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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Winnipeg
    Posts
    32,404

    I Think What Some Of Us Are Really Saying About This Team/Organization

    Elway and his Execs must surely know what a Business Plan is. There are many forms of such plans, but to my knowledge:

    1) You state your mission
    2) Build a 5 year plan (or whatever is in vogue these days)
    3) Make sure the plan includes team identity/goals
    4) Specific actions to achieve your goals and timing thereof...including resource requirements
    5) Reassess periodically to determine if you are on track or not, if you need to modify, and how you will follow through

    I haven't been involved with this sort of stuff for years, so it is just a simple version I recall. Regardless, I think many of us are saying that we need to better understand the plan, including team identity. And if we want to be a complete team, do we have a resource plan to not only fill in any shortcomings, but excel wherever we can. The word "Excellence" used to be thrown around too liberally in my opinion (think Raiders), but it is not a bad thing to try to incorporate, in everything you do. Are The Broncos "excellent" in many ways? Few? Somewhere in between likely.

    So lets step back and try to visualize the plan, as if we were GMs. Would we be happy with the team in general, or would we be a bit anxious about the many weak spots? For example, an O needs a good Oline. And an O needs a decent QB. Not seeing it. So....if those are critical success elements, one has to develop an action plan to improve on both, not hope for the best. In terms of Oline, it may take another offseason of drafting and FA. But make that a priority!

    If it's QB, plan how the successor to the current QB will take over, and when....unless the plan is to keep shopping. That worries me, but AS LONG AS you are going to commit to finding the best we can find during the offseason, then I at least have some faith in the process.

    Part of the resource plan will also include the possibilities of trade, and future benefits. If one ore more of our current players are starting to decline, and we need to maximize resources, we should also have action items surrounding those possibilities. Are there trade partners in the mix, who may be a little desperate, and give us added value in return? These are GM things, and we may never know (no matter what they tell us).

    Bottom line for me....I am willing to sit back another year, and not lose hope IF I feel like we are actively in the business of turning things around. That we are going to be proactive in the areas that require such attention. And I am not talking a total rebuild. Heck, we have a good run game, some youthful talent throughout the lineup, and some key vets who could be the leaders that help grow/develop the younger ones. We may have some of the right coaches, but I will not endorse them all at this point.

    What I fear is that we are being run in a random type manner. I am sure that's not the way, but at times it appears that way to me. The QB choices, the draft picks, and yes, some of the coaching decisions. It does always not feel like a team that knows where it is going, or how to get there.

    I guess you might say, I do not have a lot of faith in the leadership these days. I do not feel like we are just one hill away. It feels more like a mountain, twisted road, river and fog, in places. And though that sounds formidable, it is NOT, if you know your way through it. Do we? Do we have the map, and the details of the journey?

    I say possibly yes, but only if that means we start ramping up for next year and the next, and not get lost in a win here and a win there. Otherwise we definitely need changes at the top. Random leads to random outcomes.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    10,565
    I said this in another thread, and I'll say it here...

    If you're waiting for, hoping for, or expecting Elway to pull us out of this mess, then you're going to be sorely disappointed. He does not have it in his makeup to fix this the way it needs to be fixed. That's why we've gone through 3 head coaches and 6 starting quarterbacks in 4 seasons.

    It's over. We need to move on.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    312
    Elway is a cancer to this team and thinks he can band-aid and duct tape us back into the playoffs. What you said OP makes sense however nothing rational from a business or rebuilding standpoint will be achieved while he has any say in the running of this team.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Winnipeg
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    Quote Originally Posted by mojo0730 View Post
    I said this in another thread, and I'll say it here...

    If you're waiting for, hoping for, or expecting Elway to pull us out of this mess, then you're going to be sorely disappointed. He does not have it in his makeup to fix this the way it needs to be fixed. That's why we've gone through 3 head coaches and 6 starting quarterbacks in 4 seasons.

    It's over. We need to move on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Skylan View Post
    Elway is a cancer to this team and thinks he can band-aid and duct tape us back into the playoffs. What you said OP makes sense however nothing rational from a business or rebuilding standpoint will be achieved while he has any say in the running of this team.
    I understand your comments....if he and the other leaders can not show evidence of their managerial strengths, then they should be part of the plan....on the resourcing side. I think it is almost time, and if so, it should be addressed before the year ends, so that the new leaders have time to prepare.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    10,087
    I had mentioned before that Elway is being true to Bowlen and honoring the mantra of "I want to be first in everything". This, I believe is why Denver has not attempted a true rebuild. It has been a strategy based on wishing and hoping. I highly doubt Elway will tear it down and try to build the old fashioned way.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Lone Tree
    Posts
    2,269
    Quote Originally Posted by Bronco51 View Post
    I had mentioned before that Elway is being true to Bowlen and honoring the mantra of "I want to be first in everything". This, I believe is why Denver has not attempted a true rebuild. It has been a strategy based on wishing and hoping. I highly doubt Elway will tear it down and try to build the old fashioned way.
    I agree with this statement. It is bad now but I also believe that mantra is part of what has made this such a successful franchise.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Carlsbad, NM
    Posts
    2,124
    Quote Originally Posted by CanDB View Post
    Elway and his Execs must surely know what a Business Plan is. There are many forms of such plans, but to my knowledge:

    1) You state your mission
    2) Build a 5 year plan (or whatever is in vogue these days)
    3) Make sure the plan includes team identity/goals
    4) Specific actions to achieve your goals and timing thereof...including resource requirements
    5) Reassess periodically to determine if you are on track or not, if you need to modify, and how you will follow through

    I haven't been involved with this sort of stuff for years, so it is just a simple version I recall. Regardless, I think many of us are saying that we need to better understand the plan, including team identity. And if we want to be a complete team, do we have a resource plan to not only fill in any shortcomings, but excel wherever we can. The word "Excellence" used to be thrown around too liberally in my opinion (think Raiders), but it is not a bad thing to try to incorporate, in everything you do. Are The Broncos "excellent" in many ways? Few? Somewhere in between likely.

    So lets step back and try to visualize the plan, as if we were GMs. Would we be happy with the team in general, or would we be a bit anxious about the many weak spots? For example, an O needs a good Oline. And an O needs a decent QB. Not seeing it. So....if those are critical success elements, one has to develop an action plan to improve on both, not hope for the best. In terms of Oline, it may take another offseason of drafting and FA. But make that a priority!

    If it's QB, plan how the successor to the current QB will take over, and when....unless the plan is to keep shopping. That worries me, but AS LONG AS you are going to commit to finding the best we can find during the offseason, then I at least have some faith in the process.

    Part of the resource plan will also include the possibilities of trade, and future benefits. If one ore more of our current players are starting to decline, and we need to maximize resources, we should also have action items surrounding those possibilities. Are there trade partners in the mix, who may be a little desperate, and give us added value in return? These are GM things, and we may never know (no matter what they tell us).

    Bottom line for me....I am willing to sit back another year, and not lose hope IF I feel like we are actively in the business of turning things around. That we are going to be proactive in the areas that require such attention. And I am not talking a total rebuild. Heck, we have a good run game, some youthful talent throughout the lineup, and some key vets who could be the leaders that help grow/develop the younger ones. We may have some of the right coaches, but I will not endorse them all at this point.

    What I fear is that we are being run in a random type manner. I am sure that's not the way, but at times it appears that way to me. The QB choices, the draft picks, and yes, some of the coaching decisions. It does always not feel like a team that knows where it is going, or how to get there.

    I guess you might say, I do not have a lot of faith in the leadership these days. I do not feel like we are just one hill away. It feels more like a mountain, twisted road, river and fog, in places. And though that sounds formidable, it is NOT, if you know your way through it. Do we? Do we have the map, and the details of the journey?

    I say possibly yes, but only if that means we start ramping up for next year and the next, and not get lost in a win here and a win there. Otherwise we definitely need changes at the top. Random leads to random outcomes.
    You are exactly right, We have no vision. Mr B had vision and that is the root of our problem. Until ownership is settled we will be in this fog. The scary part is unless we get the right owner, one with a vision like Mr B., We may be lost for a lot longer then we would all like.

    BCMB Div I - AB's Etsy Shop | BCMB FF Smackdown - Cold Feet

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    10,212
    Unfortunately the trust, Joe Ellis, Rich Slivka and Mary Kelly will milk their power as long as possible. Iím sure they have good intention, but there is no reason to change the status quo. They are paid well with absolutely no accountability. When you can draw 74,000+ fans to Thursday Night Football while overseeing the demise of a once great franchise, all is good.

    Even when Brittany Bowlen takes a position with the Broncos, the trust and Elway will limit her influence. It will likely be years if not a decade before she takes full control. Only if Ellis stays true to Pat Bowlen will he move to fire Elway. Elway has good will from his legacy and turning things around after the McDaniels fiasco. Ellis will ride the train as long as possible. Meanwhile the Broncos have plummeted to the bottom of the NFL. A couple of wins created a bounce from the bottom of thepower rankings, only to show the true makeup of the team last night.

    In the short run Fangio needs to step up and push for approval to start Lock. If he canít make the call then he should consider stepping down - plenty of teams need a good DC. There is no plan with Elway. Itís delusional to think a player here, a player there will turn this around. The franchise needs a GM who will move past the success from 2015.
    Last edited by Fantaztic7; 10-18-2019 at 01:23 PM.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,360
    Why are people blaming Elway with such certainty?

    Does anyone really know Ellis' role?

    The Bowlen family needs to get their act together
    as they are the key to all of this nonsense.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    8,255
    Quote Originally Posted by mozzerpete View Post
    Why are people blaming Elway with such certainty?

    Does anyone really know Ellis' role?

    The Bowlen family needs to get their act together
    as they are the key to all of this nonsense.
    Honestly, I think itís time to lock the past in a trophy case and reflect every few years at halftime. I think holding on to the past has serious hurt this team in a manner that only a complete clean sweep will fix. The Ellis-Elway, Shanny-Kubes trees all need to be chopped down and removed. We need to reset and rebuild from the FO up. This organization is not even recognizable to what Mr.B worked hard to make sure we enjoyed year after year.

    And with that, I agree with the questions that you pose. Orlando Franklin and a few others have come out and said that there are issues with Ellis and some players. I think some here are so staunch, ďteam-team-team!!!! Rah-rah-rah!!!Ē That the exiting words of players like Talib, DT, Ward, Jackson, Decker, etc........ fell on deaf ears. When they foretold everything weíre witnessing now. Especially DT and Talib. But that was just written off as sour grapes.

    And the poor state of ownership is a higher problem. Weíre not stable at the foundation, why would we be stable anywhere else?

    Itís a mess and unfortunately the only way to fix it is to tear it all apart and rebuild the Ownership/ FO/ Coaching/ Players.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    10,087
    Quote Originally Posted by JW7 View Post
    I agree with this statement. It is bad now but I also believe that mantra is part of what has made this such a successful franchise.
    Yeah, I am hoping that the leadership Bowlen brought to this franchise didn't die with him. It seems there are just too many lapses in judgment by the people in charge of righting the ship. It just goes to show that when an owner is involved in a good way (the opposite of Dan Snyder) that it really sets the tone for the entire franchise from top to bottom. Players used to praise Bowlen for how he treated them like family and how he went out of his way to be available for them. Has anyone said this about Ellis or Elway?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    The 5280
    Posts
    13,251
    Elway keeps stating that they are in win now mode, heís too proud to admit his mistakes and cal it a rebuild

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    311
    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    Unfortunately the trust, Joe Ellis, Rich Slivka and Mary Kelly will milk their power as long as possible. I’m sure they have good intention, but there is no reason to change the status quo. They are paid well with absolutely no accountability. When you can draw 74,000+ fans to Thursday Night Football while overseeing the demise of a once great franchise, all is good.

    Even when Brittany Bowlen takes a position with the Broncos, the trust and Elway will limit her influence. It will likely be years if not a decade before she takes full control. Only if Ellis stays true to Pat Bowlen will he move to fire Elway. Elway has good will from his legacy and turning things around after the McDaniels fiasco. Ellis will ride the train as long as possible. Meanwhile the Broncos have plummeted to the bottom of the NFL. A couple of wins created a bounce from the bottom of thepower rankings, only to show the true makeup of the team last night.

    In the short run Fangio needs to step up and push for approval to start Lock. If he can’t make the call then he should consider stepping down - plenty of teams need a good DC. There is no plan with Elway. It’s delusional to think a player here, a player there will turn this around. The franchise needs a GM who will move past the success from 2015.
    After last night the owners can kiss the 74,000 number goodbye. You'd have to pay me to sit through an entire game, now.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Lone Tree
    Posts
    2,269
    Quote Originally Posted by welderhead View Post
    After last night the owners can kiss the 74,000 number goodbye. You'd have to pay me to sit through an entire game, now.
    I was there. About 15,000 of those seats went to Chiefs fans. A lot of season ticket holders not doing their part. If you don't want to go, give them to friends who are Broncos fans. So tired of seeing the same people in my section who sell their tickets to the away team.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    10,565
    Quote Originally Posted by mozzerpete View Post
    Why are people blaming Elway with such certainty?

    Does anyone really know Ellis' role?

    The Bowlen family needs to get their act together
    as they are the key to all of this nonsense.
    Well the trust definitely deserves blame too but we can't fire the trust, and outside banning anyone named Shanahan from working here Ellis doesn't get involved in the football decisions.

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