pro Football Focus.

    If you like Football Outsiders, the have the Raven's pass protection ranked at 8th(best), 4th, 8th, 2nd, 4th, 16th, 13th, 12th, 25th, 19th, and 20th from 2008-2018.

    If you go by purely sacks given up per game, the Ravens were 12th(fewest), 8th, 13th, 3rd, 1st, 28th, 14th, 17th, 24th, 13th, and 15th from 2008-2018

    If you go by sacks given up on a per-pass basis, the Ravens were 15th(least-often), 6th, 7th, 1st, 2nd, 20th, 14th, 15th, 27th, 16th, and 20th from 2008-2018.

    If you go by QB hits, the Ravens had the 2nd fewest(5th fewest pressures) in 2018, and the 2nd fewest(3rd fewest pressures) in 2017- the two years D'Alessandris has been the OL coach.



    Speaking of D'alessandris, his previous job was SD's OL coach. He took over in 2013, where he elevated their play from 28th the year before his hire to 18th in his first year. The chargers followed that by getting injured and had two bad years along the OL, leading him to take over in Baltimore. But SD was not his first OL gig, prior to that he was in Buffalo from 2010-2012, where he coached the 19th, 2nd, and 5th best pass protecting OLs by Pro Football Focus and the 17th, 1st, and 10th best pass protecting OLs by Football Outsiders.

    Whether or not players like him or think he puts them in position to succeed, he has had success in several places, including coaching Baltimore's OL.

    Pretty much every way you can look at it, Flacco has had solid, if not great pass protection his whole career.
    Munchak will look to keep that trend going here.
    His coaching is important for Bolles and McGovernís progress
    Risner will upgrade Lg
    A healthy Leary, and the addition of James rounds out what could be our best unit in years.

  8. #1328
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    Any notion of Lock supplanting Flacco early or at any point this season is premature. Lock spent the majority of the offseason as the team’s No. 3 QB. He took only a small number of second-team reps while Kevin Hogan received the majority.

    During minicamp Lock got an opportunity with the 2’s going against the first-team defense. It didn’t go well for the Lock. He had an interception during 11 on 11 team period. Fangio said Lock is slowly making strides.

    It’s very early in the process and Lock is a very hard worker. He could accelerate development in training camp and preseason - will have to wait and see.
    I'm not surprised his outing against the starting defense wasn't very good. Mahomes had similar experiences in his training camp prior to the season starting, and then he took the Chiefs to another level. I don't think this year he will take over naturally for Flacco, but by next season it needs to be a serious question if he's shown any improvement.
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  9. #1329
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    Quote Originally Posted by beastlyskronk View Post
    If Flacco passes for 3200 yards, 24 TDs, and 12 INTs and we make the playoffs would you want him to be the unquestioned starter going into next year? For the long term, I think it’s better to get Lock on the field at some point this season as it allows us to create cap room to field a strong team around Lock for the duration of his rookie contract. Obviously this will depend on how Lock performs in practice this season as well as any additional game time he may receive whether it be during a blowout or an injury to Flacco. If he does well it makes the decision easier, if he doesn’t then I think you have to look into getting Flacco to renegotiate although that likely adds guaranteed money to the deal.
    Well the QB stats would be rather irrelevant!
    A passing TD is not better than a rushing TD and there is a whole lot more evidence for the opposite being true.

    Lets take 2015 Manning as an example.
    His stats in the playoffs were 2 TD/1INT/8Sacks and less than 200 yards/game.

    The job of the QB is to keep the team together and do that extra little thing that wins you the game. If we have 6-8 game winning drives and he has been a steady hand, then no way would I like to get rid of him. We saw from Plummer to Cutler how stupid it was to fall in love with "the hot new rookie". Paxton Lynch was supposed to blow Siemian out of the water year 2....

  10. #1330
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoFanDK View Post
    Well the QB stats would be rather irrelevant!
    A passing TD is not better than a rushing TD and there is a whole lot more evidence for the opposite being true.

    Lets take 2015 Manning as an example.
    His stats in the playoffs were 2 TD/1INT/8Sacks and less than 200 yards/game.

    The job of the QB is to keep the team together and do that extra little thing that wins you the game. If we have 6-8 game winning drives and he has been a steady hand, then no way would I like to get rid of him. We saw from Plummer to Cutler how stupid it was to fall in love with "the hot new rookie". Paxton Lynch was supposed to blow Siemian out of the water year 2....
    Ok throw the stats out the window, would you have supported Manning coming back to try and repeat? Did you think the Ravens made a mistake getting rid of Trent Dilfer after winning a super bowl? Do you think he who shall not be named shouldíve been brought back by Elway when we got Manning?

    The goal is to win a Super Bowl every year, is Flacco giving us the best chance at that with his contract and age? I think that he does for this season but finding out what we have in Lock sooner than later would be in the best interest for the long term.

  11. #1331
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    Quote Originally Posted by beastlyskronk View Post
    Ok throw the stats out the window, would you have supported Manning coming back to try and repeat? Did you think the Ravens made a mistake getting rid of Trent Dilfer after winning a super bowl? Do you think he who shall not be named should’ve been brought back by Elway when we got Manning?

    The goal is to win a Super Bowl every year, is Flacco giving us the best chance at that with his contract and age? I think that he does for this season but finding out what we have in Lock sooner than later would be in the best interest for the long term.
    Of all the options that were available to the Broncos, I would have gone after Foles. Mainly because of age. But Flacco was the #2 option that was available in the NFL. Lock isn't an option to compete for a Super Bowl, as a rookie. And judging by what I'm hearing from an extremely limited amount of practice time, Lock may not be ready for a few years. Considering that this is the NFL, and that injuries happen to every team, every year, there is always that possibility that Lock could get thrown into the fire, early. We'll get some sort of idea of what we have in Lock when pre-season games start.

  12. #1332
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAsianPA View Post
    I'm not surprised his outing against the starting defense wasn't very good. Mahomes had similar experiences in his training camp prior to the season starting, and then he took the Chiefs to another level. I don't think this year he will take over naturally for Flacco, but by next season it needs to be a serious question if he's shown any improvement.
    Agree. Flacco also had challenges against the starters and heís a veteran. Training camp and preseason should give us a better sense of how Lock is developing.

  13. #1333
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    Agree. Flacco also had challenges against the starters and heís a veteran. Training camp and preseason should give us a better sense of how Lock is developing.
    It will be nice to have 5 preseason games, for both Lock and the rest of the young players. 48 days until the first preseason game!

  14. #1334
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    Quote Originally Posted by beastlyskronk View Post
    If Flacco passes for 3200 yards, 24 TDs, and 12 INTs and we make the playoffs would you want him to be the unquestioned starter going into next year? For the long term, I think it’s better to get Lock on the field at some point this season as it allows us to create cap room to field a strong team around Lock for the duration of his rookie contract. Obviously this will depend on how Lock performs in practice this season as well as any additional game time he may receive whether it be during a blowout or an injury to Flacco. If he does well it makes the decision easier, if he doesn’t then I think you have to look into getting Flacco to renegotiate although that likely adds guaranteed money to the deal.
    Imo, Lock isn't going to be a great NFL starter, he might get better as he grows, of course, but it's going to take years. At this time JF is way ahead of him in NFL readiness. If JF gets hurt and Lock is put in it could possible hinder his confidence and his game at this point. If JF takes us to POs then I would certainly keep him and make Lock prove he's capable of running an NFL Offense. After 3 years we will know what we have in Lock just by preseasons and training camp competition.

  15. #1335
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    Quote Originally Posted by jflee66 View Post
    Imo, Lock isn't going to be a great NFL starter, he might get better as he grows, of course, but it's going to take years. At this time JF is way ahead of him in NFL readiness. If JF gets hurt and Lock is put in it could possible hinder his confidence and his game at this point. If JF takes us to POs then I would certainly keep him and make Lock prove he's capable of running an NFL Offense. After 3 years we will know what we have in Lock just by preseasons and training camp competition.
    It worked for Aaron Rodgers, so hopefully, it could work for Lock.

    Lock has a "guru QB coach" in Scangarello, the attitude to succeed, time to improve his game, plus an improving OL under Munchak.

    Unfortunately, in this era of instant gratification, Lock may start sooner than later.
    Hopefully, Flacco and Lock both succeed in Denver for many years to come.

    The only thing about Rodgers that surprises me is that he's only won one SB.

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