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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrady12 View Post
    Sorry, but your Denver public school education isn't helping.

    1. You aren't using "And" as a coordinating conjunction but as an example, which is why you have it in quotation marks.

    "And, but, and or are the three most common members of a group of words known as coordinating conjunctions. The question about whether itís grammatical to begin a sentence with and, but, or or is actually the question of whether itís grammatical to begin a sentence with a coordinating conjunction. Hereís what some of the big usage guides say on the matter. The one that seems to get quoted the most is the Chicago Manual of Style, which says:

    There is a widespread beliefóone with no historical or grammatical foundationóthat it is an error to begin a sentence with a conjunction such as and, but or so. In fact, a substantial percentage (often as many as 10 percent) of the sentences in first-rate writing begin with conjunctions. It has been so for centuries, and even the most conservative grammarians have followed this practice."

    https://www.quickanddirtytips.com/ed...-a-conjunction

    2. Benchwarmer can be used as one word

    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/benchwarmer

    If you prefer to be called a "couchwarmer" or "seatwarmer," I can make the change.

    Now back to the discussion on Drew Lock, the next Tim Tebow!
    You had to Google all of this and copy and paste?! BUAHAHAHA!!!

    You were wrong in your usage. Just move along Tool child!!

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stackhouser View Post
    Really good analysis...... NOT.......Only opinion from a nobody former bench warmer, J.T. O'SULLIVAN!!! I think I like the analysis from HOF players or coaches more than Mr. O'Sullivan!! The best part of that video is the comments!!! LOL

    And this is after 3 weeks of team practice and his second start!!!! BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
    Arguments from authority are weak, and people only choose which former players opinion they agree with when they spout this crap. It was a very good analysis and accurate in regards to outside of probably 2 or so quarters, and a handful of plays here and there, Lock wasn't anything special in his starts. I appreciate that breakdown from a knowledgeable quarterback who has been coached by the worlds best, and been around the worlds best, you have to, it's ignorant not to. Show me a Hall of Fame player or coach who broke it down on a micro level like this and said otherwise ? Macro, broad comments are everywhere, but I don't think you could argue any point made in that video intelligently.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    Arguments from authority are weak, and people only choose which former players opinion they agree with when they spout this crap. It was a very good analysis and accurate in regards to outside of probably 2 or so quarters, and a handful of plays here and there, Lock wasn't anything special in his starts. I appreciate that breakdown from a knowledgeable quarterback who has been coached by the worlds best, and been around the worlds best, you have to, it's ignorant not to. Show me a Hall of Fame player or coach who broke it down on a micro level like this and said otherwise ? Macro, broad comments are everywhere, but I don't think you could argue any point made in that video intelligently.
    That's your opinion brother, I dont agree.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stackhouser View Post
    That's your opinion brother, I dont agree.
    Another detailed, well argued point on your behalf to support the non-sense you spoke, expected

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnlimburg View Post
    Another detailed, well argued point on your behalf to support the non-sense you spoke, expected
    How can you take an opinion based topic and think it's the WORD OF GOD??? There were so many things that were incorrect in his breakdown. I don't agree, and to state someone is ignorant to not agree with some former nobody QB making statements about another player, and to push it as the foundation of some factual substance is weak. I don't agree with his points and just because you do, you want to come at me? TB12 M.O..... FYI, my "non-sense" is a feather ruffling for a Troll in these boards......... Ah, I get it...... Hey everyone, johnlimburg is another personality of TB12!!!!! Get over yourself, this IS the smack section!!



    J.T. O'SULLIVAN - The Quarterback Whisperer

    One man on a mission to maybe someday have a valued seat at the table with an official sporting news desk, not just an unheard of YouTube channel...... With his detailed analytic facts on the suckage of Drew Lock and other players who have only played in one game. He will surely one day reach that pedestal. In the meantime, lets just sit back and take his word as GOLD!!!! - johnlimbrady12
    Last edited by Stackhouser; 04-20-2020 at 06:49 AM.

  6. #51
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    I prefer to listen to someone that knows a little something about the QB position and IS one of the worlds best coaches and has been around a lot longer..... I trust Jon Gruden over O'Sullivan.



    As part of the North team's roster at the Senior Bowl, Lock worked with the Raiders' coaching staff throughout the week. Speaking with Denver media on Thursday, Raiders head coach Jon Gruden said Lock impressed him at that time particularly with how he carried himself as a leader.

    "He's just a likable guy, number one," Gruden said. "I think he's a very confident, likable young man with talent. He's got a lot of charisma about him. I think the players like him and I think the players enjoy playing for him because he's got some natural leadership, and he has fun playing. It's a really good prospect to have, no doubt."

    In a video on the Raiders' website, Gruden further discussed how they worked together and how he and his staff tried to get a sense for Lock's acumen.

    "[He's] a very talented kid. ... Came down to Mobile, and our coaching staff — Greg Olson, our coordinator, [and] Tom Cable, our line coach — we put a lot of plays in to try to see what Daniel Jones, of the New York Giants, and [Ryan] Finley, who's with the Bengals, and Drew Lock could do. And he was impressive."


    Lock, who was the North team's starting quarterback at the Senior Bowl, completed 9-of-14 passes for 57 yards in the game against other college players.

    Looking back at that week and Lock's time at Missouri, Gruden said the young quarterback's experience playing in different schemes has helped him transition to the NFL.

    "I'm sure it did," Gruden said. "He played for [University of Missouri Offensive Coordinator] Derek Dooley, who was with the Dallas Cowboys as a receivers coach, so some of the principles that they ran at Missouri are principles that are recognizable in the NFL. He's not a novice by any stretch. He played for a lot of different coaches — coordinators, I should say — and he got results in every system that he was put in. Heck, I got a chance to coach him in the Senior Bowl and he ran our stuff pretty darn good, too."

    As he's watched Lock lead the Broncos to a 3-1 record as their starting quarterback, the former quarterback guru for ESPN said Lock's progress has been promising for the Broncos.

    "Obviously, you see arm talent and you see a young quarterback that is gaining confidence in the system," Gruden said. "He's being asked to do more and more every week. He shows very good athleticism. His touch and his accuracy have been impressive. He's got our attention, no doubt. He's been impressive."


    In the video with the Raiders, Gruden went a bit further as he breaks down tape of Lock, starting with his 309-yard, three-touchdown outing against the Texans.

    "He's got a lot of poise, he loves football and he's really taken advantage of his opportunity," Gruden said. "When you watch Lock play against the Houston Texans a couple weeks ago, my goodness. He puts 38 points on the board like that. And he did it with pocket accuracy."

    Even more than the arm talent, Gruden said he's really drawn to Lock's approach to the game.

    "I like guys that work at it, that love it and would play for nothing," Gruden said. "... [U]nfortunately, Denver's got one in Drew Lock. He's a good kid with a big upside, and he obviously can throw the ball from different platforms."

    Shortly after that, Gruden watched a snap in which Lock threw a perfect pass on the run from a bootleg play against the Lions.


    "This is an impressive throw right here," Gruden said. "I'm starting to get a little nervous."

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stackhouser View Post
    I prefer to listen to someone that knows a little something about the QB position and IS one of the worlds best coaches and has been around a lot longer..... I trust Jon Gruden over O'Sullivan.



    As part of the North team's roster at the Senior Bowl, Lock worked with the Raiders' coaching staff throughout the week. Speaking with Denver media on Thursday, Raiders head coach Jon Gruden said Lock impressed him at that time particularly with how he carried himself as a leader.

    "He's just a likable guy, number one," Gruden said. "I think he's a very confident, likable young man with talent. He's got a lot of charisma about him. I think the players like him and I think the players enjoy playing for him because he's got some natural leadership, and he has fun playing. It's a really good prospect to have, no doubt."

    In a video on the Raiders' website, Gruden further discussed how they worked together and how he and his staff tried to get a sense for Lock's acumen.

    "[He's] a very talented kid. ... Came down to Mobile, and our coaching staff — Greg Olson, our coordinator, [and] Tom Cable, our line coach — we put a lot of plays in to try to see what Daniel Jones, of the New York Giants, and [Ryan] Finley, who's with the Bengals, and Drew Lock could do. And he was impressive."


    Lock, who was the North team's starting quarterback at the Senior Bowl, completed 9-of-14 passes for 57 yards in the game against other college players.

    Looking back at that week and Lock's time at Missouri, Gruden said the young quarterback's experience playing in different schemes has helped him transition to the NFL.

    "I'm sure it did," Gruden said. "He played for [University of Missouri Offensive Coordinator] Derek Dooley, who was with the Dallas Cowboys as a receivers coach, so some of the principles that they ran at Missouri are principles that are recognizable in the NFL. He's not a novice by any stretch. He played for a lot of different coaches — coordinators, I should say — and he got results in every system that he was put in. Heck, I got a chance to coach him in the Senior Bowl and he ran our stuff pretty darn good, too."

    As he's watched Lock lead the Broncos to a 3-1 record as their starting quarterback, the former quarterback guru for ESPN said Lock's progress has been promising for the Broncos.

    "Obviously, you see arm talent and you see a young quarterback that is gaining confidence in the system," Gruden said. "He's being asked to do more and more every week. He shows very good athleticism. His touch and his accuracy have been impressive. He's got our attention, no doubt. He's been impressive."


    In the video with the Raiders, Gruden went a bit further as he breaks down tape of Lock, starting with his 309-yard, three-touchdown outing against the Texans.

    "He's got a lot of poise, he loves football and he's really taken advantage of his opportunity," Gruden said. "When you watch Lock play against the Houston Texans a couple weeks ago, my goodness. He puts 38 points on the board like that. And he did it with pocket accuracy."

    Even more than the arm talent, Gruden said he's really drawn to Lock's approach to the game.

    "I like guys that work at it, that love it and would play for nothing," Gruden said. "... [U]nfortunately, Denver's got one in Drew Lock. He's a good kid with a big upside, and he obviously can throw the ball from different platforms."

    Shortly after that, Gruden watched a snap in which Lock threw a perfect pass on the run from a bootleg play against the Lions.


    "This is an impressive throw right here," Gruden said. "I'm starting to get a little nervous."
    Then why didn't Gruden draft Lock? There's a reason the kid wasn't drafted until the second round...not that he's going to be a bad QB but because there are some question marks with him. And you're discounting JT O'Sullivan simply because he wasn't a good NFL QB? How about QB guru Jordan Palmer who has worked with Deshaun Watson, Joe Burrow, Josh Allen, and Sam Darnold, among others? He says the Pats have a star in Stidham...but I guess his opinion is irrelevant because he was a washed up NFL QB, right?
    Super Bowl Wins: Brady - 6 Elway - 2 Manning - 2 (played well in none and took HGH)

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrady12 View Post
    Then why didn't Gruden draft Lock? There's a reason the kid wasn't drafted until the second round...not that he's going to be a bad QB but because there are some question marks with him. And you're discounting JT O'Sullivan simply because he wasn't a good NFL QB? How about QB guru Jordan Palmer who has worked with Deshaun Watson, Joe Burrow, Josh Allen, and Sam Darnold, among others? He says the Pats have a star in Stidham...but I guess his opinion is irrelevant because he was a washed up NFL QB, right?
    Why didn't Gruden draft Lock? With that kind of thinking should I ask why isn't O'Sullivan a NFL Scout, QB coach, OC, or even a Head Coach already? Lock wasn't wrapped in a Gold cloth and expected to be the anointed one.... I'm sure there were plenty of reasons Gruden didn't draft him such as; positions needed, planning on running with Carr, etc... That's a dumb question. As for O'Sullivan, it has nothing to do with his QB play. I'm just saying that I'd put my faith in people that have been involved with developing QB's rather than some QB long shot in the league that has an unknown YouTube channel.

    Where in this whole discussion did we turn to Stidham and Palmer?? Did he give any analysis on Lock? No? Then why did you even bring that up? Just for the record, I think Stidham looked decent in the Pre-season, but that doesn't mean he's the next Brady. He needs more reps. I think you'll get to see that very soon.
    Last edited by Stackhouser; 04-21-2020 at 06:22 AM.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stackhouser View Post
    Why didn't Gruden draft Lock? With that kind of thinking should I ask why isn't O'Sullivan a NFL Scout, QB coach, OC, or even a Head Coach already? Lock wasn't wrapped in a Gold cloth and expected to be the anointed one.... I'm sure there were plenty of reasons Gruden didn't draft him such as; positions needed, planning on running with Carr, etc... That's a dumb question. As for O'Sullivan, it has nothing to do with his QB play. I'm just saying that I'd put my faith in people that have been involved with developing QB's rather than some QB long shot in the league that has an unknown YouTube channel.

    Where in this whole discussion did we turn to Stidham and Palmer?? Did he give any analysis on Lock? No? Then why did you even bring that up? Just for the record, I think Stidham looked decent in the Pre-season, but that doesn't mean he's the next Brady. He needs more reps. I think you'll get to see that very soon.
    Gruden's word is not gospel. He hasn't won a super bowl since 2002, and that was with a team built by Tony Dungy. And Jordan Palmer did work with both Drew Lock and Stidham. He called Stidham a future star.

    https://theathletic.com/1657865/2020...jordan-palmer/
    Super Bowl Wins: Brady - 6 Elway - 2 Manning - 2 (played well in none and took HGH)

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrady12 View Post
    Gruden's word is not gospel. He hasn't won a super bowl since 2002, and that was with a team built by Tony Dungy. And Jordan Palmer did work with both Drew Lock and Stidham. He called Stidham a future star.

    https://theathletic.com/1657865/2020...jordan-palmer/
    Where did I say Gruden's word was gospel? I would still take Gruden's word over O'Sullivan and I would have to guess that wouldn't be argued by many.

    That's a great article........... About Stidham!!! Where is the info on Lock??

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrady12 View Post
    Gruden's word is not gospel. He hasn't won a super bowl since 2002, and that was with a team built by Tony Dungy. And Jordan Palmer did work with both Drew Lock and Stidham. He called Stidham a future star.

    https://theathletic.com/1657865/2020...jordan-palmer/
    Ah, here we go....

    Former NFL quarterback Jordan Palmer, who worked with Lock leading up to the draft, described Lock the same way the Broncos see him now.

    “The raw tools are there," Palmer said in one of the episodes. “It’s just the level of consistency ... he’s got what it takes."

    Palmer says Lock’s arm is “elite.”

    “Everybody else is mobile or immobile,” he continued. “Drew is on the top end of mobile.”

    That's about all he says. He does have a pre-draft podcast from last year, but I didn't pull it up.



    So..... I just found this huge write up and it was talking about Tom House and Jordan Palmer as the QB "Guru's". This one was about the evolution of Drew Lock and the payoff of him working with Palmer. here is the best part of the write up....

    Broncos fans, sit down. You’ll need to be seated when I say this. Elway, got one right!

    In summation: I was right in saying that 2017 Drew Lock deserved an early 2nd round grade. I was right in saying that Drew Lock would be a capable starting QB if he reverted back to 2017 form. I was right in saying that 2018 Drew Lock had to scrap 2018.

    And

    I never saw this coming. Not at all. They took a guy who had a great base in 2017. Screwed him up royally in 2018. Took a hammer to him, shattered him into pieces, and put them back together perfectly in 2019. The concerns I had about him busting due to mechanical overhauls are gone. The fears that he wouldn’t return to 2017 form are gone. He’s everything he was in 2017 and then some.

    Denver, you have a franchise starting QB. He’s now capable of being one of the top 16 QBs in the league. Turns out, you stole him in the draft and if I could rewrite the 2019 NFL Draft, this Drew Lock would grade higher than Daniel Jones and Josh Allen from 2017. They both went top 7 even though I had them in the early 20s. Send your X-mas cards, blessings and well wishes to Jordan Palmer because this outcome just doesn’t happen. Bronco’s fans should also hope that this transformation is due to Lock’s work with Palmer. If it is not, teams inside the NFL will know and you’ll be looking for a new OC in 2020. The consultant or coach who helped this transition take place has earned a big feather in their cap. Again, this outcome is rare and it doesn’t just happen.

    Drew Lock is a unicorn and this unicorn is for real.
    Last edited by Stackhouser; 04-21-2020 at 12:16 PM.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stackhouser View Post
    Ah, here we go....

    Former NFL quarterback Jordan Palmer, who worked with Lock leading up to the draft, described Lock the same way the Broncos see him now.

    “The raw tools are there," Palmer said in one of the episodes. “It’s just the level of consistency ... he’s got what it takes."

    Palmer says Lock’s arm is “elite.”

    “Everybody else is mobile or immobile,” he continued. “Drew is on the top end of mobile.”

    That's about all he says. He does have a pre-draft podcast from last year, but I didn't pull it up.



    So..... I just found this huge write up and it was talking about Tom House and Jordan Palmer as the QB "Guru's". This one was about the evolution of Drew Lock and the payoff of him working with Palmer. here is the best part of the write up....

    Broncos fans, sit down. You’ll need to be seated when I say this. Elway, got one right!

    In summation: I was right in saying that 2017 Drew Lock deserved an early 2nd round grade. I was right in saying that Drew Lock would be a capable starting QB if he reverted back to 2017 form. I was right in saying that 2018 Drew Lock had to scrap 2018.

    And

    I never saw this coming. Not at all. They took a guy who had a great base in 2017. Screwed him up royally in 2018. Took a hammer to him, shattered him into pieces, and put them back together perfectly in 2019. The concerns I had about him busting due to mechanical overhauls are gone. The fears that he wouldn’t return to 2017 form are gone. He’s everything he was in 2017 and then some.

    Denver, you have a franchise starting QB. He’s now capable of being one of the top 16 QBs in the league. Turns out, you stole him in the draft and if I could rewrite the 2019 NFL Draft, this Drew Lock would grade higher than Daniel Jones and Josh Allen from 2017. They both went top 7 even though I had them in the early 20s. Send your X-mas cards, blessings and well wishes to Jordan Palmer because this outcome just doesn’t happen. Bronco’s fans should also hope that this transformation is due to Lock’s work with Palmer. If it is not, teams inside the NFL will know and you’ll be looking for a new OC in 2020. The consultant or coach who helped this transition take place has earned a big feather in their cap. Again, this outcome is rare and it doesn’t just happen.

    Drew Lock is a unicorn and this unicorn is for real.
    Well, Daniel Jeremiah thinks Stidham has the best arm talent out of anyone in last year's draft as well as Tua from this year's draft...

    https://www.patriots.com/video/jerem...ybody-in-draft
    Super Bowl Wins: Brady - 6 Elway - 2 Manning - 2 (played well in none and took HGH)

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrady12 View Post
    Well, Daniel Jeremiah thinks Stidham has the best arm talent out of anyone in last year's draft as well as Tua from this year's draft...

    https://www.patriots.com/video/jerem...ybody-in-draft
    I'm still not sure why this has taken a turn to Stidham??? We were talking about Lock....... Also, Daniel Jeremiah??? Really??? LOL

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrady12 View Post
    Well, Daniel Jeremiah thinks Stidham has the best arm talent out of anyone in last year's draft as well as Tua from this year's draft...

    https://www.patriots.com/video/jerem...ybody-in-draft
    So Daniel Jetemiahs opinion is the only one that matters?

    You sure are making an effort to find artices and base your argument off of others but you canít do it yourself.

    In the back of your pea I know you realize that Lock will be a franchise player sometime in the near future.

    How about you do your own research and tell us why YOU believe Stidhams arm is better and donít give me this ďhe has a funny side arm passĒ crap.

    I bet you cant do it, Iím pretty sure you canít because you donít have the capacity to do so.
    Last edited by Sam_Z; 04-22-2020 at 08:09 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam_Z View Post
    So Daniel Jetemiahs opinion is the only one that matters?

    You sure are making an effort to find artices and base your argument off of others but you can’t do it yourself.

    In the back of your pea I know you realize that Lock will be a franchise player sometime in the near future.

    How about you do your own research and tell us why YOU believe Stidhams arm is better and don’t give me this “he has a funny side arm pass” crap.

    I bet you cant do it, I’m pretty sure you can’t because you don’t have the capacity to do so.
    Because I never claimed that Stidham's arm is better than Lock's? I'm just reporting what an expert is saying. I'm just going to wait and see how good Stidham is going to be. As for Lock, I cannot come to a conclusion that he is going to be a franchise player with the limited games he's played in. Maybe he will, maybe he won't. All I know his mechanics need some work.
    Last edited by TommyBrady12; 04-22-2020 at 08:16 AM.
    Super Bowl Wins: Brady - 6 Elway - 2 Manning - 2 (played well in none and took HGH)

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