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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronx_2003 View Post
    I like Henry, and KA is a good number 2 receiver but there is not a lot else that will scare a D and it seems that way every year. Gordon coming back helps but I just don't see the targets.

    I would argue that at the start of the season the Broncos with - Lindsay, Sanders, Sutton, and Fant - had more talent on offense (at skill positions) then the Chargers and we all know that our offense is pretty bad.
    hahahaha! you're joking, right? keenan allen #2? the probowler? mike Williams who had 10 TD's last season? if you made that argument at the beginning of the season you would have been laughed at, unless you're talking to other broncos fans.

    not to mention melvin gordon and AA who are both good players and must be accounted for. the chargers didn't even have henry last year and were a poternt offense but their pass protection was on point and rivers was better.

    the broncos have two players on their offense that can be considered comparable to any of those guys i listed......2. kennan allen > sutton, henry >>>>>>>fant, gordon/AA>>lindsay/freeman, mike Williams>whoever your #2 is now

    the defense in denver is much more comparable to the chargers but i would argue with derwin james the chargers definitely have a better secondary. the front 7 is up for debate as both our D lines have been beat up but denver's overall front 7 may be slightly better if both are healthy.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by arapaho View Post
    Jason lacanfora

    Lmao!! The guy who’s lost all his major Tv jobs

    That guy
    this coming from the dude that tried to discredit PFF lol

    it may or may not be true but is it really that hard to believe at this point?

    by the way, nice choke today, reminded me of the chargers circa mike mccoy

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by atwaterandstir View Post
    People have been held accountable we have gone through coaches, QBs, etc. It's not ideal but it happens with every franchise. What doesn't happen with every franchise is winning SBs. Our fan base holds our team to higher standards and the main reason for that is John Elway.

    Right now he is his worst enemy. He created the expectations of success and hes fallen short the past few years. I for one think we have some nice pieces in place so I expect the storyline to change soon.
    not all broncos fans have this view point, i'm going to CP you for this because i think that's how fans of winning franchises should be. you are right, all franchises go through it and Denver really hasn't had to until now. those franchises usually make changes to get out of it but it makes me happy to think that the broncos will not because of who their GM is.

    not sure why you think the storyline will change but i guess maybe another peyton manning could come along and save him from himself, who knows?

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam_Z View Post
    Get this I heard that Jason La Conforas source is Joe Flacco, also heard that when we all thought Joe Flacco was criticizing Scangarello, he was actually criticizing Fangio for interfering and overruling offensive play calling.

    Call Flacco bitter all you want but at least he’s attempting to testify to the truth.

    Also heard there is been a similar disconnect between Mike Manchak and Rich Scangarello.

    Completely two different styles, Manchak is the best at what he does in a power blocking scheme. however he’s forced to run a zone blocking scheme and is very dissatisfied in Denver right now.
    No offense, but I kinda warned you guys this summer that Fangio the D-coordinator wasn't necessarily going to be a good head coach....
    Super Bowl Wins: Brady - 6 Elway - 2 Manning - 2 (played well in none) Rivers - 0

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronx_2003 View Post
    I like Henry, and KA is a good number 2 receiver but there is not a lot else that will scare a D and it seems that way every year. Gordon coming back helps but I just don't see the targets.

    I would argue that at the start of the season the Broncos with - Lindsay, Sanders, Sutton, and Fant - had more talent on offense (at skill positions) then the Chargers and we all know that our offense is pretty bad.
    THey have good weapons, just an average QB...
    Super Bowl Wins: Brady - 6 Elway - 2 Manning - 2 (played well in none) Rivers - 0

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by baphamet View Post

    not sure why you think the storyline will change but i guess maybe another peyton manning could come along and save him from himself, who knows?
    Because right now players like Lynch, and Bolles and the failures of Keenum and Flacco come to the front of people's minds.......lost in that is the fact is that we have some nice young pieces in place, a salary cap that is in good shape, and a lot of draft capital upcoming.

    Lock is unproven but he is on the roster and under contract. Callahan and James will be significant upgrades at their positions and they are under contract already.

    If Lock can show some real promise, I would argue we are in much better shape and farther ahead than other "rebuilding" teams.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by baphamet View Post
    hahahaha! you're joking, right? keenan allen #2? the probowler? mike Williams who had 10 TD's last season? if you made that argument at the beginning of the season you would have been laughed at, unless you're talking to other broncos fans.

    not to mention melvin gordon and AA who are both good players and must be accounted for. the chargers didn't even have henry last year and were a poternt offense but their pass protection was on point and rivers was better.

    the broncos have two players on their offense that can be considered comparable to any of those guys i listed......2. kennan allen > sutton, henry >>>>>>>fant, gordon/AA>>lindsay/freeman, mike Williams>whoever your #2 is now

    the defense in denver is much more comparable to the chargers but i would argue with derwin james the chargers definitely have a better secondary. the front 7 is up for debate as both our D lines have been beat up but denver's overall front 7 may be slightly better if both are healthy.
    Denver easily have the better D. Did you even get a TD against it at home ? Or a FG ?

    KA is a good route runner and has good hands but he scares no one, there is no way he is a number one receiver in the mould of a Jones, Evans, Sanders, M Thomas, Jeffrey, etc..........

    I would argue that Sutton is a better receiver at this point. Even with a poor set of QB's he is breaking out and has more yards and TD's this season then Allen, KA with a pro bowl QB only has 2 hundred yard games this year and 3 TD's, how is that a number one receiver ?

    I would easily take Lindsay over Gordon at this point.

    Henry is ahead of Fant but Fant has speed and is dangerous, he would be a real weapon in the mould of a Julius Thomas with a proper QB.

    What Denver lack now Sanders has gone is another starting receiver, but there is no way I would swap the young talent on Denvers offense with the Chargers.

    Overall Denver has a better roster, and we already beat you, what we lack is a proper QB.

  8. #23
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    I don't care if he's unpleasant. What do you want him to be Kitchens from Cleveland? He's not the players best friend. He's the Head Coach. And of any year this-Year One ........... to take command ~he better be the boss
    Last edited by dizzolve; 11-17-2019 at 06:36 PM.
    Red 98

    The early bird may get the worm, but the 2nd mouse gets the cheese

  9. #24
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    I think he's doing a lot of good things. We are playing every opponent tough and have had some tricky opponents this season. We have lost 4 games right at the end which shows we are close but not quite good enough at the moment.

    With the young players and the lack of a true QB I think Fangio has shown the future is bright but we obviously need to find that QB somehow.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by dizzolve View Post
    I don't care if he's unpleasant. What do you want him to be Kitchens from Cleveland? He's not the players best friend. He's the Head Coach. And of any year this-Year One ........... to take command ~he better be the boss
    This is spot on.

  11. #26
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    REPORT IS REFUTED BY THE PLAYERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CLOSE THREAD!!!!!


    https://www.si.com/nfl/broncos/news/...-calls-it-b-s/

    Just hours before the Denver Broncos kicked off in Minneapolis, CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora published what the network likely expected to be a bombshell report. La Canfora, citing multiple sources, reported that first-year head coach Vic Fangio is "struggling to connect with players and coaches" in Denver.

    The report cast Fangio as a domineering meddler of a head coach, and one oblivious to the feelings and attitude of his players and coaches. Fast forward to kickoff, and the Broncos got out quickly to a commanding 20-0 lead, which in itself was a seeming refutation of the La Canfora report.

    The Broncos would go onto squander their triple-score lead, collapsing in the second half and ultimately falling to the Minnesota Vikings 27-23. In the wake of such a soul-debilitating loss, the opportunity for Fangio's players to sound off in frustration and confirm somehow the veracity of La Canfora's report was rife.

    But that's not what happened.

    Every Broncos player who spoke on record on the issue stood up and supported his head coach. The Broncos closed ranks around their beleaguered coach and four-time Pro Bowl cornerback Chris Harris, Jr. was the epitome of that.

    "That report is bullsh*t," Harris told KOA's Brandon Krisztal. "Nobody has any issues with Fangio."

    Multiple Broncos echoed Harris' support for Fangio, including team leaders Dalton Risner and Von Miller — on the record. The truth is, Fangio was dealt a bad hand as a first-year head coach.

    It's not often that a head coach can overcome a lack of quarterback continuity in year one and go onto achieve anything of note. The Joe Flacco experiment was a flop and the Broncos' last two games have featured a quarterback in Brandon Allen literally making the first two starts of his NFL career.

    Throw in a first-time offensive play-caller in Rich Scangarello, a complex defensive scheme that takes time for players to grasp and a defeated locker room culture, and Fangio's first-year path has been fraught with one obstacle after another.

    Despite Sunday's embarrassing loss, the general feeling in the Mile High City is that Fangio has the Broncos on the right path. What Fangio needs is a bonafide franchise quarterback and time.

    Only GM John Elway can deliver either.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronx_2003 View Post
    Denver easily have the better D. Did you even get a TD against it at home ? Or a FG ?

    KA is a good route runner and has good hands but he scares no one, there is no way he is a number one receiver in the mould of a Jones, Evans, Sanders, M Thomas, Jeffrey, etc..........

    I would argue that Sutton is a better receiver at this point. Even with a poor set of QB's he is breaking out and has more yards and TD's this season then Allen, KA with a pro bowl QB only has 2 hundred yard games this year and 3 TD's, how is that a number one receiver ?

    I would easily take Lindsay over Gordon at this point.

    Henry is ahead of Fant but Fant has speed and is dangerous, he would be a real weapon in the mould of a Julius Thomas with a proper QB.

    What Denver lack now Sanders has gone is another starting receiver, but there is no way I would swap the young talent on Denvers offense with the Chargers.

    Overall Denver has a better roster, and we already beat you, what we lack is a proper QB.
    allen scares nobody yet he's constantly double teamed because hes un-guardable one on one. sutton has broken out and is good but he still isn't as good as keenan, he doesn't take over games like keenan has his entire career. who had better production last season. this has been an "off season" for the offense as a whole, lots to do with pass protection and rivers not playing great.

    nobody unbiased would agree with you that sutton is better than keenan allen at this point. sutton also has more opportunity for production because the rest of the weapons in the passing game are virtually non existent.

    gordon and AA are better than lindsay and freeman, lindsay is a pretty good runner but not so much in the passing game. AA has to be the best pass catching back in the league right now (better than even CM in the passing game) and he can run it well too. gordon has sucked coming out of the gate but a lot of that is due to holding out, he's gotten better as time has gone on and he has proven to be a very good back. you are ignoring all these guys total career and just going by what has happened this year alone to formulate your opinion because it suits your argument.

    i mean i could argue that joey bosa is better than von miller using the same reasoning but that would be ignorant to ignore how good he has been over the years.

    henry vs fant isn't even a debate right now. speed doesn't matter if you simply cannot make the plays. Henry is easily a top 5 ELITE TE in the game when healthy.

    lets rehash, keenan allen, hunter henry, mike williams, AA, and even melvin gordon are all legit threats in the passing game.

    denver has sutton as their only legit threat in their passing game right now

    gordon and AA are better than lindsay and freeman but lindsay is definitely a threat in the running game.

    somehow considering all that i'm supposed to believe that Denver has more talent on offense?

    hey, you can believe whatever you want to i suppose, no matter how homer it is. pretty funny though when you think about it.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by baphamet View Post
    allen scares nobody yet he's constantly double teamed because hes un-guardable one on one. sutton has broken out and is good but he still isn't as good as keenan, he doesn't take over games like keenan has his entire career. who had better production last season. this has been an "off season" for the offense as a whole, lots to do with pass protection and rivers not playing great.

    nobody unbiased would agree with you that sutton is better than keenan allen at this point. sutton also has more opportunity for production because the rest of the weapons in the passing game are virtually non existent.

    gordon and AA are better than lindsay and freeman, lindsay is a pretty good runner but not so much in the passing game. AA has to be the best pass catching back in the league right now (better than even CM in the passing game) and he can run it well too. gordon has sucked coming out of the gate but a lot of that is due to holding out, he's gotten better as time has gone on and he has proven to be a very good back. you are ignoring all these guys total career and just going by what has happened this year alone to formulate your opinion because it suits your argument.

    i mean i could argue that joey bosa is better than von miller using the same reasoning but that would be ignorant to ignore how good he has been over the years.

    henry vs fant isn't even a debate right now. speed doesn't matter if you simply cannot make the plays. Henry is easily a top 5 ELITE TE in the game when healthy.

    lets rehash, keenan allen, hunter henry, mike williams, AA, and even melvin gordon are all legit threats in the passing game.

    denver has sutton as their only legit threat in their passing game right now

    gordon and AA are better than lindsay and freeman but lindsay is definitely a threat in the running game.

    somehow considering all that i'm supposed to believe that Denver has more talent on offense?

    hey, you can believe whatever you want to i suppose, no matter how homer it is. pretty funny though when you think about it.

    Lmao, The RBs used more in the passing game doesn’t mean their better... in this case it means they on a team where the check down, rb screen and safety valve pass, and short pass is and has always been rivers biggest contributor to his passing numbers

    He struggles when the short game isn’t used

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