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Thread: McJayGate

  1. #1
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    McJayGate

    https://1043thefan.com/category/podc...Clough+Podcast

    Interesting historical dive into the whole drama-filled fiasco that was "McJayGate". It talks about the firing of Mike Shanahan and then what led to Jay Cutler ultimately demanding a trade from the Broncos, and the key parties' roles in everything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mojo0730 View Post
    https://1043thefan.com/category/podc...Clough+Podcast

    Interesting historical dive into the whole drama-filled fiasco that was "McJayGate". It talks about the firing of Mike Shanahan and then what led to Jay Cutler ultimately demanding a trade from the Broncos, and the key parties' roles in everything.
    Jake vs Jay, Jay vs Cassel, Jay vs Orton, Orton vs Tebow, Tebow vs Orton/Quinn\



    ....crazy time

    Hooray, beer!

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    Quote Originally Posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    Jake vs Jay, Jay vs Cassel, Jay vs Orton, Orton vs Tebow, Tebow vs Orton/Quinn\



    ....crazy time
    It most definitely was a roller coaster 3 seasons. I'm not sure if Cutler was ever meant to be a special quarterback but I still think he could have been at least a very good one had him and McDaniels had been able to work things out. It might have ended up better for both of them if they had at least tried. But I guess we'll never know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mojo0730 View Post
    It most definitely was a roller coaster 3 seasons. I'm not sure if Cutler was ever meant to be a special quarterback but I still think he could have been at least a very good one had him and McDaniels had been able to work things out. It might have ended up better for both of them if they had at least tried. But I guess we'll never know.
    Cutler had work ethic issues and loved to party he would never have been elite unless he actually dedicated him self to the game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyousukeneko View Post
    Cutler had work ethic issues and loved to party he would never have been elite unless he actually dedicated him self to the game.
    Cutler had some much potential crazy great arm, great deep ball, accurate passer, he threw such a great ball in tight windows but like you said lazy work ethic and not a good teammate to be around couldnít lead his team anywhere at any point no playoffs to show. Cutler was a huge waste of potential itís sad he ever lived up to it he had the ability too just the mental aspect of it nor the leadership.
    Last edited by Chillez; 05-13-2020 at 10:36 PM.

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    Interesting to listen to this podcast, but it is just gossip, with no depth and no real reflection, no other perspectives.
    McDaniels admitted at the time that he was trying to acquire Cassel, and was told no. it is also well established that this story broke to the Boston Globe. It is also established that 3 teams tried to acquire Cassel and trade him to Denver for Cutler, and was told no from McDaniels and Xanders without involving Bowlen. The trade of Matt Cassel and Mike Vrabel to the Kansas City Chiefs for a second-round draft pick showed that McDaniels could reasonably have expected that Cassel was available for a 3rd-4th round pick, and that would have been a great challenge to Cutler in Denver, and there was and is no tangible evidence that Cutler would have been on the trading block, without loosing the job on merit.
    The gossip on Sheffler and BM, also neglects to "remember" that the captains of the 2009 Broncos asked to have them benched for the last game. McDaniels hit the perfect storm in 2010 - Cutler had his best year and so did Peyton Hillis, his 2010 draft was stellar, yet DT and Tebow were not factors until after McD was fired. We had a lot of "pretty" losses that year, and were not out of contention until week 12.
    McDaniels cleaned up the culture after Shanahan, where Champ Bailey has reported that the stars could go clubbing at night and were not required to show up on time.
    If we compare the 2Ĺ years of Jay starting in Denver to the few games that Tebow had, and their comparative early success, too little credit is given. Because Manning came in and the team changed direction, we don't know what could have been. Fox had success with Tebow in Denver and failure with Cutler in Chicago, so it ia not really a strong case for the projected success of Cutler in Denver.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyousukeneko View Post
    Cutler had work ethic issues and loved to party he would never have been elite unless he actually dedicated him self to the game.
    I don't know Jay personally so I'm not going to get into speculation or rumors regarding his personal life. I know Mike Shanahan and Lovie Smith thought highly of Jay's work ethic, for whatever that's worth.

    Regardless, I think Jay and Josh would have been in a much better position staying here working together, versus the situation both ultimately found themselves in. Jay got clobbered in Chicago with that porous offensive line and Josh had to rely on Kyle Orton, who was probably more aloof and disinterested than Jay ever was.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoFanDK View Post
    Interesting to listen to this podcast, but it is just gossip, with no depth and no real reflection, no other perspectives.
    McDaniels admitted at the time that he was trying to acquire Cassel, and was told no. it is also well established that this story broke to the Boston Globe. It is also established that 3 teams tried to acquire Cassel and trade him to Denver for Cutler, and was told no from McDaniels and Xanders without involving Bowlen. The trade of Matt Cassel and Mike Vrabel to the Kansas City Chiefs for a second-round draft pick showed that McDaniels could reasonably have expected that Cassel was available for a 3rd-4th round pick, and that would have been a great challenge to Cutler in Denver, and there was and is no tangible evidence that Cutler would have been on the trading block, without loosing the job on merit.
    The gossip on Sheffler and BM, also neglects to "remember" that the captains of the 2009 Broncos asked to have them benched for the last game. McDaniels hit the perfect storm in 2010 - Cutler had his best year and so did Peyton Hillis, his 2010 draft was stellar, yet DT and Tebow were not factors until after McD was fired. We had a lot of "pretty" losses that year, and were not out of contention until week 12.
    McDaniels cleaned up the culture after Shanahan, where Champ Bailey has reported that the stars could go clubbing at night and were not required to show up on time.
    If we compare the 2Ĺ years of Jay starting in Denver to the few games that Tebow had, and their comparative early success, too little credit is given. Because Manning came in and the team changed direction, we don't know what could have been. Fox had success with Tebow in Denver and failure with Cutler in Chicago, so it ia not really a strong case for the projected success of Cutler in Denver.
    Well, the stuff discussed by Mike Kliss most definitely isn't gossip because he was the only reporter both Jay and Josh was talking to. I don't think there's any disputing the following series of events:

    - Pat Bowlen and Jay Cutler had a conversation after Mike Shanahan was fired. Jay believed following this conversation that the offensive personnel would remain intact including offensive coordinator Jeremy Bates.

    - Josh McDaniels is hired and Jeremy Bates is no longer the offensive coordinator.

    - Jay Cutler has some meeting with Joe Ellis where Jay blows up regarding the firing of Jeremy Bates. There are conflicting reports as to whether Jay asked for a trade during this meeting (Broncos side states he did, whereas Jay's side states he didn't).

    - The meeting Jay and Joe had gets back to Josh, that latter of whom is alleged to have then gotten involved with Matt Cassel trade talks.

    - The trade talks between the Broncos and Patriots leak to Mike Kliss, who then reports it.

    - Josh denies the Broncos ever discussed trading for Cassel despite multiple, credible sources beginning to report otherwise including Mike Kliss, Peter King and Adam Schefter.

    - The story is then played out on a local and national level, with stories being "leaked" as well as responses from both camps (Broncos and Jay) being reported.

    - Josh attempts to set up a meeting with just Jay, but Jay refuses to have the meeting one-on-one so Jay's agent as well as Brian Xanders attend the meeting, which by all but Josh's account went very poorly, to the point that Jay told his agent to get him traded ASAP immediately following the meeting.

    - Jay refuses to respond to Josh's telephone calls or other correspondence. It is disputed as to whether Jay refused to respond to Pat Bowlen also (Pat stated he did, whereas Jay stated he didn't).

    - After two weeks or so of no contact with Jay the Broncos finally relent and place Jay on the trade block.

    - Jay and a 5th are traded to Chicago for 2 first rounders and Kyle Orton.

    This is more or less what was discussed in the podcast, so I'm not sure where you're going with it was all just gossip. Again, Mike Kliss was front-and-center during the whole ordeal so he is substantially more knowledgeable about what happened than probably anyone else.

  9. #9
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    McNuggets messed up.

    Jay probably could have succeeded in Denver.
    Negs are Cowardly Acts of Nonsense. I wonít Back Down.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by mojo0730 View Post
    Well, the stuff discussed by Mike Kliss most definitely isn't gossip because he was the only reporter both Jay and Josh was talking to. I don't think there's any disputing the following series of events:

    - Pat Bowlen and Jay Cutler had a conversation after Mike Shanahan was fired. Jay believed following this conversation that the offensive personnel would remain intact including offensive coordinator Jeremy Bates.

    - Josh McDaniels is hired and Jeremy Bates is no longer the offensive coordinator.

    - Jay Cutler has some meeting with Joe Ellis where Jay blows up regarding the firing of Jeremy Bates. There are conflicting reports as to whether Jay asked for a trade during this meeting (Broncos side states he did, whereas Jay's side states he didn't).

    - The meeting Jay and Joe had gets back to Josh, that latter of whom is alleged to have then gotten involved with Matt Cassel trade talks.

    - The trade talks between the Broncos and Patriots leak to Mike Kliss, who then reports it.

    - Josh denies the Broncos ever discussed trading for Cassel despite multiple, credible sources beginning to report otherwise including Mike Kliss, Peter King and Adam Schefter.

    - The story is then played out on a local and national level, with stories being "leaked" as well as responses from both camps (Broncos and Jay) being reported.

    - Josh attempts to set up a meeting with just Jay, but Jay refuses to have the meeting one-on-one so Jay's agent as well as Brian Xanders attend the meeting, which by all but Josh's account went very poorly, to the point that Jay told his agent to get him traded ASAP immediately following the meeting.

    - Jay refuses to respond to Josh's telephone calls or other correspondence. It is disputed as to whether Jay refused to respond to Pat Bowlen also (Pat stated he did, whereas Jay stated he didn't).

    - After two weeks or so of no contact with Jay the Broncos finally relent and place Jay on the trade block.

    - Jay and a 5th are traded to Chicago for 2 first rounders and Kyle Orton.

    This is more or less what was discussed in the podcast, so I'm not sure where you're going with it was all just gossip. Again, Mike Kliss was front-and-center during the whole ordeal so he is substantially more knowledgeable about what happened than probably anyone else.

    Well a large number of your "facts" are not such. While I agree with your former post that Jay and Josh could have worked well together.

    Broncos has never ever even insinuated that they promised Cutler any say in personnel matters - be it Jeremy Bates or others. That is only a claim that has come from Cutler.

    Mike Kliss did not break the story about McDaniels interest in Cassel, and there was absolutely nothing that Broncos (incl McDaniels) did before the meeting that made Cutler demand a trade, that ever indicated that Broncos were interested in trading Jay Cutler. It was the Boston Globe that broke the story of McDaniels inquiring about Cassel, and it was NOT the Broncos that had the Cassel for Cutler trade, but the Lions and two others.

    Adam Schefter is reporting that the Broncos were entertaining a three team deal that would have sent Matt Cassel to the Broncos and Jay Cutler to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers before Cassel was ultimately traded to the Kansas City Chiefs:

    While New England and Kansas City were agreeing to Saturday's trade of Cassel to the Chiefs for the draft's 34th overall pick, there were more teams in the mix. Detroit, Tampa and Denver were involved in trade talks of their own also tied to Cassel, according to sources in the respective NFL cities.

    Tampa approached Denver to try to make a three-way trade that would have sent Cassel to the Broncos and quarterback Jay Cutler to the Buccaneers. The Broncos entertained the notion and pondered it but ultimately decided against it.
    As for the Bowlen angle - Peter King says here that Bowlen had never in his time as an owner felt as disrespected as he did by Cutler - https://www.si.com/more-sports/2009/04/06/trade.

    As for what Cutler said he did, or wanted, we all know that he lied big time when explaining that he never wanted the trade that he had demanded.

  11. #11
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    Personally I am glad I didnít have to see Cutler in a Broncos uniform for another 8 years. Not only did he rub me the wrong way, but we would have never sniffed the superbowl
    Last edited by Al Wilson 4 Mayor; 05-14-2020 at 02:21 PM.

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    Losing your players is one thing, but your coaching staff too? McDaniels truly was a nightmare.

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    Jay was a maverick with the highest of highs and the lowest of lows but regardless of that, who in their right mind thought Cassell could be any better?

    Also it seems obvious from the outside of all this that Jay and McD were two young, headstrong personalities and that sooner or later a clash forcing one of them out was inevitable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GMTD View Post
    Jay was a maverick with the highest of highs and the lowest of lows but regardless of that, who in their right mind thought Cassell could be any better?

    Also it seems obvious from the outside of all this that Jay and McD were two young, headstrong personalities and that sooner or later a clash forcing one of them out was inevitable.
    Yes who would think that the QB that beat the other 41-7 and led an 11 win team, could possibly be better than a QB with a strong arm and and a loosing record. Who would think that it had an impact that our QB could not string wins together? As much arm talent as Jay had he could not win three in a row which is the minimum standard for winning a SB, and that against elite competition.

    Why is it that it does not seem to be the strong armed QBs that win the SB? Isn't Elway the last "strong armed QB" to win the SB?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoFanDK View Post
    Yes who would think that the QB that beat the other 41-7 and led an 11 win team, could possibly be better than a QB with a strong arm and and a loosing record. Who would think that it had an impact that our QB could not string wins together? As much arm talent as Jay had he could not win three in a row which is the minimum standard for winning a SB, and that against elite competition.

    Why is it that it does not seem to be the strong armed QBs that win the SB? Isn't Elway the last "strong armed QB" to win the SB?
    Russell Wilson, Big Ben, Flacco, and Mahomes all have/had great arms, but yes for the most part cerebral QBs seem to do better than talented QBs.

    According to the CHI media, Cutler was hated by his teammates his for at least two years & part of it was because they loved playing with Orton
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