View Poll Results: What "Role" Would You Fix First???

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  • GM

    20 35.71%
  • Coach

    1 1.79%
  • QB

    6 10.71%
  • Oline

    29 51.79%
  • Interior D

    0 0%
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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 58Miller View Post
    Who are you hiring for Elway?
    You do understand that If the team continues under a new GM which you wonít know for 3 years, Ellis will get all the blame.
    A new GM is also going to want full control of the team and would want to bring in his coaches, and players (3 to 5 year rebuild)
    Because if that, I leave Elway as the face and fire Russell, and his replacement ( like Adam Peters from SF) takes over player personal.

    What are you getting for Von, Sanders, and Harris?
    If their is value then I agree trade them, but if Sanders and Harris leave via free agency in 2020 we get compensation picks so giving them up now for a 7th when we can get a better pick the the following season is the way to go.
    Trading Von and not getting value makes zero sense.
    I play GM all the time in my head too, but in reality itís actually a hard job, and you donít see the fruits of ones labor for 3 or 4 years down the line.
    Example the 49ers:
    Season 1: 6-10
    Season 2 : 4-12
    *Season 3: 5-0

    The niners got there Qb through trade didnít land one in the draft. That has put them ahead of most rebuilds.
    The excuse in bold is a long running, lazy argument for keeping Elway. Iíve thoroughly researched potential candidates and there are several qualified people. Youíre in the firm camp of keeping Elway. If youíre actually open to change, research candidates to see whoís out there.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    The excuse in bold is a long running, lazy argument for keeping Elway. I’ve thoroughly researched potential candidates and there are several qualified people. You’re in the firm camp of keeping Elway. If you’re actually open to change, research candidates to see who’s out there.
    Exactly. General Manager candidates are not high profile media people most fans are familiar with. There are plenty of good options out there, and I actually responded to him after he posted the same question in the Smack Forum with a bunch of quality candidates available. He acknowledged it but I guess he still wants to grind that axe because he himself doesn't know any of the candidates. I wouldn't bother wasting your time continuing the argument about the possible individual candidates. There are qualified people out there who a team looking to potential replace their current failing General Manager could turn too, obviously.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    The excuse in bold is a long running, lazy argument for keeping Elway. Iíve thoroughly researched potential candidates and there are several qualified people. Youíre in the firm camp of keeping Elway. If youíre actually open to change, research candidates to see whoís out there.
    My post clearly said I would bring in Adam Peters, and keep Elway as the face of the team. Once Elways contract is up in 2021. I would promote Peters. That allows Elway who was a major part of our SB 50 win and as a player the respect he deserves but also allows him to move on without being fired.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    Exactly. General Manager candidates are not high profile media people most fans are familiar with. There are plenty of good options out there, and I actually responded to him after he posted the same question in the Smack Forum with a bunch of quality candidates available. He acknowledged it but I guess he still wants to grind that axe because he himself doesn't know any of the candidates. I wouldn't bother wasting your time continuing the argument about the possible individual candidates. There are qualified people out there who a team looking to potential replace their current failing General Manager could turn too, obviously.
    The problem has been player personal and thatís why i would fire Russell and bring in Adam Peters, I stated that in my other post.

    If you donít have a replacement and a plan donít call for someoneís job.

    Posters calling for Flaccoís head at least have a replacement in Lock ( he is still on IR) instead of letís cut Flacco and replace him with a better Qb.

    Please have a solution.
    Last edited by 58Miller; 10-19-2019 at 02:05 PM.

  5. #20
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    It's not sexy but this team needs to invest heavily in the offensive line in the 2020 draft.
    Last edited by JW7; 10-19-2019 at 02:24 PM.

  6. #21
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    As far as this season, Iím starting Lock only if James is playing. Since Wilkerson is the swing T I would move him to LT since he has practice at this spot.

    The Vets need to be gutted from this team and thatís including Von. I think the SB vets that are on the team have a mentality that things need to be done a certain way and may not exactly embrace new thinking or methods regardless if they tell you they are on camera. CHJ and Sanders both will prob be the only ones traded at deadline and yes, I would take something less than what we would prob receive in a comp pick because comp picks are not guaranteed based on who you sign in the offseason. I highly doubt you get a first for Von. But thatís what Iíd be fighting for. Maybe a team that will mostly likely be making a push in the playoffs and knows theyíll have a late first. If not, a 2nd and a player or 2nd and other picks.

    Flacco will be released this offseason regardless if Lock stinks it up the remaining of the season. No need to worry about the restructure in his contract. We saved $15m this season and assuming we donít used it we will be carrying it over to next year. Heís dead cap is around $13m which essentially be cancelled out by what you move over.

    Elway needs to step down or go back to original role. We need a new Gm with a new take on things. While this is doubtful because Ellis is prob too much of a wimp to do this.

    Offseason FA needs to be focused on 3 areas. WR, LB, and Secondary. The reason why I called out those three positions was not only because they are needs but because Iím a believer that in the draft you always go after 3 positions early (unless you already have a QB). OL, DL/pass rushers, and QB (no specific order). Who we take first will all depend on Lock. He does well, I say you trade back to gather more picks and get the best OL. He does poorly, you go QB unless you like someone in the follow draft cough Lawerence cough. (Imagine Mahomes and Lawerence rivalry). Youíre not going to fix the oline in one year. I think this year and next year will be key to fixing this. You have 1 G and a RT(possibly). Draft a LT and a C. You will potentially be missing one G if all works out. However, based on our drafting if will take a few years lol.

    This is my wishful fix.
    Last edited by Murph2432; 10-19-2019 at 02:20 PM.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    Exactly. General Manager candidates are not high profile media people most fans are familiar with. There are plenty of good options out there, and I actually responded to him after he posted the same question in the Smack Forum with a bunch of quality candidates available. He acknowledged it but I guess he still wants to grind that axe because he himself doesn't know any of the candidates. I wouldn't bother wasting your time continuing the argument about the possible individual candidates. There are qualified people out there who a team looking to potential replace their current failing General Manager could turn too, obviously.
    I think most people would agree on a few core problems: First, quarterback has been a miss. Elway tried to solve the position through the draft and veterans and it hasnít worked. The offensive line has been a mess for years. Coaching decisions compounded the lack of talent. Itís one thing to make a bad hire, another to stick with Vance Joseph a second season. There are other issues, so only trying to simplify the main ones. Elway is the common denominator underlying the core problems. People will usually admit those problems exist, yet continue defending the guy responsible for those repeated mistakes.
    Last edited by Fantaztic7; 10-19-2019 at 02:40 PM.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    I think most people would agree on a few core problems: First, quarterback has been a miss. Elway tried to solve the position through the draft and veterans (post Manning). The offensive line has been a mess for years. Coaching decisions compounded the lack of talent. Itís one thing to make a bad hire, another to stick with Vance Joseph a second season. There are other issues, so only trying to simplify the main ones. Elway is the common denominator with the main responsibility for football operations. People will usually admit those problems exist, yet continue defending the manager responsible for those repeated mistakes.
    So your ignoring the fact that Elway built the team that won the SB and the winning SB Qb and coach both retired.
    Name a franchise that lost its coach and starting Qb.
    Elway missed on Lynch and VJ but most of the NFL struggle to replace one of those let alone both.

    If Ellis follows your advice and fires Elway, who should he hire?
    And what coaches is he tied too? Scheme etc?
    Also how long do you predict for this guy you want to fix our team?

  9. #24
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    For those of you who want to waste time and energy arguing with this guy who talks smack and tells you to "shut your mouths" unless you put a name to replace Elway as GM, here are some the names gathered by Albert Breer after consulting with his NFL circle:

    Kevin Abrams, assistant GM, Giants: Abrams stepped up as Dave Gettleman has battled health issues, and he’s a capable administrator who could eventually succeed Gettleman. There’s also been scuttlebutt that Tom Coughlin may try to lure Abrams to Jacksonville.

    Mike Borgonzi, director of football operations, Chiefs: Borgonzi is now in the position Chris Ballard once held and works hand-in-hand with GM Brett Veach, with whom he shared a title two years ago working under John Dorsey. Borgonzi could very easily have been named GM in Kansas City, and will eventually get his shot to be one.

    Ed Dodds, assistant GM, Colts: Dodds was quietly considered Seahawks GM John Schneider’s secret weapon for years. And it took someone with Ballard’s institutional knowledge to come in and poach him. Word’s out now. Dodds is not only a top evaluator for the Colts but also helps Ballard run trades.

    Scott Fitterer/Trent Kirchner, co-directors of player personnel, Seahawks: Seattle’s rebound is great news for both Fitterer and Kirchner, who have different strengths but have been entrusted with a lot of responsibility (Fitterer on the college side, Kirchner on the pro side) by Schneider.

    Joe Hortiz, director of college scouting, Ravens: He and Joe Douglas worked in tandem for years, and the Eagles looked at trying to lure Hortiz north before hiring Douglas in 2016. Baltimore has reshaped its defense the last couple years, and Hortiz’s work alongside Ozzie Newsome and Eric DeCosta has been a part of it.

    Will McClay, assistant director of player personnel, Cowboys: This is more a matter of “if” than “when”—as in, “if McClay would show a willingness to leave Dallas, he probably wouldn’t have to worry much about when offers would come.” McClay has coached, scouted and worked in analytics, and has an understanding of how to work side-by-side with ownership.

    George Paton, assistant GM, Vikings: Paton’s now become sort of what Ballard was a couple years ago—a highly respected long-time No. 2 who’s been patient. Which means it’ll take the right team to pry him from Minnesota. Somehow, the Vikings have combined one of the league’s most talented rosters with a very healthy cap situation over the last few years, and Paton’s been in the thick of all of it.

    Albert Breer also mentioned Joe Douglas during this research and, six months later, Douglas was hired by the Jets as their GM.

    Oh, and as this sad situation drags on, keep in mind that Adam Schefter said this month on the radio that Joe Ellis will not fire Elway regardless of the poor results. The reason is simple: everything Elway means to the franchise. In other words, Ellis does not want to be the one who fires the closest thing to a messiah in a religion [ex: see this thread]

    So, as you continue to argue about the losses, and many more losses will come, the most likely outcome is Elway remaining as the GM until his contract expires after the 2021 season. And, unless Beth Bowlen wins her lawsuit, which is unlikely, the Broncos will continue to be run by lawyers until Brittany is ready to take over.

    The most important thing that can happen to the Broncos is a resolution to the ownership situation. A franchise without an owner is not a good thing, obviously, but it's even worse when we're talking about an NFL team being controlled by lawyers. The President of Football Operations / GM, with no accountability due to the lack of ownership, comes second as the one responsible for the front office, QB, o-line, etc.

    Good luck, but I'd not expect any change before the end of the 2021 season and, if Joe Ellis has hindered Elway in any way, it should be no different with a new GM.
    Last edited by -Rod-; 10-19-2019 at 02:55 PM.
    http://forums.denverbroncos.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=349348&dateline=13355  71607

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by 58Miller View Post
    So your ignoring the fact that Elway built the team that won the SB and the winning SB Qb and coach both retired.
    Name a franchise that lost its coach and starting Qb.
    Elway missed on Lynch and VJ but most of the NFL struggle to replace one of those let alone both.

    If Ellis follows your advice and fires Elway, who should he hire?
    And what coaches is he tied too? Scheme etc?
    Also how long do you predict for this guy you want to fix our team?
    How long does a SB buy you? 3,4,5 bad years?

    I think the fact that he refused to go in rebuild mode really has hurt us. He has tried to use bandaids and bargain FA deals to fix our issues after the SB run and has failed miserably for the most part. The way this season is going he will not only be bad this year but I donít see how you fix the amount of holes we have in one year. Not saying it canít but I just donít see it. So imo he has had 4 bad seasons after SB50 and will at least have one more next year and I think thatís being generous. That would get any GM fired unless your name is John Elway and the fact there is no true owner to answer to.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murph2432 View Post
    How long does a SB buy you? 3,4,5 bad years?

    I think the fact that he refused to go in rebuild mode really has hurt us. He has tried to use bandaids and bargain FA deals to fix our issues after the SB run and has failed miserably for the most part. The way this season is going he will not only be bad this year but I donít see how you fix the amount of holes we have in one year. Not saying it canít but I just donít see it. So imo he has had 4 bad seasons after SB50 and will at least have one more next year and I think thatís being generous. That would get any GM fired unless your name is John Elway and the fact there is no true owner to answer to.
    On paper we have had 2 losing seasons, this season will probably be a 3rd out of 9.

    I would let Elway play out his contract, but I would try to lure Adam Peters away from SF for Russell. And if Peters does well replace Elway then when his contract is up.

    Elway is responsible for where we are at and he is also responsible for the first SB win our franchise has had in 15 years.

    What is a SB worh? Sounds like not much bass on many of the posts. Iím guessing i was one of the few on these boards who enjoyed SB 50.

  12. #27
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    Jeez, so many holes in this team. Hard to figure which would be a priority since they all go hand in hand. Never in my 40 years of watching the Broncos have I seen them in this sad state.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Rod- View Post
    For those of you who want to waste time and energy arguing with this guy who talks smack and tells you to "shut your mouths" unless you put a name to replace Elway as GM, here are some the names gathered by Albert Breer after consulting with his NFL circle:

    Kevin Abrams, assistant GM, Giants: Abrams stepped up as Dave Gettleman has battled health issues, and he’s a capable administrator who could eventually succeed Gettleman. There’s also been scuttlebutt that Tom Coughlin may try to lure Abrams to Jacksonville.

    Mike Borgonzi, director of football operations, Chiefs: Borgonzi is now in the position Chris Ballard once held and works hand-in-hand with GM Brett Veach, with whom he shared a title two years ago working under John Dorsey. Borgonzi could very easily have been named GM in Kansas City, and will eventually get his shot to be one.

    Ed Dodds, assistant GM, Colts: Dodds was quietly considered Seahawks GM John Schneider’s secret weapon for years. And it took someone with Ballard’s institutional knowledge to come in and poach him. Word’s out now. Dodds is not only a top evaluator for the Colts but also helps Ballard run trades.

    Scott Fitterer/Trent Kirchner, co-directors of player personnel, Seahawks: Seattle’s rebound is great news for both Fitterer and Kirchner, who have different strengths but have been entrusted with a lot of responsibility (Fitterer on the college side, Kirchner on the pro side) by Schneider.

    Joe Hortiz, director of college scouting, Ravens: He and Joe Douglas worked in tandem for years, and the Eagles looked at trying to lure Hortiz north before hiring Douglas in 2016. Baltimore has reshaped its defense the last couple years, and Hortiz’s work alongside Ozzie Newsome and Eric DeCosta has been a part of it.

    Will McClay, assistant director of player personnel, Cowboys: This is more a matter of “if” than “when”—as in, “if McClay would show a willingness to leave Dallas, he probably wouldn’t have to worry much about when offers would come.” McClay has coached, scouted and worked in analytics, and has an understanding of how to work side-by-side with ownership.

    George Paton, assistant GM, Vikings: Paton’s now become sort of what Ballard was a couple years ago—a highly respected long-time No. 2 who’s been patient. Which means it’ll take the right team to pry him from Minnesota. Somehow, the Vikings have combined one of the league’s most talented rosters with a very healthy cap situation over the last few years, and Paton’s been in the thick of all of it.

    Albert Breer also mentioned Joe Douglas during this research and, six months later, Douglas was hired by the Jets as their GM.

    Oh, and as this sad situation drags on, keep in mind that Adam Schefter said this month on the radio that Joe Ellis will not fire Elway regardless of the poor results. The reason is simple: everything Elway means to the franchise. In other words, Ellis does not want to be the one who fires the closest thing to a messiah in a religion [ex: see this thread]

    So, as you continue to argue about the losses, and many more losses will come, the most likely outcome is Elway remaining as the GM until his contract expires after the 2021 season. And, unless Beth Bowlen wins her lawsuit, which is unlikely, the Broncos will continue to be run by lawyers until Brittany is ready to take over.

    The most important thing that can happen to the Broncos is a resolution to the ownership situation. A franchise without an owner is not a good thing, obviously, but it's even worse when we're talking about an NFL team being controlled by lawyers. The President of Football Operations / GM, with no accountability due to the lack of ownership, comes second as the one responsible for the front office, QB, o-line, etc.

    Good luck, but I'd not expect any change before the end of the 2021 season and, if Joe Ellis has hindered Elway in any way, it should be no different with a new GM.
    I agree the ownership situation is the start of all of this getting fixed, and that will take awhile with the plan they have laid out.

    I appreciate your list but Iím as big of a bronco fan as anybody in here and I like hearing solutions to our problems. I donít appreciate fantasies about unnamed GMs who the other 31 teams havenít hired but somehow would fix our team.

    Another thing Iím reading but donít understand is how Drew Lock who is in IR and threw 1 TD and 1 pick vs backups would have us playing better . Why? Because he hasnít played and isnít healthy.

    Oh and this one is awesome, Elway let Wade walk!!!!!! Wades defense allowed 55 pts vs Jamie Winston.

    I hate where our team is at, but Iím not gonna listen to non sense. The non sense claims ainít helping anything.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taos_Broncomaniac View Post
    It starts with the O-line, Mahomes and Wilson wouldn't survive behind that group.

    They basically escort Defenders to the QB or the ball carrier.

    We are not in a good place right now...
    I agree. It starts with the O-line. Everyone knows if the QB isn't protected bad things will always happen that effects the entire team on both sides of the ball. Thursday nights game against KC proved it.

    The Broncos are like a car that drove off a cliff and sustained severe damage from end to end. An ugly mess...but with some high quality mechanics working with diligence and sound intelligence to identify root cause will bring the wreck back to life. Repair and/or replace all vital parts as necessary to get the Orange and Blue machine back on the road. Lots of blood, sweat and tears...it can be done.

    The Denver Broncos are still a quality franchise. WE WILL REBOUND!
    Utah Bronco Freak

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by 58Miller View Post
    On paper we have had 2 losing seasons, this season will probably be a 3rd out of 9.

    I would let Elway play out his contract, but I would try to lure Adam Peters away from SF for Russell. And if Peters does well replace Elway then when his contract is up.

    Elway is responsible for where we are at and he is also responsible for the first SB win our franchise has had in 15 years.

    What is a SB worh? Sounds like not much bass on many of the posts. Iím guessing i was one of the few on these boards who enjoyed SB 50.
    Youíre right he is responsible for where we are at yet there is no accountability for it. He has no one to answer to and thatís a problem. While he is responsible for the franchise winning their first SB in 15 years he is also responsible for the longest consecutive losing seasons this franchise has had under Bowlen and that streak will continue farther after this year. Itís a what have you done for me lately league and lately we have gone through some of the most embarrassing games/seasons this franchise has gone through. I think 4 years should be plenty of time to start turning things around after losing Manning. Iím not saying it has to be a complete turnaround. I wouldnít even mind being bad in the 4th year if I at least saw some improvement or some signs for a bright future but thatís not the case.

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