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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by KyLewin
    So Tomlinson has "WASTED" the last six years of his career? Elway "WASTED" the first 13 years of his career? Marino "WASTED" his entire career (if you really think that he'd trade all of those records and be content to be a moderate or even average QB that won the Big One, you're insane... if he felt that winning the SB was the most important thing, he would have been playing for league minimum his last few years so the team could get some talent!)?

    You live in a Madden-induced dream land where your team can win the SB every year. That's not reality. While every team "shots" for the SB at the beginning of the year, most recognize that they don't have the experience, the pieces, or the skills to win the SB. They play every game hard, the young guys learn, the old guys teach and go about their jobs, and the middle level guys do their thing to win games, but they don't go home at the end of another "wasted" season and wonder if suicide woud be a better option than another wasted year of getting beat up on the football field. They're probably no more upset than a high school athlete whose team didn't take state that year. It sucks, but in a few days you're over it and enjoying your time off.

    Fans like you are what's wrong with this team. The Broncos are a very good team, but in 41 chances they have only won TWO SBs. That's a "non-wasted season" percentage of 4.87% We "waste" almost twenty seasons for every ONE SB win. Pretty sad if all those seasons are "wasted"...

    As for the actual POINT of this thread: Best of Luck Tatum. I hope Detroit is a good fit for you.

    Boy was that a rant! You have heard it time and time again: Anything less than a Super Bowl win is unacceptable. Losers always whine about doing their best.

    You are taking "wasted" out of context. I don't mean like milk left in the fridge too long. Of course they get something out of just playing, of course many millions of dollars makes it easier to take, but no player worth his salt would be content with just playing for 15 years and not winning a SB. Obviously not winning the SB is not as good as winning the SB. Every player who has ever retired without winning a SB thinks to himself " I wish I could have won a SB"


    But if it will make you all feel better I will change "Wasted Season" to "Goals were not met Season" Because hopefully every players goal is to win the Super Bowl Every Year.

    Yeah, Marino Would rather have a SB Ring than 60,000 yards passing. I would rather be a good QB with a Ring than a Great QB without one. Who wouldn't?

    If a GM or Head coach fields a team that he does not think has a legitimate shot at the SB then someone is not doing their job.

    Any player that goes into camp with the mentality "that they don't have the experience, the pieces, or the skills to win the SB " Is a player that hopefully will never play for the Broncos.

    Why do you think some players don't want to play for certain teams? Or some players win their SB Ring then move on to go for the big Bucks somewhere else?

    Why do players and fans always say "There's always next year?" Next year for what? To win 10 games and lose in the playoffs? No, next year to win the Super Bowl. If you are content with 9 wins or a one and done in the playoffs then you have been a happy camper for several years.

    And I don't play Madden. EA Sucks. And THAT'S a Rant.
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  2. #32
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    alot of our players are on record as saying they felt they wasted an opportunity by washing out in the playoffs with what they felt was a superbowl caliber team.

    At the same time though they also have stated that they had alot of positives to take from the season.

    i think it's only natural to feel that anything short of a superbowl win is a failure or a waste but at the same time you can find positives in any season that you can carry on for the future, if not you'd probably just feel like killing yourself.

  3. #33
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    Cool Tatum Bell

    I don't think it was anyone's intent to bash Tatum Bell.....Personally I think it would be very difficult to deal with a tragic loss of a friend.....I hope the change will serve him well, and I wish him the very best in his future in the NFL. I'm sure he will prove to be an asset wherever he plays. I hope that Javon Walker can work through this tragedy, as well.

    Broncomaniac PG
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  4. #34
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    To be fair, the thread's title is very ambiguous.

    Tatum and Darrent were close, it is always extremely tough to lose a buddy.
    I really do think more than anything Tatum wants to "be the man" somewhere.
    Detroit isn't that place though, I would be happy for him if he wound up in NY.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    Boy was that a rant! You have heard it time and time again: Anything less than a Super Bowl win is unacceptable. Losers always whine about doing their best.

    You are taking "wasted" out of context. I don't mean like milk left in the fridge too long. Of course they get something out of just playing, of course many millions of dollars makes it easier to take, but no player worth his salt would be content with just playing for 15 years and not winning a SB. Obviously not winning the SB is not as good as winning the SB. Every player who has ever retired without winning a SB thinks to himself " I wish I could have won a SB"


    But if it will make you all feel better I will change "Wasted Season" to "Goals were not met Season" Because hopefully every players goal is to win the Super Bowl Every Year.

    Yeah, Marino Would rather have a SB Ring than 60,000 yards passing. I would rather be a good QB with a Ring than a Great QB without one. Who wouldn't?

    If a GM or Head coach fields a team that he does not think has a legitimate shot at the SB then someone is not doing their job.

    Any player that goes into camp with the mentality "that they don't have the experience, the pieces, or the skills to win the SB " Is a player that hopefully will never play for the Broncos.

    Why do you think some players don't want to play for certain teams? Or some players win their SB Ring then move on to go for the big Bucks somewhere else?

    Why do players and fans always say "There's always next year?" Next year for what? To win 10 games and lose in the playoffs? No, next year to win the Super Bowl. If you are content with 9 wins or a one and done in the playoffs then you have been a happy camper for several years.

    And I don't play Madden. EA Sucks. And THAT'S a Rant.
    Ok so let me get this right only 54 players and there coaches meet their goal every year correct? So for all 31 other teams in the NFL I guess they should donate their money to charity or something. By your logic the Broncos are practically at the same level at the Raiders and every other bottom feeder team. Are you sure your even a fan of football?

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  6. #36
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    I didn't know Tatum was leaving, this is sad. The way things are going it's going to be a completly different team when all is said and done. Hopefully he finds happiness wherever he goes.
    [COLOR=Green]Help save the Planet, Plant some trees!!![/COLOR]



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  7. #37
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    While every thing in this conversation is grossly :offtopic: I just can't resist replying, probably because I've been hearing this same talk from so many other people on this board for so long.

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    Boy was that a rant! You have heard it time and time again: Anything less than a Super Bowl win is unacceptable. Losers always whine about doing their best.
    You're right, it was a rant. Frankly, I'm sick of this "Super Bowl or Bust" talk. Yes, every team shoots for the SB in a general manner, but most understand at the beginning of the year that they are not fielding a championship caliber team... sometimes they are rebuilding, bringing in young talent that will hopefully develope into pieces of a championship team, sometimes they just have too many injuries or holes in their squad. Regardless, most teams know about how far they can expect to make it (think the Raiders were talking about the SB last year? Or the 49ers? Or the Titans? I'm guessing not).

    As for 'losers' always whining about doing their best... I hope that you are perfect at everything you do, never failing to get the highest score on a test, or complete your job in a way that excedes your bosses expectations. Other wise, you're a loser. Frankly, not everyone can be "the best" or it wouldn't be called "the best." That doesn't mean that every other person is a loser.

    Your kind of talk is what makes people not want to try. If doing your best isn't good enough (assuming that your best doesn't take you to the highest echilons of whatever you're doing) then what's the point of doing anything?

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    You are taking "wasted" out of context. I don't mean like milk left in the fridge too long. Of course they get something out of just playing, of course many millions of dollars makes it easier to take, but no player worth his salt would be content with just playing for 15 years and not winning a SB. Obviously not winning the SB is not as good as winning the SB. Every player who has ever retired without winning a SB thinks to himself " I wish I could have won a SB"
    You meant wasted as in "a wasted opportunity, a blown chance, a failure," correct? Then I didn't take it out of context. LT, Marino, Elway for all but the last two years of his career, all have blown their chance(s), failed, and/or missed their opportunity to win the big one (outside of Elway's last two years). How is that out of context? Yes, most players wish they could have won a SB, but do they think of their careers as failures? as a series of blown chances? as wasted opportunities? Probably not. Again, if these guys are so hung up on winning a SB, they'd take enormous pay cuts to get there. Marino wasn't making league minimum in his quest to win the big one, LT isn't making league minimum, and Elway wasn't either. Yes, they wanted it, but obviously not as much as they wanted to get paid. Heck, Elway mostly just got lucky that his team picked up some little known 6th round draft pick RB who just happened to fit perfectly in to the system and was a beast capable of 2,000 yard seasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    But if it will make you all feel better I will change "Wasted Season" to "Goals were not met Season" Because hopefully every players goal is to win the Super Bowl Every Year.
    Again, is every player on every team saying, "our goal is the SB, anything less is unsatisfactory"? I don't believe that and if you do, you're naive at best, but probably just dilusional. These playes don't have any illusions about what it takes to get to the SB, they also don't have rose colored glasses on when looking at the level of talent around them. They know, as do their coaches, if they have a championship caliber team around them or not... and most do not. So, if they don't have a championship caliber team around them, what's the point of playing out the season? They aren't going to win the SB and anything less is "not meeting their goals," "wasting their season," or being a "loser" so why bother?

    Guess they've all just taken one to many blows to the head... because there are about 1,674 losers out there (and that's just the ones on the active rosters) and most of them know it.

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    Yeah, Marino Would rather have a SB Ring than 60,000 yards passing. I would rather be a good QB with a Ring than a Great QB without one. Who wouldn't?
    No, he wouldn't. He would have rather had a SB and 60,000 yards passing, but if you said "hey Dan, you can have that SB ring, but you're only allowed about 20,000 yards passing and won't get into the HoF" I bet he'd turn you down. Maybe I'm wrong and his heart is pure, but if he really wanted to win one, he would have taken a huge pay cut in those last few years in order to get some SB quality talent on the team. If I recall correctly, Marino didn't even like it when Jimmy Johnson tried to install a run first offensive mentality. He wanted to win a SB, but he wanted it to be HIM that won the SB, not someone else.

    And your good with a ring vs. great without is a poor option. Try "so-so" or "average" or "not that good" with a ring vs. great without one. I bet most NFL players wouldn't accept that trade.

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    If a GM or Head coach fields a team that he does not think has a legitimate shot at the SB then someone is not doing their job.

    Any player that goes into camp with the mentality "that they don't have the experience, the pieces, or the skills to win the SB " Is a player that hopefully will never play for the Broncos.
    Too bad, there's probably about 25 of them on the team right now. You think Cutler has the skills and experience to win the SB already? You think Mike Bell does? How about Veal? Foxworth? Paymah? Chris Myers? Preston Parsons? Should I go on? The fact is that on any team there are a number of players who are just too young, too inexperienced, and/or too poor of players to win a SB. Sometimes you have enough players who have the right stuff to overcome any holes in your roster, but often times you don't.

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    Why do you think some players don't want to play for certain teams? Or some players win their SB Ring then move on to go for the big Bucks somewhere else?
    If that's the case, then every FA should be telling their agents, "I'll play for the Colts, the Chargers, the Patriots, the Bears, or the Seahawks, but no one else... I don't care what contract I get, one year for $50,000 is enough so long as I get my ring?" Teams who were "close" to making it to or winning the SB would be cleaning up during FA because everyone would be lining up to play for them while the Raiders, Texans, etc. would only be getting the left over players or those who had already gotten their ring (of course that begs to ask why are those guys not wanting to win another, have their goals changed?) The best teams would only get better while the worse teams would just get worse... I don't see that in this league. If it's a choice between $50,000 more and playing for a horrible team vs. a perenial SB contender, they might take that little pay cut (while still making multiple millions of dollars), but much more than that and they chase the dollar signs.

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    Why do players and fans always say "There's always next year?" Next year for what? To win 10 games and lose in the playoffs? No, next year to win the Super Bowl. If you are content with 9 wins or a one and done in the playoffs then you have been a happy camper for several years.
    Did the Raiders say there's always next year? I've always taken that to mean that there's always next year to build on the success you had the year before. If that means getting to the SB and maybe even winning it, great. But for the majority of teams, that means fielding a better team that wins more games than the year before, or making the playoffs, or winning a playoff game. Only for very few does that actually mean winning the SB.

    I have been a happy camper for the majority of the last few years. Yes, I'm always disappointed when the team ultimately loses - as are the players, no doubt - but I (and, I assume, they) understand that the team can't "always" or even "usually" win the SB and the fact that they didn't win it all doesn't leave me thinking that the team was a disappointment. I've been quite proud of the way this team has shown that they are winners year in and year out. To be perfectly honest, I've been disappointed at the end of every season for as long as I've been a fan because the season is over and I can't watch them play anymore.

    Guess I'm just a loser whining about the team doing their best with no other expectation than for this team to play well and compete, who also realizes that winning the SB every year is a fools dream (no one's ever even won it three years in a row, why should we expect them to win it "every year"?).

    Quote Originally Posted by ohyeah
    And I don't play Madden. EA Sucks. And THAT'S a Rant.
    Too bad, if you'd been a big Madden fan, at least you would have had an excuse for expecting the team to win the SB every year (and feeling that doing their best is what losers whine about).

    Well, with no real elite RB, the tragic losses we've experienced this year already, and the tight cap situation that keeps us from making many FA moves, I'm looking forward to another year of "failing to meet goals" once this off season is over. At least there will be 30 other teams of losers to mourn our failures with us...

  8. #38
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    Cool two faced fans

    Quote Originally Posted by vicious2500
    I swear we DENVER BRONCO FANS are so two faced at the beginning of the year you were swinging from tatums nuts about how he'd have 1,500 yards rushing. A half season later your running the him through the ground. You guys don't appreciate anything you really don't.
    I don't see what was two faced about the fans concerning Tatum Bell. I think most people with any analytical skills knew he wasn't the next Wallter Peyton. and was mediocre at best. As I said in a previous post.... I don't think it is anyone's goal to bash Tatum Bell.....hopefully he will do well at Detroit....Lord knows the Lions need all the help they can get. I just don't think that he was a Denver quality RB.

    Broncomaniac PG
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by KyLewin
    While every thing in this conversation is grossly :offtopic: I just can't resist replying, probably because I've been hearing this same talk from so many other people on this board for so long.

    You're right, it was a rant. Frankly, I'm sick of this "Super Bowl or Bust" talk. Yes, every team shoots for the SB in a general manner, but most understand at the beginning of the year that they are not fielding a championship caliber team... sometimes they are rebuilding, bringing in young talent that will hopefully develope into pieces of a championship team, sometimes they just have too many injuries or holes in their squad. Regardless, most teams know about how far they can expect to make it (think the Raiders were talking about the SB last year? Orthe 49ers? Or the Titans? I'm guessing not).

    As for 'losers' always whining about doing their best... I hope that you are perfect at everything you do, never failing to get the highest score on a test, or complete your job in a way that excedes your bosses expectations. Other wise, you're a loser. Frankly, not everyone can be "the best" or it wouldn't be called "the best." That doesn't mean that every other person is a loser.

    Your kind of talk is what makes people not want to try. If doing your best isn't good enough (assuming that your best doesn't take you to the highest echilons of whatever you're doing) then what's the point of doing anything?

    You meant wasted as in "a wasted opportunity, a blown chance, a failure," correct? Then I didn't take it out of context. LT, Marino, Elway for all but the last two years of his career, all have blown their chance(s), failed, and/or missed their opportunity to win the big one (outside of Elway's last two years). How is that out of context? Yes, most players wish they could have won a SB, but do they think of their careers as failures? as a series of blown chances? as wasted opportunities? Probably not. Again, if these guys are so hung up on winning a SB, they'd take enormous pay cuts to get there. Marino wasn't making league minimum in his quest to win the big one, LT isn't making league minimum, and Elway wasn't either. Yes, they wanted it, but obviously not as much as they wanted to get paid. Heck, Elway mostly just got lucky that his team picked up some little known 6th round draft pick RB who just happened to fit perfectly in to the system and was a beast capable of 2,000 yard seasons.

    Again, is every player on every team saying, "our goal is the SB, anything less is unsatisfactory"? I don't believe that and if you do, you're naive at best, but probably just dilusional. These playes don't have any illusions about what it takes to get to the SB, they also don't have rose colored glasses on when looking at the level of talent around them. They know, as do their coaches, if they have a championship caliber team around them or not... and most do not. So, if they don't have a championship caliber team around them, what's the point of playing out the season? They aren't going to win the SB and anything less is "not meeting their goals," "wasting their season," or being a "loser" so why bother?

    Guess they've all just taken one to many blows to the head... because there are about 1,674 losers out there (and that's just the ones on the active rosters) and most of them know it.

    No, he wouldn't. He would have rather had a SB and 60,000 yards passing, but if you said "hey Dan, you can have that SB ring, but you're only allowed about 20,000 yards passing and won't get into the HoF" I bet he'd turn you down. Maybe I'm wrong and his heart is pure, but if he really wanted to win one, he would have taken a huge pay cut in those last few years in order to get some SB quality talent on the team. If I recall correctly, Marino didn't even like it when Jimmy Johnson tried to install a run first offensive mentality. He wanted to win a SB, but he wanted it to be HIM that won the SB, not someone else.

    And your good with a ring vs. great without is a poor option. Try "so-so" or "average" or "not that good" with a ring vs. great without one. I bet most NFL players wouldn't accept that trade.



    Too bad, there's probably about 25 of them on the team right now. You think Cutler has the skills and experience to win the SB already? You think Mike Bell does? How about Veal? Foxworth? Paymah? Chris Myers? Preston Parsons? Should I go on? The fact is that on any team there are a number of players who are just too young, too inexperienced, and/or too poor of players to win a SB. Sometimes you have enough players who have the right stuff to overcome any holes in your roster, but often times you don't.



    If that's the case, then every FA should be telling their agents, "I'll play for the Colts, the Chargers, the Patriots, the Bears, or the Seahawks, but no one else... I don't care what contract I get, one year for $50,000 is enough so long as I get my ring?" Teams who were "close" to making it to or winning the SB would be cleaning up during FA because everyone would be lining up to play for them while the Raiders, Texans, etc. would only be getting the left over players or those who had already gotten their ring (of course that begs to ask why are those guys not wanting to win another, have their goals changed?) The best teams would only get better while the worse teams would just get worse... I don't see that in this league. If it's a choice between $50,000 more and playing for a horrible team vs. a perenial SB contender, they might take that little pay cut (while still making multiple millions of dollars), but much more than that and they chase the dollar signs.



    Did the Raiders say there's always next year? I've always taken that to mean that there's always next year to build on the success you had the year before. If that means getting to the SB and maybe even winning it, great. But for the majority of teams, that means fielding a better team that wins more games than the year before, or making the playoffs, or winning a playoff game. Only for very few does that actually mean winning the SB.

    I have been a happy camper for the majority of the last few years. Yes, I'm always disappointed when the team ultimately loses - as are the players, no doubt - but I (and, I assume, they) understand that the team can't "always" or even "usually" win the SB and the fact that they didn't win it all doesn't leave me thinking that the team was a disappointment. I've been quite proud of the way this team has shown that they are winners year in and year out. To be perfectly honest, I've been disappointed at the end of every season for as long as I've been a fan because the season is over and I can't watch them play anymore.

    Guess I'm just a loser whining about the team doing their best with no other expectation than for this team to play well and compete, who also realizes that winning the SB every year is a fools dream (no one's ever even won it three years in a row, why should we expect them to win it "every year"?).



    Too bad, if you'd been a big Madden fan, at least you would have had an excuse for expecting the team to win the SB every year (and feeling that doing their best is what losers whine about).

    Well, with no real elite RB, the tragic losses we've experienced this year already, and the tight cap situation that keeps us from making many FA moves, I'm looking forward to another year of "failing to meet goals" once this off season is over. At least there will be 30 other teams of losers to mourn our failures with us...

    I can't believe you said every team shoots for the SB in a "General manner"

    That clinches it....You are a loser. No team goes into the season with less than a Super Bowl Championship on their mind. Thank God you are not the decision maker for the Denver Broncos.

    If you are going into this season not looking forward to a SB Championship then you can get off this bandwagon and start riding the Silver and Black express. You obviously have never played a team sport. If you did, I'm sure you were ridiculed about that "We did our best" speech. That is a losers mantra and you know it, but whatever helps you sleep at night.


    "Oh well, at least we competed" "We did our best" You need to save that crap for Pop Warner. You are a cowardly kind of fan. Afraid to expect more from the team you root for because you might be letdown. As it stands, you feel great about the season every year because a SB doesn't really mean that much as long as they are competitive. Ask Rod Smith if he expects to go to the Super Bowl this year.

    "We did our best" is what keeps the Arizona Cardinal warm and fuzzy at night.

    What you are saying is you are happy as long as they are playing it doesn't really matter if they win or not. That is a sad existence.


    And about Marino....If he would not give back 40,000 of his passing yards AND the Hall of Fame, than that right there is reason enough why he didn't win the SB in the first place. If individual stats and personal accolades mean more to you than a Super Bowl Ring, then more power to you. He can go down in history as the SECOND best player drafted in 1983.



    I don't care what "Most Teams" do, The Denver Broncos don't rebuild. They field what they think is a Super Bowl team EVERY Year. Where have you been?

    Get on the team and come on in for the big win!

    You said Elway just "Got Lucky" that they picked up a little known 6th round draft pick....That is an insult to the Greatest QB to ever play the game. You are a Raider Fan (or Cleveland) in disguise. And a poor one at that.


    To play well and compete...compete for what exactly? The best record for non playoff teams? AAGGGHHH! What a Loser!!!
    Last edited by GeneralSterlingPrice; 03-06-2007 at 09:13 PM.
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