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  1. #1
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    False Start/Off Sides Penalties

    Sorry Mods. Wasn't sure where to put this.

    I have been confused this entire season regarding false start penalties and today's playoff games are no exception.

    Teams line up for the snap and the line is moving around, bobbing their heads, pointing what ever and then snap the play goes forward.

    Or they sit there for several seconds and then snap the ball.

    What confuses me is the off sides that happened twice to the Patriots this game. Now we have seen this numorous times over the course of the season. A defensive player will jump off sides and get back where they belong before the snap. No Penalty.

    The Patriot player is a prime example of this today. He jumped across, got back and attempted to get back where he belonged before the snap of the ball. A Colt player jumps and it is Nuetral Zone Infraction. This happened twice today.

    I have seen players moving their heads, looking back and forth down the line and no penalty right up to the snap.

    Peyton is famous for his line antics with players moving around and to be fair the Patriots have done it too. The Bengals are also another team that did this over the course of the year.

    I guess I am just trying to say that this scenario has been one of the toughest for me to understand. Just when I think a false start penalty should be called, it isn't. Just when I think the defense has responded to a hard count by jumping across the line and they get back, they are called for making the offensive line move.
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  2. #2
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    I think because he caused the Offensive player to jump.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by P-NUT33
    I think because he caused the Offensive player to jump.
    There in lies the problem that I have. If the ball had been snapped, I agree. If not, then it is the offensive lines problem for responding to it and in the example of today's game, the offensive linesman was on the OPPOSITE SIDE.

    If the defensive player jumps across and the player he is facing moves, I understand the call. Especially if he touches him.

    But like I said, it wasn't just today. It was all season I saw penalties or non penalties across the league.

    This rule, like I said is the toughest one for me to understand.
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  4. #4
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    It's one of those grey area things because ones natural reaction when someone jumps at you is to defend yourself. The rule is tailored a little more toward the offensive linemen. You are right though in todays game the guy was on the other side of the line and jumped up just to secure the penalty. I think it's stupid. The rule was made though because d-linemen used to make their money jumping like that and getting back purely to try and get the O-linemen to move.
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  5. #5
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    the rule is, when an offensive down lineman get down in his stance and is set, he not supposed to move, however, here lately especially with the colts, their linemen are not penalized for movement(alot of movement), even if the play is an audible, the line men are not supposed to move.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrell30Davis
    the rule is, when an offensive down lineman get down in his stance and is set, he not supposed to move, however, here lately especially with the colts, their linemen are not penalized for movement(alot of movement), even if the play is an audible, the line men are not supposed to move.
    The Colts, Patriots and Bengals all did this all season long. They seem set but then they are all moving their heads. What really bothers me is when the QB lifts his leg like they are going to snap the ball. Then start changing the play. To me, once the QB lifts his leg like that, they are set and shouldn't be allowed to move. I REALLY don't like it when the QB moves forward to change the play.

    Many teams that don't use this philosophy get to the line and can be "set" for several seconds before the ball is snapped. If one moves, then all it would take is the QB to change the play and then they could all move around, or whatever, get reset and then hike the ball.

    I think I am having trouble explaining what I am saying but then again I think my point is clear.
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  7. #7
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    The rule is.............

    The rule is that that once the QB says set, the O-line cant move, but if the QB hasnt called set, thats were you will see the O-line pointing out and giving blocking assignments because the QB hasnt called for them to "set". Now if a D-lineman moves into the neatral zone (cross the line of scrimmage but doesnt touch the O-lineman) but the O-Lineman jumps up to pass/run block then that is called encroachment are neatral zone infraction because you cant mimic coming off the ball in order to make and O-lineman jump or move. Now on the other hand if a D-Lineman does this but doesnt cross the neatral zone or cross the line of scrimmage and the O-lineman moves then it s false start on the offense. It all depends on what the ref believes he saw. But a good center will usually make a D-lineman pay for this by snappign the ball soon as the Defender crosses the neatral zone/line of scrimmage in order to get a free play or the automatic 5 yards. These rules do have some loop holes though, it all depends on the ref.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrell30Davis
    the rule is, when an offensive down lineman get down in his stance and is set, he not supposed to move, however, here lately especially with the colts, their linemen are not penalized for movement(alot of movement), even if the play is an audible, the line men are not supposed to move.
    They may move as long as they arent "set", its all legal.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoManiac_69
    Sorry Mods. Wasn't sure where to put this.

    I have been confused this entire season regarding false start penalties and today's playoff games are no exception.

    Teams line up for the snap and the line is moving around, bobbing their heads, pointing what ever and then snap the play goes forward.

    Or they sit there for several seconds and then snap the ball.

    What confuses me is the off sides that happened twice to the Patriots this game. Now we have seen this numorous times over the course of the season. A defensive player will jump off sides and get back where they belong before the snap. No Penalty.

    The Patriot player is a prime example of this today. He jumped across, got back and attempted to get back where he belonged before the snap of the ball. A Colt player jumps and it is Nuetral Zone Infraction. This happened twice today.

    I have seen players moving their heads, looking back and forth down the line and no penalty right up to the snap.

    Peyton is famous for his line antics with players moving around and to be fair the Patriots have done it too. The Bengals are also another team that did this over the course of the year.

    I guess I am just trying to say that this scenario has been one of the toughest for me to understand. Just when I think a false start penalty should be called, it isn't. Just when I think the defense has responded to a hard count by jumping across the line and they get back, they are called for making the offensive line move.
    I fee ya, but once you actually understand this rule it all makes since. ive played football all my life and never really understood it (this rule) up until last year. I play DE and one game I tried to mimic like I was coming off the ball in order to make the O-line react , but little did I know i was the one that was wrong because as soon as I crossed the neutral zone/line of scrimmage he was allowed to do a "football move" as they say because I provoked him.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoneblock249
    I fee ya, but once you actually understand this rule it all makes since. ive played football all my life and never really understood it (this rule) up until last year. I play DE and one game I tried to mimic like I was coming off the ball in order to make the O-line react , but little did I know i was the one that was wrong because as soon as I crossed the neutral zone/line of scrimmage he was allowed to do a "football move" as they say because I provoked him.
    But defensive players jump and charge the line all the time and even go into the neutral zone, get back where they belong before the snap. No foul. #98 of the Colts had his hand on the ground in the neutral zone all the time and was never called.

    I just hate seeing teams get flagged on 3rd down when it didn't seem like it was a foul. I know and understand the rule but I am confused about the enforcement of it half the time.

    And like I said, this has bothered me for quite some time it just seemed to come into play more often this post season with all the teams.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoManiac_69
    But defensive players jump and charge the line all the time and even go into the neutral zone, get back where they belong before the snap. No foul. #98 of the Colts had his hand on the ground in the neutral zone all the time and was never called.

    I just hate seeing teams get flagged on 3rd down when it didn't seem like it was a foul. I know and understand the rule but I am confused about the enforcement of it half the time.

    And like I said, this has bothered me for quite some time it just seemed to come into play more often this post season with all the teams.
    Thats hard part about those calls, if the defensive players attempts to get back onsides, the ref may feel, "he wasnt trying to provoke the Offensive player" but then you may have a ref who feels "he was trying to provoke him" Its one of those crazy rules with a billion loop holes in it. sometimes they can go either way and then sometimes they will call them. I just feel the refs should know what to look for and try not to let these things contribute to the outcome of a great game. I really hate the holding calls on guys who have knwo chance of making the play and the refs throw out the flags on a LB whos 30 yards away from a guy who is about 5 yards from scoring, I mean come on.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoneblock249
    Thats hard part about those calls, if the defensive players attempts to get back onsides, the ref may feel, "he wasnt trying to provoke the Offensive player" but then you may have a ref who feels "he was trying to provoke him" Its one of those crazy rules with a billion loop holes in it. sometimes they can go either way and then sometimes they will call them. I just feel the refs should know what to look for and try not to let these things contribute to the outcome of a great game. I really hate the holding calls on guys who have knwo chance of making the play and the refs throw out the flags on a LB whos 30 yards away from a guy who is about 5 yards from scoring, I mean come on.
    I agree with the calling fouls so far from the play, but a lot of times the holding is pre-pass, and not during the actual run, just like illegal contact instead of PI... So if the player is holding pre-pass and the play ends up going to the other side it looks like a call that didn't really effect the play, but in reality the play hadn't fully developed when the flag was thrown.

    As far as jumping off sides, I agree they aren't always trying to get provoke o-linemen to jump into a falsestart, but they at least have a back door to get back onside pre-snap...IMO if a dlineman breaks the LOS and an olineman reacts it should always be on the defense. It's a safety net for your QB too.. b/c if you just snap the ball and wait on refs to react their is always the chance which i have seen a few times of a linemen getting a free shot on your QB. Who would hate to see Cutler go down for the season on a play like that. I think it's been engrained not to snap the ball to avoid just that, and take your chance with a lineman jumping or running the play from a normal count.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoManiac_69
    Sorry Mods. Wasn't sure where to put this.

    I have been confused this entire season regarding false start penalties and today's playoff games are no exception.

    Teams line up for the snap and the line is moving around, bobbing their heads, pointing what ever and then snap the play goes forward.

    Or they sit there for several seconds and then snap the ball.

    What confuses me is the off sides that happened twice to the Patriots this game. Now we have seen this numorous times over the course of the season. A defensive player will jump off sides and get back where they belong before the snap. No Penalty.

    The Patriot player is a prime example of this today. He jumped across, got back and attempted to get back where he belonged before the snap of the ball. A Colt player jumps and it is Nuetral Zone Infraction. This happened twice today.

    I have seen players moving their heads, looking back and forth down the line and no penalty right up to the snap.

    Peyton is famous for his line antics with players moving around and to be fair the Patriots have done it too. The Bengals are also another team that did this over the course of the year.

    I guess I am just trying to say that this scenario has been one of the toughest for me to understand. Just when I think a false start penalty should be called, it isn't. Just when I think the defense has responded to a hard count by jumping across the line and they get back, they are called for making the offensive line move.

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    sbutk: i can see why Denver is taking TO's right now [trailing by 7, with 30 seconds left in the half]. but why Oakland???

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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoManiac_69
    But defensive players jump and charge the line all the time and even go into the neutral zone, get back where they belong before the snap. No foul. #98 of the Colts had his hand on the ground in the neutral zone all the time and was never called.

    I just hate seeing teams get flagged on 3rd down when it didn't seem like it was a foul. I know and understand the rule but I am confused about the enforcement of it half the time.

    And like I said, this has bothered me for quite some time it just seemed to come into play more often this post season with all the teams.


    By Zoneblock249's explanation, I can't understand why the O-line wouldn't so much as intentially move a muscle in such a case, thus drawing an encroachment penatly.


    Now if a D-lineman moves into the neatral zone (cross the line of scrimmage but doesnt touch the O-lineman) but the O-Lineman jumps up to pass/run block then that is called encroachment

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    They're your teammates, now.
    Best of luck, TT!
    ...Always a class act - in any uniform.



    sbutk: i can see why Denver is taking TO's right now [trailing by 7, with 30 seconds left in the half]. but why Oakland???

    Captain Lori: You are trying to figure out the Raiders. Try figuring out women instead; it's probably much easier.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbutk
    By Zoneblock249's explanation, I can't understand why the O-line wouldn't so much as intentially move a muscle in such a case, thus drawing an encroachment penatly.





    The main reason is because the refs in most cases are bias against the O-linemen with this call so 85% of the time you'll see the Offense get called for it, thats why they never try to move when the defense initiate. I can understand how everone feels. Its pretty much up to the refs in most cases.

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