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Thread: Lindsay.

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    Thanks for the explanation. If Elway makes Lindsay an offer after the draft, I would think it would be in his best interest to accept. I guess Lindsay could test the market but as you said it seems unlikely a team would give up a high draft pick. Maybe if the tender was a lower pick, but why would Elway give up the leverage? If a team happened to give up a good pick, it would be a good deal for the Broncos. The challenge for Lindsay (running backs in general), is the short career. Beyond 3-4 seasons it’s unusual to see guys continue playing at a high level. If Lindsay happens to have a breakout year with another 1000 yards plus a sharp increase in receiving yards, maybe he’ll be in a better position - but that’s unlikely unless Gordon is injured.
    Yeah, and even then, I still don't see a team giving up a high round pick for him, along with the contract. The only time it has happened in recent history was Gillislee when he went from the Bills to the Pats, and he got peanuts and was tendered at his original round, it isn't comparable at all. I also think if Elway offered him anything he should accept it. Although it would be hard for the ego to accept anything less than 8 million per year when that is what Gordon is getting. If Lindsay wants more than that though, I am just sitting for now and letting the situation play out.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acedude View Post
    You own his jersey, yet you can't spell his name. Yeesh. It's not like his name is Houshmonawazadeh, it's only SEVEN letters. Pet peeve of mine, felt good to get it off my chest, thanks for reading . . . . .
    I feel your pain on this one.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    Yeah, and even then, I still don't see a team giving up a high round pick for him, along with the contract. The only time it has happened in recent history was Gillislee when he went from the Bills to the Pats, and he got peanuts and was tendered at his original round, it isn't comparable at all. I also think if Elway offered him anything he should accept it. Although it would be hard for the ego to accept anything less than 8 million per year when that is what Gordon is getting. If Lindsay wants more than that though, I am just sitting for now and letting the situation play out.
    It might be hard to accept, then again it would be a lot more than what heís making now. Listening to his interview with Klis, Lindsay has a major chip on his shoulder. It wouldnít surprise me to see him outplay Gordon when itís all said and done.

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
    If Iím understanding this correctly, if the Broncos tender Lindsay after this season and donít attach additional compensation, heís essentially a free agent? In other words he can accept a better offer from another team at that point?
    Yes. Three options: First round tender (not happening), second round tender (most likely), original round tender.

    If they give him an original round tender then he's essentially a free agent, the Broncos just retain the right to match any contract offer he gets.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    Yes. Three options: First round tender (not happening), second round tender (most likely), original round tender.

    If they give him an original round tender then he's essentially a free agent, the Broncos just retain the right to match any contract offer he gets.
    Thanks for the explanation. If the Broncos have the cap space, my sense is that Elway will make him a decent offer before the season starts.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    Not sure I see that here. If the ultimate goal is a bigger contract, then the easiest way to get that is by playing this year out, assuming he doesn't get one after the draft. Finish year 3 and you either get an RFA tender at several million per year, or you become a free agent and get a bigger contract.

    I consider an original round tender here the same as being a free agent, because with no compensation attached, you're free to shop yourself and teams are more likely to give you a contract that won't be matched.
    Yeah yeah, don't get me wrong, Lindsay is never skipping camp. Someone somewhere will at some point, but not Lindsay.
    All it takes to win is doing whatever it takes to win: COMMITMENT

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    Defying the league norms ? Yeah, technically, for an undrafted free agent player, but that is novel story line which no NFL team is going to care about. Obviously Lindsay is producing quality statistics, and he is comparable with other good running backs in the league, but he isn't doing anything dramatically crazy which would allow him to come to the bargaining table and say look, "I am out producing other backs, I am different to X, Y, and Z".

    Well yes, if Lindsay is going to think that way in a business situation, he is in fact an idiot. And if he approaches negotations in that way, then he needs some better advice. Again though, this is fan fiction people are thinking up in their heads. There is no evidence of any actions leading to any of this, any evidence of these situations brewing, it is 100% fan fiction at this point. And, if it leads to anything like a rare few think, then the Broncos sit pretty with how in control of the situation they are. Even more in control then first thought after the facts Butler provided about your theory of holding out.



    Kind of, but the Broncos still have all the control. Lindsay would be free to negotiate with another team and agree to a offer sheet, but that team would have to give up whatever pick Lindsay was tendered at. So, Lindsay would be tendered at a first or second round level, meaning the team would have to give up a contract, plus give up a draft pick. The Broncos would then also have the right to match the contract anyway, so as the "restricted free agent" label suggests, Lindsay is restricted on what he can do.

    Say the Broncos don't want to match the offer, then yeah, Lindsay leaves and we get a high round draft pick. My thinking is that no team would be willing to give up a contract and a high round pick for a running back, so I think that is why Lindsay best play out this season and hope for an extension from the Broncos. In reality, the Broncos could say to Lindsay, test the restricted free agent market, and when no one offers anything, they just make Lindsay sign the tender, and have him for another year. Then he would become unrestricted if Denver didn't slap a franchise tag on him, which I don't think you use that on a player of Lindsays calibar and position.
    What are you talking about, specifically? What is fan fiction? Lindsay's reaction to the Broncos not drafting him? Him saying "F the Broncos"? Him wanting a new contract? No man, he has admitted all of this. He's quoted as saying those things. It's not fan fiction, it's what happened. He ONLY chose the Broncos because his mother and his agent talked him into it. Even his siblings were telling him not to sign with Denver. You seem to think people don't make business decisions out of emotion. That's simply not the case. NFL players, more than is apparent in any other sport, constantly make emotional decisions. CHJ made one. Melvin Gordon made one. Antonio Brown made one. Leveon Bell made one. Tom Brady made one. It happens every off season.
    All it takes to win is doing whatever it takes to win: COMMITMENT

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Letswinplz77 View Post
    What are you talking about, specifically? What is fan fiction? Lindsay's reaction to the Broncos not drafting him? Him saying "F the Broncos"? Him wanting a new contract? No man, he has admitted all of this. He's quoted as saying those things. It's not fan fiction, it's what happened. He ONLY chose the Broncos because his mother and his agent talked him into it. Even his siblings were telling him not to sign with Denver. You seem to think people don't make business decisions out of emotion. That's simply not the case. NFL players, more than is apparent in any other sport, constantly make emotional decisions. CHJ made one. Melvin Gordon made one. Antonio Brown made one. Leveon Bell made one. Tom Brady made one. It happens every off season.
    The thought that he would hold out. The thought that he would hold it against the Broncos that they don't re-sign him now. The thought that he would become a problem in the locker room. The thought that he might prefer to leave if not taken care of sooner rather than later. Many conclusions that are being thought up which are worse case scenarios.

    You are holding onto a small quote from an interview that was done and kind of stretching it out to be more than it probably was, and assuming it was more than a passing comment. If Lindsay wants to make an emotional decision out of this in the situation where he does feel hurt, like you think he might, then those examples you just listed might be great examples of why making the decision based on ego and emotion is not a smart choice.

    Chris Harris turned down a 3 year 36 milion dollar deal to go and get 2 years and 20 million dollars. Melvin Gordon held out half a season after turning down a deal which would of gave him 10 million annually, he is getting 8 from Denver for just 2 years. Le''Veon Bell turned down a 5 year 70 million dollar deal and instead then signed a 4 year 53 million dollar deal. I wont even talk about how it's worked out for the biggest fool of our generation Antonio Brown, and Tom Brady is a little different, he left on good terms. So yeah, maybe Phillip needs a good adviser, and maybe his new teammate can be that person to discourage trying to make power moves from a position of vulnerability.

  9. #84
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    Not to mention the buyers remorse with Gurley, Anderson, and Bell,s teams have after giving those huge contracts,,,

    RB,s have to put their heads down and take what they get these days!
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  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by EddieMac View Post
    Not to mention the buyers remorse with Gurley, Anderson, and Bell,s teams have after giving those huge contracts,,,

    RB,s have to put their heads down and take what they get these days!
    Let's not forget Devonte Freeman. After a huge 2016 he signed the largest contract for a running back in the NFL, at that time. That 5 year 42 million dollar contract resulted in just over 1500 yards in the next 3 seasons, and the team was willing to take a 6 million dollar cap hit this year to cut him loose. Guys at the running back position just don't hold up for very long into their second contracts, and having Lindsay be elsewhere getting paid in 2022 and beyond might just end up fitting the criteria for the old adage, "better to let a player go a year early, than a year too late".

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    The thought that he would hold out. The thought that he would hold it against the Broncos that they don't re-sign him now. The thought that he would become a problem in the locker room. The thought that he might prefer to leave if not taken care of sooner rather than later. Many conclusions that are being thought up which are worse case scenarios.

    You are holding onto a small quote from an interview that was done and kind of stretching it out to be more than it probably was, and assuming it was more than a passing comment. If Lindsay wants to make an emotional decision out of this in the situation where he does feel hurt, like you think he might, then those examples you just listed might be great examples of why making the decision based on ego and emotion is not a smart choice.

    Chris Harris turned down a 3 year 36 milion dollar deal to go and get 2 years and 20 million dollars. Melvin Gordon held out half a season after turning down a deal which would of gave him 10 million annually, he is getting 8 from Denver for just 2 years. Le''Veon Bell turned down a 5 year 70 million dollar deal and instead then signed a 4 year 53 million dollar deal. I wont even talk about how it's worked out for the biggest fool of our generation Antonio Brown, and Tom Brady is a little different, he left on good terms. So yeah, maybe Phillip needs a good adviser, and maybe his new teammate can be that person to discourage trying to make power moves from a position of vulnerability.
    I'm not saying he would be making a good decision, I'm just saying it happens all the time. And it wasn't just a passing comment, he's told anyone who will listen that getting passed up in the draft, ESPECIALLY by his hometown team, pissed him off. Did Brady ever let go of his anger for going 199? Umm, no.

    There ARE some dudes who put respect before money. Wouldn't shock me at all if Lindsay is one of those dudes. And right now, there's no real way to argue that the Broncos are showing him any respect. I understand Elway is doing what he thinks makes the team better, and not trying to disrespect Lindsay. But it's possible to do both at the same time.
    All it takes to win is doing whatever it takes to win: COMMITMENT

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Letswinplz77 View Post
    I'm not saying he would be making a good decision, I'm just saying it happens all the time. And it wasn't just a passing comment, he's told anyone who will listen that getting passed up in the draft, ESPECIALLY by his hometown team, pissed him off. Did Brady ever let go of his anger for going 199? Umm, no.

    There ARE some dudes who put respect before money. Wouldn't shock me at all if Lindsay is one of those dudes. And right now, there's no real way to argue that the Broncos are showing him any respect. I understand Elway is doing what he thinks makes the team better, and not trying to disrespect Lindsay. But it's possible to do both at the same time.
    I know, and it does, and if it does, I am just saying as a fan of the team first, we sit nicely in terms of having the upper hand, by a long way. Also, I actually watched a video the other day where Brady was saying he doesn't even think about it anymore, and that was a fairly old video. Lindsay said that, but if he is going to hold onto that to the point where he puts money over everything, and in a way where he has no control, have fun not getting what you want.

    See one could argue that I think. The Broncos yeah, didn't draft Lindsay, boo hoo, no one else did either, grow up Phillip if he is holding onto that. If he cannot place the opportunity he has gotten here above this, then he might just be on his way to becoming a little ego manic. Anyway, I don't know why I am acting like I am talking to Lindsay, I am talking to fans who are stretching a small quote out to a worse case scenario and putting words in a mans mouth beyond the initial comment. This situation has a long way to go before anything negative happens. No man 2 years into a rookie deal has any ground even amongst his peers to complain about money.

  13. #88
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    I really like Phillip Lindsay but I think he's going to be part of the trade for us to get Isaiah Simmons.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by nas1 View Post
    I really like Phillip Lindsay but I think he's going to be part of the trade for us to get Isaiah Simmons.
    You think so? I don't think the team has any interest in Simmons at all, but I do see them trading up.

  15. #90
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    Yes, I do. The Broncos have a history of giving free agent running backs 1 year deals, Melvin Gordon got 2 years.

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