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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by montee2ball View Post
    Correct me if I’m wrong, Schurmur’s offense rarely use a fullback and run a lot of sets through the shot gun.
    Yes and not good news for Andy Janovich. However Denver can always attempt to convert him to a power running back.

  2. #92
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    Shurmur is likely a good hire with respect to experience and how several quarterbacks performed with his offense. Ultimately, I’ll have to see positive results to say he’s a good hire.

    It’s unfortunate things didn’t pan out for Scangarello and the Broncos. I would think he’ll bounce back and find success in a new role. For an inexperienced OC it was an uphill climb from the jump with Flacco. Best of luck to Scangarello.

  3. #93
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    Here is an article that they ran before he went to the Giants:

    https://www.giants.com/news/anatomy-...fense-20282257

    Also I found this summary..

    Shurmur's roots are in Andy Reid's West Coast offense, which features spread concepts. Shurmur has also taken concepts from other stops, including Chip Kelly's up-tempo attack and Norv Turner's vertical passing game.

    All of those influences have produced an offense that could best be described as a "power spread." The Vikings used three-wide receiver sets 56 percent of the time this season, which is in line with the league average for the most common personnel grouping. But the Vikings had the second most rushing attempts and their 53:47 pass-to-run ratio was the fourth-lowest in the league this season. So even if Shurmur spread the field, he still wants to pound the ball on the ground.

    Get ready to hear a lot about "run-pass options," as the quarterback in Shurmur's offense typically has the option to call a run or a pass at the line based on the look from the defense. The quarterback will often be called upon to get the ball out quickly, but Shurmur incorporates downfield shots. Vikings quarterback Case Keenum ran play-action on 28.7 percent of his passes, according to Pro Football Focus.
    http://s7.postimg.org/hjr8fcmaz/EM2.jpg

    Adopted Bronco: Andy Janovich

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by EddieMac View Post
    Here is an article that they ran before he went to the Giants:

    https://www.giants.com/news/anatomy-...fense-20282257

    Also I found this summary..

    Shurmur's roots are in Andy Reid's West Coast offense, which features spread concepts. Shurmur has also taken concepts from other stops, including Chip Kelly's up-tempo attack and Norv Turner's vertical passing game.

    All of those influences have produced an offense that could best be described as a "power spread." The Vikings used three-wide receiver sets 56 percent of the time this season, which is in line with the league average for the most common personnel grouping. But the Vikings had the second most rushing attempts and their 53:47 pass-to-run ratio was the fourth-lowest in the league this season. So even if Shurmur spread the field, he still wants to pound the ball on the ground.

    Get ready to hear a lot about "run-pass options," as the quarterback in Shurmur's offense typically has the option to call a run or a pass at the line based on the look from the defense. The quarterback will often be called upon to get the ball out quickly, but Shurmur incorporates downfield shots. Vikings quarterback Case Keenum ran play-action on 28.7 percent of his passes, according to Pro Football Focus.
    This could be promising.

  5. #95
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    Sure Thing Shurmur: The Broncos make a wise hire

    Sure Thing Shurmur: The Broncos make a wise hire
    By Doug Ottewill - January 13, 2020

    Forget for a moment continuity.

    Forget dysfunction and culpability.

    Forget Rich Scangarello, who won’t really be missed, and who might very well one day become an excellent offensive coordinator.

    Forget watching paint dry Sunday after Denver Sunday.

    Pat Shurmur is the right move.

    Whether Scangarello – leader of the worst, most unwatchable offense in Broncos history – is a scapegoat or not, whether he got a raw deal or not, the hiring of Shurmur in his place serves as an upgrade. Despite the fact that Shurmur will be the fifth offensive coordinator in Denver in five years, it’s still the right move. Before Drew Lock, everyone in Denver wanted the Broncos to hand Scangarello a pink slip. But when Lock came in, the Broncos offensive coordinator was practically handed new life. Even head coach Vic Fangio said that his staff would likely be retained.

    But that wasn’t the case. And that’s okay.

    Scangarello, who had some very real excuses – three quarterbacks in one season, two of which had never started an NFL game, a terrible offensive line – wasn’t good. He was conservative and, at times, seemed to have very little feel for situational football. The Broncos offense was 28th in the league in both points and yards; they were 30th in 3rd down efficiency. They scored 16 points or fewer in nine games. Regardless of excuses, few coordinators would be retained with such results.

    Shurmur, as it turns out, didn’t work out as the Giants head coach. But his track record as an offensive coordinator – with the Rams, Eagles and Vikings – is on par with Fangio’s work as a defensive coordinator. His work with the development and guidance of several quarterbacks – Donovan McNabb, Sam Bradford, Nick Foles, and even Case Keenum (who’s best season occurred alongside Shurmur) – also speaks for itself. The fact that he’s scouted and spoken very highly of Drew Lock, is encouraging, too.

    When one simply looks at the facts – and forgets the finger pointing and somewhat bizarre situations surrounding both Scangarello and Shurmur – this is a switch that makes sense in Denver.

    Besides, if the firing of Scangarello and hiring of Shurmur says one thing about the Broncos, it’s that they’re becoming more willing to own a mistake sooner. That might be a subtle notation, one that won’t show up in any sort of stat or ranking, but it shouldn’t be overlooked. For years now, the man pushing the buttons in Denver – ehem, that would be John Elway – has seemingly been reluctant to pull the ripcord on blunders. There are many reasons a franchise has three consecutive losing seasons, but a tendency to ride lame horses for far too long is certainly one of them in Denver.

    Every GM in the NFL misses here and there. Elway is no different in that respect. His last two drafts have been excellent. Before that, they’ve been littered with mistakes. His free agency signings are a mixed bag, as are his coaching hires. But it’s how long those errors have been given to develop, improve or mature is where the bigger mistake has been made in some instances.

    Vance Joseph was given a year more than he should have. It took too long to sit down Adam Gotsis and bring in Mike Purcell, too many snaps to realize that Josey Jewell wasn’t a starting middle linebacker and that Alexander Johnson was. Both Drew Lock and Brandon Allen, turns out, were better than Joe Flacco (if Flacco hadn’t been hurt, would we have ever found out?).

    The list goes on, and whether it’s Elway or Fangio ultimately deciding to make a switch, one thing is for sure: In retrospect, many changes should have happened sooner than they did.

    Hiring Shurmur feels like a reversal of that trend. It’s undeniable that offense was a point of weakness for the Broncos in 2019 (arguably one of the biggest understatements ever written), so addressing the problem immediately should be commended.

    And the good news for Shurmur, is that the Broncos offense simply cannot be any worse. The only place to go is up.

    With a capable, gunslinger quarterback at his disposal, Pat Shurmur is the right man to put the O back in BroncOS.

    from: https://milehighsports.com/sure-thin...e-a-wise-hire/
    Superbowl 50 MVP Von Miller on February 7th, 2016

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by EddieMac View Post
    Here is an article that they ran before he went to the Giants:

    https://www.giants.com/news/anatomy-...fense-20282257

    Also I found this summary..

    Shurmur's roots are in Andy Reid's West Coast offense, which features spread concepts. Shurmur has also taken concepts from other stops, including Chip Kelly's up-tempo attack and Norv Turner's vertical passing game.

    All of those influences have produced an offense that could best be described as a "power spread." The Vikings used three-wide receiver sets 56 percent of the time this season, which is in line with the league average for the most common personnel grouping. But the Vikings had the second most rushing attempts and their 53:47 pass-to-run ratio was the fourth-lowest in the league this season. So even if Shurmur spread the field, he still wants to pound the ball on the ground.

    Get ready to hear a lot about "run-pass options," as the quarterback in Shurmur's offense typically has the option to call a run or a pass at the line based on the look from the defense. The quarterback will often be called upon to get the ball out quickly, but Shurmur incorporates downfield shots. Vikings quarterback Case Keenum ran play-action on 28.7 percent of his passes, according to Pro Football Focus.
    With the Andy Reid concepts / influences, give me Sutton and Fant, draft Ruggs and Reagor to match Tyreek Hill, Mercole Hardman and Kelce. We have the makings of a track meet. Add Lindsay (please work with McCaffrey this offseason on your receiving skills) who knows what this offense is capable of.

  7. #97
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    1- I think this is bad news for Drew Lock's development. Honestly, the first thing I thought of when I heard they fired Scangs was, "Oh... they must not be as high on Lock as we thought."

    2- Furthermore, hiring an OC that is probably going to get another HC job in a year or 2, makes it even HARDER for Lock. Consistency is what has been killing this organization. (Or maybe he finally decides to go the Wade Phillips route and remain an OC for the rest of his career, as he's failed miserably as a HC 19-46 record)



    Additional info: We've probably seen the last of Andy Janovich, unfortunately.
    Last edited by Joshua2585; 01-13-2020 at 10:48 AM.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by montee2ball View Post
    Correct me if I’m wrong, Schurmur’s offense rarely use a fullback and run a lot of sets through the shot gun.
    No, you are correct. Most recent that I recall, the Giants had Elijhaa Penny on the roster but never really used him as a FB. Considering liking to run more spread and/or 3 WR personnel sets, it's hard to see where Jano might fit in his scheme. Branching off Reid's coaching tree might suggest there is a place for Jano as Reid utilized a FB in his offense. Maybe it's just a preference. With the Rams as OC, Shurmur has Mike Karney at FB. With the Browns he had Owen Marecic at FB blocking for Hillis.

    I'm kind of warming up to this signing. My initial reaction was with the exception of John Harbaugh, who's done ok, Reid's coaching tree leaves (see what I did there ) a lot to be desired - but Shurmur's time as a position coach, specifically a QB coach, and as an OC is pretty impressive given the talent he had to work with at QB.

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua2585 View Post
    1- I think this is bad news for Drew Lock's development. Honestly, the first thing I thought of when I heard they fired Scangs was, "Oh... they must not be as high on Lock as we thought."

    2- Furthermore, hiring an OC that is probably going to get another HC job in a year or 2, makes it even HARDER for Lock. Consistency is what has been killing this organization. (Or maybe he finally decides to go the Wade Phillips route and remain an OC for the rest of his career, as he's failed miserably as a HC 19-46 record)
    Disagree.

    There is a fair amount of turnover at OC in the league. Good OC's come in to demand as teams are looking for coaches and so any that stand out are prime candidates to get offers. Bad OC's get fired. Only 3 OC's have been with their team for more than one year (I am actually shocked by this stat)


  10. #100
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    All of us to include myself were pounding on our keyboard for Rich to fired for is ineptness as the OC. Rich could not call a game to save his job. When the Running game was Super Strong in a Game he would just stop using it and start passing for no explained reason lol. How about when Rich would try and force feed a certain player the entire game when that player was not the answer at that moment in time and yes I am talking about force feeding Noah Fant in a Few games and trying to force feed D. Hamilton. Rich's first down running plays are now in the Past and I for one am Totally Happy with the Hire of Pat.

  11. #101
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    Not super concerned with a smaller role for Janovich. He helps our running game quite a bit when he's out there. Only problem is he usually misses half the year injured, so its not a huge piece we'll be missing.

    Sounds like Shurmur likes running 3 WR sets. What I am concerned with is who is our #3 receiver? For that matter, who is our #2 receiver? Hopefully we can draft one of the top guys in this years draft, but we are seriously thin at wide out.

    If Shurmur wants to run 3 receiver sets, we have some upgrading to do at the position. Just Sutton isn't gonna cut it. Hamilton looked like he was starting to progress at the end of the year, but I'm not yet sold that he is ready to stop dropping balls more than Demaryius.

    I'd like to see what Juwann Winfree has but the team didn't seem very interested in making him active on game day. Have to believe they aren't sold on him having NFL talent.

    I like what Shurmur brings, but we still need a lot more talent on his side of the ball before we're a serious threat to KC and the rest of the AFC.
    Last edited by Megalodon30; 01-13-2020 at 12:47 PM.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon30 View Post
    Not super concerned with a smaller role for Janovich. He helped our running game quote a bit when he's out there. Only problem is he usually misses half the year injured, so its not a huge piece we'll be missing.

    Sounds like Shurmur likes running 3 WR sets. What I am concerned with is who is our #3 receiver? For that matter, who is our #2 receiver? Hopefully we can draft one of the top guys in this years draft, but we are seriously thin at wide out.

    If Shurmur wants to run 3 receiver sets, we have some upgrading to do at the position. Just Sutton isn't gonna cut it. Hamilton looked like he was starting to progress at the end of the year, but I'm not yet sold that he is ready to stop dropping balls more than Demaryius.

    I'd like to see what Juwann Winfree has but the team didn't seem very interested in making him active on game day. Have to believe they aren't sold on him having NFL talent.

    I like what Shurmur brings, but we still need a lot more talent on his side of the ball before we're a serious threat to KC and the rest of the AFC.
    That's right. The mock drafters are hard at it, and a number of them are projecting WRs as high as the first round. If Shurmur uses 11 personnel formations as much as expected, some upgrades to the receiver group would seem in order.
    "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by samparnell View Post
    That's right. The mock drafters are hard at it, and a number of them are projecting WRs as high as the first round. If Shurmur uses 11 personnel formations as much as expected, some upgrades to the receiver group would seem in order.
    Exactly. Speed, speed and more speed. It was nice to see Fant going for 75 yards to the house and Sutton for 45 yards. We need someone over the top. Hamilton, Winfred and Patrick are all complementary WRs and won’t strike fear to any defense. In comes Ruggs or Lamb or Jeudy or Reagor into the mix and opposing secondaries will have to pick their own poison.

  14. #104
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    Time will tell if this is a good move. Although Lock will be changing systems, I think it's easy to argue that the Shurmur offense fits him much better than the Scangarello offense. A lot more shotgun as opposed to under center. More sets with 3 WR instead of 2. It will look a lot more like the offense he ran in college. I have to think this move was done with Lock in mind.

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by JW7 View Post
    Time will tell if this is a good move. Although Lock will be changing systems, I think it's easy to argue that the Shurmur offense fits him much better than the Scangarello offense. A lot more shotgun as opposed to under center. More sets with 3 WR instead of 2. It will look a lot more like the offense he ran in college. I have to think this move was done with Lock in mind.

    Totally Agree 100%.

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